Senate
11 July 1923

9^th Parliament · 2^nd Session

PAPERS
QUESTION
- MIDLAND RAILWAY COMPANY
QUESTION
- TYPEWRITERS AND SILENCERS
QUESTION
- CURE FOR DIABETES
QUESTION
- EIDMAN-MAYOH CASE
NORTHERN TERRITORY ORDINANCE
LEAVE OF ABSENCE
NORTHERN TERRITORYCROWN LANDS BILL
QUESTION
- GOVERNOR-GENERAL’S SPEECH: ADDRESS-IN-REPLY
ADJOURNMENT
- Bird of Paradise Plumage

The President (Senator the Hon. T. Givens) took the chair at 3 p.m., and read prayers.

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PAPERS

The following papers were presented. -

Northern Territory Election, 1922- Chief Electoral Officer’s comments in reply to certain allegations by Mr. H. G. Nelson, M.P.

Territory for Seat of Government - Ordinance No. 5 of 1923- Recreation Land Leases.

Typewriters and Silencers imported into the . several States - Particulars as to value and Customs duty collected.

Naval Defence Act - Regulations amended - StatutoryRules 1923, No. 81.

Public Works Committee Act- Eighth General Report.

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QUESTION

MIDLAND RAILWAY COMPANY

Senator NEEDHAM:
WESTERN AUSTRALIA

-Can the Leader of the Senateyet reply to the questions which I asked last week with reference to the Midland Railway Company?

Senator PEARCE:
Minister of Home and Territories · WESTERN AUSTRALIA · NAT

– On 5th inst. the honorable senator asked the following questions -

Has the Midland Railway Company, Western Australia, paid all land taxes levied under the Land Tax Act 1910?
If not, what is the amount of arrears out standing, and what are the years to which they apply?
If there are outstanding arrears of unpaid taxes, have legal proceedings been instituted to recover same!

The Treasurer (Dr. Earle. Page) has furnished the. f ollowing replies -

No;
£3,188 - part of the tax for the financial year 1922-23.
Legal proceedings have not been insti tuted; the company has been granted an extension of timeor payment of this tax to a future date.

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QUESTION

TYPEWRITERS AND SILENCERS

Senator GRANT:
NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– I ask the Minister representing the Minister for Tradeand Customs if he is in a position to reply to the question which I askedon 5th July in regard to the importation of typewriters and silencers into the States and the rate and amount of duty paid ineach case?

Senator WILSON:
Honorary Minister · SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

– I am now able to furnish the honorable senator with the following information : - 1, 2, and 3 -

The; foregoing figures do not include silencers theimportationof which is notrecorded separately in the statistics:

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QUESTION

CURE FOR DIABETES

Senator DUNCAN:
NEW SOUTH WALES

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Health,. upon notice -

Has the attentionof the Minister for Health been directed to the discovery of insulin, stated to be a cursfor diabetes, by a Canadian scientist?
Has the Commonwealth taken any steps’ to investigate this reportedcure, and, if so, what steps have been taken?
Can the Minister say whetherit is a fact, is reported in The DailyGuardian, Sydney, thatinsulin is now being; manufactured at the Commonwealth Serum Laboratories?
If it is a fact, what progress has been made in this direction, and when wilt the serum.be made available to the public ?

Senator WILSON:
NAT

– The answer is as fallows-: - 1.Yes. 2: Fall information has been obtained concerning this preparation

Supplies arenow being manufactured at the Commonwealth Serum Laboratories.
The initial difficulties ofproduction are rapidly toeing overcome. Some insulinhas already been made available to the medical profession. The serum will not, at anytime; be made available to the public, but will be made: available to themedical profession in increasing quantities from now onwards as the facilities for its controlled administration become available.

COMMONWEALTH BANK.

Senator GRANT:
NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

asked the. Minister representing the Treasurer,upon native -

Is the Minister aware whether the rate of interest paid by the Savings Bank Branch of the Commonwealth. Bank is at least½ per cent. less than that paidby the local branches of. the State’ Savings Bank.?
If so, will he take the necessary steps, in fairness to the progressof theCommonwealth Storings Bank, tosuggest to the Bankauthorities that the interest paid to depositors should equal that paid bythe State Savings Banks?

Senator PEARCE:
NAT

– The Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page) has supplied the following replies : -

Generally speaking, the rate paid by the Commonwealth ‘Bank on deposits up to £500 is½ per cent less than that paid by the State Savings Banks.
Parliament has by Act directed thai) the management of the Bank shall befree from political control, and the Government is therefore not in a position to make the suggestion indicated.

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QUESTION

EIDMAN-MAYOH CASE

Senator GLASGOW:
for Senator FOLL

asked the Minister for Home and Territories, upon notice -

What is the present position of the case between the Crown and Kidman and Mayoh regarding an award made by the High Court of Australia in favour ofthe Crown?

Senator PEARCE:
NAT

– The reply is as follows: -

The application of the Commonwealth for leave to enforce the award isstill pending in the Supreme Court of New South Wales.

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NORTHERN TERRITORY ORDINANCE

Senator GARDINER:
NEW SOUTH WALES

– I desire, by leave, to withdraw my notice of motion -

That Ordinance No.7 of 1923, relating to Crown Lands in the Northern Territory, be disallowed, as the Leader of the Government in the Senate (Senator Pearce) has informed me that an Order-in-Council has been made suspending its operation and that there will be full opportunity for debate before effect is given to it.

Leave granted; notice of motion withdrawn.

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LEAVE OF ABSENCE

Motion (by Senator Gardiner) agreed to -

That two months leave of absencebe granted to Senator Foster on account of ill health.

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NORTHERN TERRITORYCROWN LANDS BILL

Motion (by Senator Pearce) agreed to-

That leave be given to introduce a Bill for an Act relating to Crown Lands in the Northern Territory of Australia.

Bill presented by Senator Pearce, and read a first time.

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QUESTION

GOVERNOR-GENERAL’S SPEECH: ADDRESS-IN-REPLY

Debate resumed from 6th July(vide page 788), on motion by Senator guthrie -

That the following Address-in-Reply to His Excellency the Governor-General’s Opening Speech be agreed to: -

MAY it Please Your Excellency -

We, the Senate of the Commonwealth of Australia, in Parliament assembled, desire to express our loyalty to our Most Gracious Sovereign, and to thank Your Excellency for the Speech which you have been pleased to address to Parliament.

Senator LYNCH:
Western Australia

– When I last had the opportunity of addressing the Senate on the occasion provided by a motion for the adoption of the Address-in-Reply, I directed attention to what I considered we should do in order to place our finances on a proper basis. I directed: attention to the big interest bill to be paid annually on our war debt, amounting to something in the neighbourhood of £17,000,000. Whatever may be done for the reduction of this war debt, by means of a sinking fund or otherwise, the interest bill must continue as a constant drain on the resources of Australia, necessarily cutting inter our power to develop the country. And if we do not develop the country our position will be dangerous, and even perilous. We can provide the money necessary to meet the interest on our war debt of some £350,000,000 only by increasing productivity, and we can increase productivity by adopting a series of policies to which. I was proceeding to draw attention when the Senate adjourned on Friday. I first referred to the necessity of stopping all forms of waste, both public and private. That would help materially. I next referred to the necessity of cutting out of our industrial life all unnecessary holidays. That is to say, we should not idle our time away. I also referred to the chance of securing, some very much needed revenue from a tax on luxurious living. The war is past and gone, and the only thing that stands out as an asset; against the huge expenditure of valuable lives and treasure blown away on the battlefields of Europe is the glorious liberty we enjoy. I refer to luxurious living in the shape of eating and drinking and excessive raiment. The social enjoyment now indulged in almost reminds one of the days of Babylon. The Government could help to meet the interest bill on the war debt by putting a tax of, say, 10 per cent. on all forms of luxurious living. When the Tariff was under consideration in this Chamber I tried to have heavier imposts placed on all articles that were not absolutely necessary to those who lead normal lives. I wanted to have heavier imposts on all useless, vicious, and abnormal forms of expenditure - that is to say, on luxuries. There could be for a start a tax on the excessive cost of luxurious eating and drinking - for instance, on the choice wines which are imported. Then, again, in regard to raiment; look. at the excess to which even young persons in Australia are addicted. Choice dresses are worn, the prices of which I believe range from £8 to £12 each. Some may be even more costly.

Senator Duncan:

– They cannot be obtained for the prices which the honorable senator has mentioned.

Senator LYNCH:

– That is quite possible. We should have a simpler form of living. If people will persist in living on a luxurious scale, the only remedy is for the Government to place a handicap on them by the imposition of a tax such as I have suggested. I was referring to another form of waste in the field of industry - the loss of time occasioned by men going on strike. I prefer to call things by their proper titles. This loss is brought about by men needlessly going on strike in a country where there ought not to be a single day wasted from this cause. The Tear-Book shows that the loss occasioned through strikes during last year and the preceding year averaged £1,000,000 a year. This loss, which can never be regained, was brought about simply because men sat down and challenged, in the first place, their employers, and in the second place, society. This was done at a cost to Australia of £1,000,000 a year during these two years, which of the last eight years show the lowest losses in this respect. There is no need for such a loss in a country where the one thing that stands between an unfeeling employer - and he still exists, and is sometimes recruited from the ranks of labour - and his employees is a tribunal which fixes a fair day’s wage. I referred, also, to a greater form of wastage in the shape of unperformed labour commonly known as the “ go-slow “ policy. I do not propose to speak of the why and wherefore of this insidious element which has crept into the industrial life of this country during the last few years. There was a time when it was unknown here, and when the Australian workman stood at the very apex of superiority as a worker.

Senator Gardiner:

– He is a better man to-day than he ever was.

Senator LYNCH:

– He may be in his own imagination, but, judged by results he is not. He would be a better man if he would “ deliver the goods,” and, indeed, now that he has had a fair day’s wage fixed by an independent tribunal,- it is his duty to give a fair day’s work. He is probably getting more than his employer would give him of his own free will, but the employer is made to give a fair day’s wage, whereas there’ is no law to compel the employee to give a fair day’s work. What is happening in Australia is shown in a most unobtrusive way in the Commonwealth Year-Booh. This publication, which is known all over the world, and, has an international reputation, reveals a development in the industrial arena of Australia which is nothing short of disheartening. It is certainly nothing to be proud of, and the state of affairs revealed should cause the average Australian who takes a pride in his country to feel ashamed.

Senator Gardiner:

– Nonsense!

– Supposing by some act of necromancy we were to wake up one morning and find the present system changed to that existing in Russia - where industries would be governed by so many commissioners- what would be the position ? What would be the effect of an undiluted form of communistic rule in Australia ? We must ask ourselves what the worker would get out of his industry. That is the point. It is no use making speeches to tickle the ears of the groundlings. It is very seldom that the average man likes to- be told of his shortcomings, but this at times is necessary. In a case of bodily infirmity, when a person is reduced to a bed of sickness, the invalid knows that he is not able to take the part of a man. Medicine is prescribed which, of course, is not relished by the patient. No one will take medicine from, choice, but when necessary it is taken without complaint; because, nauseous though it may be, it will yield bodily benefit. This applies in a moral sense. A man on occasions needs good medicine for his moral benefit. A foolish doctor might prescribe palatable but ineffective medicine for a patient through fear of giving offence, and consequently the patient would be fortunate if he did not die. But the wise doctor would make a proper diagnosis and prescribe suitable medicine to restore the patient to his full vigour. Men shrink from performing unpleasant tasks. When we find ourselves surrounded by a number of workers, all of whom have votes, we tell them everything that is favorable to them. At the same time we should not shrink from telling them what they ought to do. If we insist upon their obtaining what is due to them, we should at the same time tell them what is expected of them. In 1915 a wealth census was taken on the authority of the Labour

Government, which I then supported. We have .been told that if the income derived from all forms of investment were distributed amongst the operatives, they would be much better off. It is asserted that those who are designated capitalists are so much of a handicap upon industry, and -so much of an objectionable element in the industrial field that they must be got rid of. It will be remembered that Mr. Piddington was commissioned by Mr. Hughes to ascertain the basic wage that ought to be paid in Australia. Mr. Piddington is a doctrinaire. I do not think that doctrinaires are of any use to this or any other country. Such men derive satisfaction from telling other people what to do and how to do it, yet they do not do anything themselves. I doubt whether this or any other free country benefits one iota from having a doctrinaire directing its affairs. We want a practical man who will stand up and say, “ This is what I have done ; yOU do likewise.” This doctrinaire fixed a minimum wage of £5 16s. to be paid by the industries “ of the Commonwealth to married men. A greater insult to the intelligence of the people of the Commonwealth was never perpetrated. Mr. Hughes asked to be furnished with information as to how it could be applied. When the figures were analyzed it was found that it could not be done. All that time was spent in going round the country and collecting figures which were of no value. Arising out of this recommendation Mr. Knibbs was asked to supply certain particulars. He did so in his Bulletin for March, 1919, and in a supplementary report which he tendered at the time for the use of Parliament and of the public. It was shown that, if the incomes derived by people in receipt of £6 per week and over were distributed amongst those who were in receipt of a less income, the addition per week to the income of the latter would be as follows : -

(Extension of time granted.) How would the £3 a week man fare if everybody had to throw his income into a common pool ? The increase would be as follows : -

I direct attention specially to the last figure, because at the age of twenty-one years a man is beginning to think about taking on the responsibilities of keeping a wife and family. Is it worth while breaking up our social order and putting the Labour party’s objective into full operation for the sake of an extra 10s. 5d. per week?

It was shown further in this bulletin that if all estates of a value of £5,000 and upwards were divided amongst the people the additional wealth so obtained by them- would be as follows: -

I contend that £5,000 is not an impossible amount for even a workman in this country to save. I know men who, by their savings and by judicious investment, have made very nearly that amount during their working lifetime. If all the so-called capitalists and men of money had to disgorge their wealth the maximum addition it would make to the wealth of persons twenty-one years of age and over would be £139 ls. lid.

Senator Hoare:

– The honorable senator knows perfectly well that that is not what we are asking for; we want equal distribution.

Senator LYNCH:

– This is an equal distribution. Mention has been made of the coal-mining industry. I have often referred to that industry in the Senate. The men in New South Wales are on strike at the present time. I see no justification whatever for their action. Those men have dictated their own terms in the past. I hare seen reports which state that men on the New South Wales fields earn up to £2 a day. The tri bunals which have been appointed by the Commonwealth Government gave the men all that they wanted; they were in the happy position of being able to dictate their own terms, yet they are out on strike again. I have figures showing that if the whole of the profits made in the industry -were distributed among the men engaged in it, there would be added to their wages not more than £1 a week.

Senator McDougall:

– That would do for John Brown, would it not ?

Senator LYNCH:

– I ask Senator McDougall - who, I believe, is a fair man - whether he thinks that if the coalmining industry in New South Wales were nationalized, and the coal-miners haddistributed among them the whole of the profits made, the miners engaged in the metalliferous mining industry - many of whom earn as low as 15s. a day - would stand silently by and agree to it? I d> not think that they would. These men produce a commodity which is the basis of all industry. They “ are holding up our industries, and at the same time are sending letters to the men engaged in the metalliferous mining industry, addressing them as “ comrades.” Their troubles about our railways or our steamships or factories, so long as they, and they alone, can get what they are after! What do they care about the wives of the miners on the gold-fields of Western Australia, who are prevented from having a trip by sea or rail because of the excessive freights and fares charged by. reason of the high price of coal? Their idea of comradeship is to help themselves to as much as they possibly can, and let their fellow employees in the industrial field “go hang.” I conceive comradeship to signify a sense of fellowship, a readiness and willingness to share equally with one’s fellow employees in the industrial field, not to rob them on every occasion - which is what the miners in New South Wales have done, and are doing. I can see no justice in one set of men getting £2 a day and another set of men, who are going to their deaths *at a much faster rate, getting only 15s. a day. I describe it as positive inequity. And it must not be forgotten that, if our social order were changed, production would lessen - aye, go back to vanishing point, as in Russia to-day, or in any other place where such lunacy was introduced.

If all the interest and all the profits derived from industry were put into a common pool, how would the operatives in the -industrial field fare? After dealing with Mr. Piddington’* report, the Commonwealth Statistician says -

At the present time the ;basic rates of wages Joi- adult males in Mie several States are approximately as follows: -

Senator LYNCH:

– I am very glad to hear the honorable senator say so. He shows -the beginnings of common sense. It is .almost, as it were, a. break in the ‘ dark cloud that has enveloped this country :too much, since -the Labour party ‘has (determined thant the Brisbane ‘objective should be carried out, which is not meant * as even .a disguise -of “Soviet rule-; but the very thing itself. -When Senator McDougall says that he is not connected with any party that advocates -such, a -course, I welcome his statement. because

I know that he would not dream of saying anything but what he ‘thinks .and “believes in. Honorable senators sitting to -the right of , the President are not out to crush any one. Our ranks may contain many men .of wealth, just as the old Labour .party had mem .of wealth among its .supporters. I remember Sir E. T. Smith giving the Labour party in Adelaide a sum of money -to enable it ‘to build a hall. I remember other benefactors to the Labour movement. But, taking them a-s a whole, honorable senators on this side of the -Chamber are not out to injure the worker.. In any case, if we were so inclined, we should very quickly be stopped, because there are such, things in this country as the ballot-box, majority rule, and that glorious privilege we enjoy, an adult suffrage, which gives to the meanest unit in the land as much political power as is enjoyed by a man having millions and every social influence at his command.

I might succeed in getting some men to rid themselves of false impressions, but there ave others whom it is almost hopeless to expect to grow out of that state of mind which leaves them always in the past. There are men whose bodily forms walk abroad, but whose view-point is that of the sixteenth century or earlier. We see repeatedly instances of how men’s minds lag behind. There was,a time when people were not so honest as they are to-day. Before we had an organized society, there were bands of robbers’ roaming about the country, and succeeding generations still imagine that they are always in danger of being robbed. Because men’s minds have lagged behind ,and people cannot trust their fellows, we find locks on doors even in the .far interior, where the doors are never closed. When George Stephenson invented the locomotive and had Iris first engine running on rails, an old woman who saw it felt that there must be horses inside it to propel it. Her mind having been associated with horses as a means of transport, she could .conceive of nothing moving in any direction unless horses were propelling it. There are a lot of old women nowadays whose minds cannot progress. I ‘have seen honorable senators passing out of this Chamber bow instinctively to the Chair, even when the President was not in it. They cannot get away from ha’bit. I appeal to honorable senators opposite to bring themselves .up-to-date mentally, and :to realize that honorable senators «mi this side of the Chamber are mat bent on bringing about -the destruction, either materially or otherwise, of any ‘section of the citizens of this .country. On .the contrary. -they are prepared to afford help to all, and more (particularly are they impelled to do -this because there is -always the ballot-box to make them .do it.

– What about the holiday this Parliament is to take, whether honorable senators like- it or not, while the Prime Minister (Mr. Bruce) goes to London ? Itwillbeaholidayof three or four months’ duration. Asfar as this Chamber is concerned, there will not be a great deal for honorable senators to do.

SenatorPearce. - There is a lot of public work to do, apart from parliamentary duties.

Senator Gardiner:

-. - Such as reporting onRabaul.

SenatorGRAHAM.- The position of a carbide factory in Tasmaniahas been mentioned, and I wish to make an appeal onbehalfofWesternAustralia,Agrav- ingdockshouldbeconstructedatAlbany for ocean-going vessels.

SenatorReid. - Does the honorable senator desire to see the Henderson schemecarriedout.

SenatorGRAHAM.- Whatis needed at Albany is a graving dock.There isverydeepwaterthere,andthelargest vessels afloat can some alongside the wharf. Many portsinAustraliadonot possessthatadvantage. I sincerely, hope thatthe Government will do something for Western; Australia in this matter.

I believe inimmigration. These are vastvacantspacesinAustralia,and, with Senator Lynch, I think that they should be populated. Before people are brought here, however, some provision should be made for them to receive suitableland, sothattheywillnotdriftback tothecities,andtherebyincreaseunemployment.ImmigrantsinWesternAustralia are,insomecases,receivingaslow awageas 10s. per week. That is not at all creditable to those who. brought them to Australia. A number of theimmigrantsaretotallyunfitforfarmwork Many of the men engaged in; the mines havenodesiretoundertakeruralwork, and,iftheydid,itisveryunlikelythat theywouldachievesuccess.Manyhundred’s of immigrants who are arriving in

Western Australia are not suitable for farm work, and, consequently, after a short time they drift from the country to the cities,andcompetewithmenalready at workbyoffering their services, at lower ratesofpay. I am surenoonewishes to see wages reduced, and. it will be readily admitted that the present systemunder which men and: women are being brought to Australia, is not altogetherdesirable.Insteadofanattempt being, madeto force new settlers to take up land in isolatedplaces miles from a railway with the object of opening up new country, the large tracts of land adjacent to railway lines should be opened, up for closer settlement. To do this,, a tax should beimposedontheunimprovedvalueof theland,whichwouldhavetheeffectof burstingupmanylargeestateswhich havebeenlying dormant for many years.

SenatorHays. - Western Australia has large tracts of Crown lands-.

SenatorGRAHAM. -Yes;.but in Western Australia, as in other States, there is goodandbadland, and if a settler wereplacedonpoorlanditwould be very difficultforhimtomakeasuccess ofhiswork.InWesternAustraliathere arehundredsofsquaremilesofcountry on either side of railways whichhave neverbeen developed. It is thebounden dutyoftheGovernmenttoseethatthose peoplewhomwewishtoassistareplaced onlandonwhichtheycanmakealiving. Theonlywayinwhichclosersettlement canbemadeasuccessisbyimposingan unimprovedlandvaluestax.Thisisan oldcry,butsuchapolicywouldenablethe landadjacenttorailwaystobeproperly developed. If that weredone,. settlers would be able todespatch their produce by rail, instead of carting, it as. many do, 30 miles toarailwaystation.

SenatorGuthrie. - We have a Federal land tax.

Senator GRAHAM:

– Taxation is imposed on unimproved land values in a Sydney municipality, and, I believe, in other places. All importantpublic utilities should be under Government control. I am in favour of national insurance against unemployment, sickness, and death, and if effect were given to such a policy unemploymentwouldnot be as prevalent as it is to-day. Although the Queensland insurance scheme does not go as far as I shouldlikeittogo,its profits are- enormous. It is the* duty of the’ Commonwealth. Government to- embark upon a national’ insurance scheme im competition with the- private- companies’,, which on the money subscribed by the people are constructing, palatial buildings- in the capital: cities.

Senator Thompson:

– The Queensland State Insurance Office has a monopoly of the- Workers’ Compensation Scheme..

Senator GRAHAM:

– I wish wes had a similar monopoly in Western Australia..

I do not intend to refer at length to the method adopted in electing the President of this Chamber, but I consider that the. eleven new senators were practically’ disfranchised. If the practice followed was similar to that followed in the past, I can only say that we on this side will’ adopt a similar method at the first opportunity.

I desire to make an appeal’ on behalf of the miners on the gold-fields of Western Australia who are suffering from phthisis, or what is commonly known as miners’ complaint. I am glad to learn that the Prime Minister (Mr. Bruce) is having investigations made concerning the Spahlinger treatment. Those conversant with the conditions on the mining, fields know that in many eases,, after a miner has been working underground for three or four years, he devlops miners’ complaint. Before long he rs unable to carry on his work, and has to be, removed to a sanatorium to await what i* known as the “white death.” There is nothing worse than this- scourge, and- although it exists in other’ parts of the Commonwealth,. I believe it is more prevalent in Kalgoorlie amd the Boulder section than elsewhere. I sincerely trust the Government will make the fullest investigations concerning possible effective treatment, or a means whereby the complaint’ may be avoided. If that were done if would he money well’ spent. When a miner, has been at work underground for a year or two dust accumulates on the lungs, and! when it becomes crusted and commences1 to break, fibrosis develops. Later the lungs- begin to disintegrate, = and miners’’ phthisis, follows. If all the wealth derived from the Golden Mile were divided amongst the miners iti would not be- sufficient compensation for the losses sustained in consequence of the suffering and’ death from, this. disease and’ accidents, and the Government would be conferring a: great benefit on those: engaged in the raining.’ industry if it took, action in the direction I have indicated.

Senator’ Lynch referred to the fact, that! miners were receiving £2 per day, and although’, the statement) may Be- correct-, it is very misleading. Some miners receive that sum-, but they work only two- or ‘three days1 a week, and’ occasionally- only three or four days a fortnight. A number oE men engaged on> the- wharfs also- receive fairly high- wages, but their work,, too-, is very intermittent.

As I have a very heavy cold, I have been at a. disadvantage in addressing the Senate this afternoon, I thank honorablesenators for listening to me with such patience, and trust that the Government wilT be able to give attention to some of the matters which I have brought forward’.

Senator ELLIOTT (.Victoria) [4.46.).- I desire to direct the attention of the Senate to the* question of sulphur duties, which has not been, mentioned’ during the debate.. There has been a good deal of misrepresentation in- regard to the deferred! duty on sulphur, and it has been said that the action of the Government in imposing these duties has increased’ the cost of superphosphates to the farmers. Nothing is: further from the truth. I understand from the report which the Tariff Board has recently prepared, and which has just been presented to Parliament, that none of the sulphur used in fertilizers at present being sold has Been dutiable. It is rather interesting to trace the- history of this matter in the report of the Tariff Beard. The reason for including in the Tariff, a deferred duty on sulphur was given by the ex-Minister for Trade audi Customs ‘ (Mr. Massy Greene) in the Howse- o* Representatives. He said -

Many of our ores, in conjunction with other . metals, hold large, quantities, of sulphur. This sulphur is very often one of the greatest detriment to the recovery of the precious- metal, but at the same, time, if’ it can be used, it- becomes in- itself a valuable by-product, and in this way enormous assistance to mining is afforded-.

It was with a view to making use of that by-product that sulphur duties were first imposed. A gentleman associated with the fertilizer industry,, in company with the representatives of the mining industry,, interviewed the Minister for Trade amd Customs and told him that, although they had been opposing a duty on sulphur, they had now come to a definite agreement with the Electrolytic Zinc Company to establish a plant for its manufacture. Unfortunately, the farmers were not represented on that deputation. Under the arrangement entered into, the Electrolytic Zinc Company undertook, irrespective of the price of sulphur outside Australia, not to increase the rate to the fertilizer companies above the actual working costs. Considering that sulphur cost as much as £14 per ton during the war, that was an enormous apparent advantage to the farming community, as it meant that, whatever might intervene, the price in Australia would not be raised. The question of world’s parity was not even involved. The then Minister for Trade and Customs (Mr. Massy Greene) went on to say -

When these gentlemen tell me that they have made an agreement on this basis, I accept their word, just as I think the honorable member would do if he were in my place. I am telling the Committee as much as I may of the terms of that agreement. This is a very important matter from the point of view of the farmers. Here is an agreement under which, if any untoward happenings outside Australia lead to tremendous rise, such as occurred during the war, in the price of sulphur, wo havea definite assurance that it shall not affect the price of sulphur here, so far as it enters into the manufacture of superphosphates. That is a very valuable position from the farmers’ point of view.

The agreement referred to was made between certain fertilizer manufacturers and the Electrolytic Zinc Company. The Minister gave no verbal undertaking, either in regard to the agreement or otherwise. The fact, however, that the Minister availed himself of the existence of the agreement as a strong argument in favour of the duty would imply a certain responsibility in seeing that the agreement was observed.

In order to investigate statements concerning disputes as to the interpretation and carrying out of the agreement referred to, the exMinister for Trade and Customs (Mr. Rodgers), in April, 1922, called a conference of the interested parties to ascertain andreport whether the agreement was being faithfully carried out. The conference appointed the following representatives of the various interests concerned as a committee to report to the

Minister : - Mr. T. J. McGalliard, President of the Chamber of Commerce; Mr. W. G. Gibson, M.P., representing agricultural interests; Mr. W. A. Cuming and Mr. Burns Cuming, representing superphosphate manufacturers ; Mr. Colin Eraser and Mr. ThomasHaynes, representing sulphur producers; and Mr. Ambrose Pratt, secretary. The function of the committee, as expressed in the letter to the secretary, was “ to inquire into the disputes that have arisen between certain parties as to the interpr eta tion and carrying out of the undertaking given, through the Minister for Trade and Customs, to the House at the time the Tariff was passed, and also by reason of later developments in connexion with supplies of pyritic ores by the Mount Lyell Company, with a view to arriving at a satisfactory arrangement for the use of pyrites and other sulphide ores in the production of sulphuric acid for the manufacture of superphosphates.” The following report from the committee was received : - 415 Collins-street, Melbourne, 25th May, 1922.

The Hon. Arthur S.Rodgers, Minister for Trade and Customs, Department of Trade and Customs, Melbourne.

Re Sulphur Duty.

Sir. - Ibeg to advise you that meetings of the committee appointed by the conference on the 21st April last were held at 415 Collinsstreet, on the 23rd, 24th, and 25th May.

Present: Mr. T. J. McGalliard (in chair) and Mr. W.. G. Gibson, M.H.E., representing the agricultural interests; Messrs. W.F. Cuming and Burns Cuming, representing superphosphate manufacturers; Messrs. Colin Eraser and Thos. Haynes, representing sulphur producers; and Mr. Ambrose Pratt, secretary.

The attached letter, re functions of com- . mittee, was read by the secretary. It was decided -

No dispute exists between sulphurproducing interests and manufacturers of superphosphates. It was ascertained that, on the contrary, negotiations are now in progress between the sulphur-producing interests and the superphosphate manufacturers with the object of utilizing zinc concentrates and/or pyrites to replace imported sulphur for the production of the sulphuric acid used in manufacturing superphosphate.
Satisfactory arrangements are being made to remove the misunderstanding between the sulphur producers and a superphosphate company which proposes to establish works in Melbourne.

It was decided to inquire what the increased cost of superphosphate would be to the farmer as -a result of the duty of ?2 10s. per ton on sulphur.

It was agreed that, on the basis of utilizing imported sulphur, this would be equal to 5s. per ton. Providing, however, that the arrangements (now in progress) for the supply of locally-produced sulphur are completed satisfactorily, the increased cost, while remaining at 5s. per ton in Western Australia, would be only from 2s. to 3s. a ton in the other States.

It was further agreed that a substantial reduction in the price of superphosphate would take place owing to the lower cost of phosphate rock, wages, &c.

Consideration was given to the insurance benefits Australia would receive by the establishment of sulphur production in the Commonwealth in time of war, and representatives of the mining companies gave an assurance that no advantage would be taken of war conditions should they arise.

I have the honour to be, sir,

Yours faithfully, (Signed) T. J. McGalliard, Chairman.

With the above communication was forwarded the following letter from Mr. T. J. McGalliard: -

Melbourne, 25th May, 1922.

The Hon. A. S. Rodgers.

Hon. Sir. I enclose herewith a report of the findings of the committee you directed to inquire into the position with regard to sulphur required in the manufacture of superphosphate.

The findings in the report, signed by mo as chairman on behalf of the committee, were unanimous, and were arrived at on the information supplied by manufacturers of superphosphate and sulphur producers. This information was placed at the disposal of the committee with the greatest freedom and candour.

An additional, or minority, report, subscribed to by Mr. Gibson and myself, is added in the form of a protest against the increase in the price of superphosphate to the farmer as a result of the duty on sulphur.

Yours faithfully, (Signed) T. j. McGalliard.

Although Mr. McGalliard said that the report was arrived at unanimously, he and one other member of the committee forwarded to the. Minister a protest against an increase of 5s. per ton. The protest was as follows: -

The Hon. A. S. Rodgers, M.P.

Dear Sir. - As representatives of the primary producers, we beg to submit a minority report, placing on record our opposition to a further impost on one of Australia’s greatest industries - wheat growing - and upon those rural industries in which superphosphate is used, over 400,000 tons being used annually in Australia.

To-day, superphosphate of the same analysis is sold in South Australia at ?5 10s. per ton (lists enclosed). At the meeting to-day, the calculations were based on the Victorian price of ?6 3s. per ton. One South Australian firm advises that the duty on sulphur would mean 7s. per ton increase, not 5s. We consider it no part of the farming community’s duty to bear the whole burden of establishing the industry of sulphur production. Such cost should be borne by the whole community. (Sgd.) T. J. McGalliard.

S. Gibson.

Melbourne, 24/5/22.

The Committee delivered a unanimous report, which would lead the Minister to believe that they were in accord with the duty imposed; still these two gentlemen included a dissent, such as I have read.

Senator Guthrie:

– The superphosphate companies of Victoria have guaranteed to reduce the price of superphosphates by 6s. per ton, provided the duty is taken off sulphur.

Senator Drake-Brockman:

– The sulphur duty is scandalous.

Senator ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA

– The secretary of the Committee, on the 7th June, 1922, wrote this letter to the Minister -

The Hon. A. S. Rodgers,

Minister for Trade and Customs,

Trade and Customs Department,

Melbourne. 7th June, 1922. .

Dear Sir,

Re Sulphur Duty.

The Committee appointed by you to confer on the above question on 21st April last, and which duly met in conference on the 23rd, 24th, and 25th May, unanimously decided to make a’ report, which I duly forwarded to you on 26th May. It has come to the knowledge of members of the Committee, by means of an article published in the South Australian press, that two members of the Committee, Messrs T. J. McGalliard and W. G. Gibson, presented to you a minority report. I have the honour to inform you that the other members of the Committee have no knowledge of this minority report, and that when the conference broke up they were under the impression that Messrs. McGalliard and Gibson had no intention of sending to you any report other than the unanimous report of the Conference. On behalf of the other members of the Committee, I have made every effort to obtain a copy of the minority report, but without success. Perhaps you would be good enough to supply me with a copy, so that the other members of the Committee may know how Messrs. McGalliard and Gibson reported. It is only fair to let you know that when the Conference broke up it was distinctly understood that no report should be presented to you except the unanimous report of the Conference, and if a minority report was presented to you, this was done in violation of the unanimous understanding arrived at by theConference.

I have the honour to be,sir,

Yours faithfully, (Sgd.) Ambrose Pratt.

Thedeferred duty was provided to come into effect on 31st March, 1922, the item reading : -

Honorable senators will note that where sulphur is used for purposes for which the sulphuric acid produced from pyrites cannot be used it is free of duty.

Senator Hays:

-Didthe Committee indicate in any way whysuperphosphates in South Australia were £5 10s. per ton, while for a similar grade of superphosphate in Melbourne, the place of manufacture, the price was £6 3 s.?

Senator ELLIOTT:

– The superphosphate is produced at the pyrites works at Port Pirie, South Australia.

Senator Guthrie:

– Why should the Victorian farmersbe penalizedby the duty on sulphur?

Senator Hays:

– There was a difference of 13s. per ton for superphosphates of the same analysis.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– It wins by reason of theexcessive freights around the coast.

Senator Hays:

– Can the honorable senator say why some companies manufacturing phosphates in Melbourne, were selling their phosphates in South Australia at the price charged by the South Australiancompany?

Senator ELLIOTT:

– That would be the effect of competition.

On the 28th March, 1922, the Tariff Board recommended that theduty be not further deferred. The full report and the recdomendation are as follow: -

The Tariff Boardhas very carefully considered the question whether the duty on sulphur should foe further deferred after 31st in- stant. All the papers on the subject have been carefully perused, and representatives of the mining and superphosphate interests have been consulted.

It is clear from the statements made by a deputation thatwaited on Mr. Massy Greene in November, 1921, that the manufacturers of superphosphate had then arrived at a definite agreement with the producers of pyrites, and assured the Minister that if he would postpone the duty until 31st March, 1922, they would th en be in a position touse the locallyproduced sulphuric acid. As far as the Board can ascertain, practically no effort has been made by the two superphosphate manufacturer - who gave such assurance - to prepare for the roasting of the necessary concentrates to obtain the sulphuric acid required.

Therecanbe no question that there are many years’ supply of the necessary pyrites already available in Australia, and it seems most desirable that in every possible way the use of such material shouldbe encouraged.

The Board has ascertained that the price rulingfor imported sulphur is , at present . £415s. per ton, whilst local pyrites can be suppliedat an equivalent of £5 10s. per ton.

It must be remembered that the price of sulphur in war time went up to £14 per ton, and until last year was stillin the region of £8 to £9 per ton. Evidently owing to the proposal of the Government to place a duty on sulphur, the price has decreased very rapidly, and enormous supplies havebeen obtained by the companies. ‘Representatives of two companies examined bythe Board estimated their present stock is availableto meet all their requirements for the next nine months.

When it is remembered that the superphosphate companies undertook about five months ago tobe ready at the and of this month to use the new system of roasting, it will beseen that the companies can readily get into a position of manufacturingfrom local material long before their present supplies of sulphur are exhausted.

The mining companies interested have given the Board a definite undertaking thatthey will not take full advantage of the duty of £2 10s., nor will they increase -their price over the present amount unless contingencies arise such as increased wages .or more stringent conditions are imposed.

As far as the mining companies earn see, there is rather a tendency to reduce .that increase, as the wages and other conditions are likely to become easier. It has been made clean: to the Board that the imposition of the duty will not result in the increase in the price of superphosphate to the farmer.

Senator Guthrie:

– It has resulted in an increase.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– I do not think so. The manufacturers have offered to reduce the price .by 6s. per ton if Ais dirty is taken off sulphur. That is not am increase, hut merely a catting <of the present price. The report continues -

Tt .must bc remembered that one ton of sulphur will make 10 tons -of superphosphate, so that the .duty would amount to .about 5s. per ton. As the’ company is only taking advantage of a little more than one-half of the duty, it is evident that in the coming regulation of prices there must be a reduction ‘in the price of superphosphate to the .farmer.

The supplies of superphosphate up to the present tare being manufactured from .sulphur costing between £8 and £ 0 per ton, so that, so far a« sulphur is concerned, at the next fixing of prices of superphosphate, “both the -cost of sulphur ‘and wages have been “reduced, and .that reflection ‘Should :show in the price to be fixed for superphosphate.

There can .be jio question that the iiu.poa.tion «of this duty will be of immense importance to the mining industry, and Should provide work to a great number of men, as well -a* transport service for 0Ur idle ships, and the Board lias no hesitation in recommending .that the .duty should he imposed as from 31st March, 1922.

The importance of the .use of Austalian pyrites or ore concentrates for the manufacture of sulphuric acid .cannot -be overestimated -

Not .only does it assist the mining industries, .but it scmov.es .Australia from the necessity of depending on overseas supplies of sulphur for the production oi superphosphates.

An agreement has recently .been come to between .Sicily and America for the world co.ntirol .of the price -of sulphur, and .this agreement is likely to result in higher prices being charged.

For tlie last six months negotiations have teen in progress between representatives of the Sicilian amd American sulphur-producing interests.

Between them they monopolize the whole of the outside supply of sulphur.

These negotiations have .had as their object the conclusion of a (working agreement to eliminate competition, fix prices, and to allocate the various ‘markets of the world /between the two sources -of supply.

How are we likely to fare if that comes off?

From -the point of view of the Sicilian producers, such An -understanding was essential if the industry w.as .to be preserved from complete collapse, for notwithstanding the efforts both of the Italian Government and the mineowners themselves, Sicilian sulphur was gradually and continuously losing ground, and the prospects of seducing costs of production .to .a point sufficiently low to compete successfully with the American product were negligible. From tlie American stand-point also, consider.able benefits would, -accrue fr-oni an agreement. The negotiations proceeded fairly smoothly., and a definite agreement has at last been arrived at, which is to “operate until 30th September, 1-926, with an alternative after that date .either of renewal for a .further period, :or of expiration on six -months’ notice of -such intention being given by either party.*

Full details of the agreement are not yet available but -the bread outlines have “»een published.

Senator Hays:

– The same thing obtained here in connexion -with the manufacture of superphosphate.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– That is quite likely. But it is idle to blame the duty alone for any increase.

All North American needs are to be exclu-sively provided for by United States sulphur and ail Italian needs by Sicilian- sulphur. The rest of the world’s markets are to be divided between the two countries in a definite ratio but in -addition to their fixed quota, Sicilian producers -are to !be granted annually the further (facility of selling 65,000 tons of crude sulphur destined for exclusive use in the manufacture of sulphuric acid. and for “this 65,000 tons they are to be allowed a free ‘world market.

Tlie total amount o? sulphur to be -exported by Si-oily -each year U fixed- at 145;000 tons, exclusive of the’ 65,000 tons .mentioned above and this figure, although far below pre-war figures, is considerably above those of 1021 and” 1922.

As (Ear as price questions are concerned, .each market is to be studied individually, and a suitable selling price fixed by the ItaloAmerica;n combination. The ultimate idea, however, is to increase prices gradually until they approach those ruling in pre-war years expressed on a gold currency basis.

As regards immediate “price alterations, it appears that complete mutual agreement has been -attained, amd that a.n average increase <sf $i , per .ton is to (be made on tlie prices provisionally fixed by American producers in October last. Further details on the price question will be anxiously awaited by sulphur consumers both in this country .amd abroad, as it -is .difficult to >see how. even in the face of this -agreement, the prices ruling for the .two products can he .reconciled. American crude sulphur can be obtained in this country at a ci.f. price of .about -£5 per ton, whereas -.the comparative Sicilian product cannot .be , aD lamed under £8 per ten. T-o what extent, if any, iiic consumer will suffer will only be seen in the light of future events.

If Sicily happens to have Australia allotted to it, we shall have to pay a very considerable increase on the price at which we are obtaining it from America.

Senator Lynch:

– If those foreign suppliers are putting their heads together, what is to prevent local men doing the same thing?

Senator ELLIOTT:

– We cannot interfere with the outside man, but we have under our thumb those who are in Australia.

In March, 1923, when the foregoing report was written in London, the ci.f. price of sulphur in England was: - Prom United States of America, £5 -per ton; from Sicily, £8 per ton.

At the same time, i.e., March, 1923, sulphur from America was being sold in Australia, at £4 7s. 6d. per ton c.ii.

The fact that American sulphur was being offered in Australia at 12s. 6d. per ton less than the price in England, at a time when effort was being put forth to make Australia independent of overseas supplies, is a very significant matter.

They wanted to destroy the local indus- try.

It should also be particularly noted that if Australia had to depend on imported sulphur, the price would, in view of the SicilianAmerican agreement, undoubtedly be raised considerably, though to what extent would only be seen in the light of future events.”

The development of the Australian sulphur resources, in order to make the Commonwealth independent of outside “price agreements,” and at the same time to insure for the superphosphate makes a regular supply of sulphuric acid at a reasonable price, is a matter of the first moment.

Sulphuric acid made from pyrites is used extensively for the manufacture of superphosphate in different parts of the world, and is used almost exclusively in Great Britain, France, Belgium, and Germany. It has also been used in Australia for a number of years, and in 1913, 12,S35 tons of pyrites, valued at £28,255, were imported from Spain for thi3 purpose.

The .question has been raised as to whether sulphuric acid made from pyrites, or other Australian ores, will be unsuitable for the manufacture of superphosphates on account of the presence of small quantities of zinc or arsenic.

The Tariff Board has given special attention to this question, and is thoroughly satisfied there is no danger.

In the production of the sulphuric acid from Spanish and Portuguese pyrites and zinc concentrates, in England, France, Belgium, and Germany, the -acid is not treated in any way with the object of removing the small proportions of zinc and arsenic invariably present as these have been proved to be of no signifi cance .whatever in relation to the application of superphosphates to the soil. Recent experimental studies of English and French agricultural chemists showed that restricted quantities of zinc and arsenic act as stimulants to the growth of wheat and other crops.

It is important also to note that -

Superphosphate made in Australia with sulphuric acid produced from Australian ores is being sold in South Australia at present at 24s. per ton less than is charged in New Zealand for similar superphosphate made in that country from sulphur imported free of duty.

The use of our own sulphuric acid is a very important consideration to Australia because it is the basis of the manufacture of modern high explosives. This consideration cannot be too much stressed. At the outbreak of the war Great Britain had only one establishment at which was being produced sulphuric acid which could be used in the manufacture of explosives. It was necessary to enormously multiply the factories and increase their output in order to supply the explosives used in the war. It is . a well known fact that in Australia we have something like four days’ supply of gun ammunition. It is impossible to manufacture in peace time a very much larger quantity of ammunition, because it deteriorates quickly. Unless we are prepared to spend a huge sum of money in making good the wastage, the only alternative is to encourage the production of sulphuric acid in this country.

Speaking of sulphuric acid in this connexion leads me to the question of defence. I was very pleased to notice from the speech of Senator Ogden that there is hope of a return to reason on .the part of honorable senators opposite in regard to the vital matter of our defence. I do not forget that it was due to a Labour Government that universal training was inaugurated in Australia. That system, was of great advantage - one is tempted to say, of incalculable advantage to Australia during the recent war. Our mobilization for that war was carried out, not without difficulty. Had it not been for the institution of com.pulsory military training our difficulties would have been infinitely greater, if not insurmountable. The system provided us -with officers and non-commissioned officers and with “the means of training men as they came forward. It made our army possible. During the course of the war a change took place in the views of honorable senators opposite - a change which I have been totally unable to fathom. Instead of that support, which’ Mr. Fisher promised, of “the last mau and the last shilling,” there was a gradual cooling off, if not an actual hostility towards recruiting, culminating in the branding, -by certain elements of the party, of the men who came forward as recruits, as “six bob a day murderers.” At that very time we were within a hair’s breadth of defeat. Even now - although this fact, I believe, is realized fully - some people do not really grasp what the defeat of the Allies would have meant to us. I have heard it urged that, even had Germany defeated the Allies in Europe and had come to Australia, we should never have been conquered. Let. us assume that that view is correct.

Senator Guthrie:

– It is a very foolish view.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– Foolish, indeed, but let us assume its truth. It could only have been demonstrated to the invader at the sacrifice of all our cities, the destruction of our farms and countryside, and the infliction of terrible sufferings upon our people. Such would be the price of victory. Let us, however, consider what would have happened if we in Australia were conquered by Germany. Such a defeat would mean our enslavement for generations. How, with that terrible risk before his eyes, any one could have faltered in his determination to win through on. the other side at any cost, passes my comprehension. Had it been possible for the Labour party to remain united and carry out ‘their original policy to the end, in my opinion they would have been so firmly established in power in this country that their position would have been unassailable, at any rate, for a very long time. From the time of the split on the conscription issue - right up to the present time - no doubt in order to justify the position which they then took up - the Labour party have consistently opposed any attempt to maintain the system of compulsory training. This attitude and the open sympathy displayed by the party towards those trainees who resist military training have immeasurably increased the difficulties of those who are intrusted with the administration of the Aci. However, Senator Ogden’s able speech seems to betoken a return to sanity in this matter. I trust that his views will prove infectious.

I desire to acknowledge my personal debt to the Leader of the Opposition (Senator Gardiner) for his assistance in eliminating from the Defence Bill introduced into the Senate last session features which were considered to be undesirable. The majority of those clauses which last year I deemed to be objectionable have, I am glad to note, been eliminated; and, with the exception of a few provisions, I shall be able to support the measure.

One aspect of the Defence question has been referred to with which I am thoroughly in accord. It is now almost two years since I advocated that Great Britain should be approached in regard to the fortification of Singapore and the creation of docks there. I believe that I was the first in Australia to publicly advocate that policy. If honorable senators will glance at a map of the world, they cann’ot fail to see the enormous strategic importance of Singapore to Australia. We can be attacked from two quarters only - the North Pacific and the North Atlantic. In both cases a force proceeding to Australia would be threatened from the flank and rear by a force stationed at Singapore, and would not dare to pass it by without reducing it to subjection. As this would lead to delay in any contemplated descent on Australia, it could not fail to be to our incalculable advantage. With a similar base in New Zealand and one at Capetown, we would be practically unassailable. But Singapore would be the most important of the three posts, and I, therefore, commend the Government for its co-operation with Great Britain in thi3 regard, because it will prove to be the cheapest form of insuring us from invasion. At the same time, there is, in my opinion, no immediate danger. Germany is impotent for the time being, and present reports indicate that Japan is conscientiously carrying out the terms of the Washington Treaty.

I join most emphatically in the support accorded to the League of Nations. At the same time, one must realize the difficulties faced by the League. No Court in our land can function without its executive” officers, backed up by the police force, and, if necessary, the army,, to compel the observance of. its< judgments or awards-. Similarly,, the League of Nations must have an army at its back to- insure the observance of its decrees;. The question is how that army is to be- provided. The League, must either have its own standing, army, a body of mercenaries stationed at. some, agreed, upon spot,, and ready to- move whenever required, or depend on volunteers from tlie diff erent, nations. Both systems have their disadvantages. A standing, army might become, an instrument of tyranny and ultimately enslave the world under a vast despotism. In the other ease, it might- be very difficult,, or even ‘ impossible, to collect an. army of volunteers in time of need. Suppose,; for instance, there is a quarrel- between Poland and Austria or some other States’ over one of those obscure issues1 which frequently cause wars. How would Australia, as a member of the League of Nations, regard a request to call her young men away from their desks, their ploughs, and their looms, to help ‘keep- the peace between the quarrelling countries? We had an example of that sort of thing recently, when there was danger of Turkey breaking the Treaty of Sevres and starting another war. As one of the signatories to the Treaty, Mr. W. M. Hughes, our ex-Prime Minister, loyally promised to support ‘Great Britain even to the extent of sending our troops overseas again. He was assailed from all quarters for even contemplating; such a thing;, but what difference would there be between that possibility and a. request to support the League of Nations in. regard to some obscure conflict- in tha middle of Europe ? How, also> would India regard a call from the- League of Nations, to assist Australia against some Asiatic or coloured race in a dispute omer the White Australia policy? The subject bristles with difficulties; nevertheless it is a great ideal. N©’ doubt, if any one five hundred years ago had suggested- that, the Highland clans! of Scotland or the robber chiefs of the borderland of England amd Scotland could be induced to unite even for common defence,, much less to. go’ overseas to fight side by side for justice and right, it “would have seemed but a wild, impossible dream. But we have pro- gressed and made such a thing possible, and it. may be that sooner or’ later the ideal of the League of Nations will, become a glorious reality..

I welcome the announcement that the Government will shortly introduce a measure to liberalize invalid and old-age pensions. Great hardship is. occasioned at times through the administration of the Act. A case brought recently under my attention is that of a daughter who is an absolute invalid. She is so helpless that it is necessary to pay an1 attendant to be constantly with her- to assist- her in every task of nature. She was receiving an invalid pension, but recently, because her father had received an increase in his wages to £4 10s. or £i 12s. a week, her pension was stopped. The increase in the father’s wages had’ put him just above the regulation standard wage which permitted of a pension being paid to a dependant. The withdrawal: of the pension was a terrible infliction on these people. I tried my best to help them to get the decision reviewed, but the Commissioner of Pensions pointed out that under the present regulations he was utterly helpless in the matter. I hope that provision will be made to meet a case such as this. In. another instance a woman with a bed-ridden husband who is utterly helpless and has only a few months to live, has supported’ herself and her husband by acting as cleaner and caretaker of- a picture theatre. For this work she- receives £2 10s. a week. When she applied for an invalid pension for her husband, she was informed that he could’ not be assisted because she wa3 drawing a wage of £2 10s. per week. Her case was complicated because owing to her heavy work in having, not only to clean out a picture theatre, but also to look after a bed-ridden husband., her own health broke down, and for some time she had) been obliged to pay an assistant to doi her work at the- theatre. However, she failed to state that fact in her application- for the pension . I hope that some provision will also be made tomeet her case.

I trust .that the Government will be able to increase pensions payable to war widows. The utmost liberality has been shown by past Governments to returned soldiers, but there is no doubt that war widows, particularly officers’’ widows-, have cause for complaint. At first- the pensions provided for officers-‘ widows were considerablyhigher than those payable to privates’ widows,but as the ; costof living increased, public opinion forced the Government to raise the pensions payable to privates’ widows to the scale previously allowed forthe widows of captains. There was, however, no increase in the pensions of the widows of officers. The wives and childrenof many of our young doctors who lost their lives at the war were accustomed to a reasonable amount of comfort, but they are now obliged to subsist on the same amount that is allowed to the widow of a private. However Democratic we may be we ought to have regard to circumstances. Educated ladies and their children, who have not been accustomed to “ rough it,” feel their present position much more acutely than do those accustomed to living on a lower scale of comfort.

Senator Guthrie:

– What is the pension allowed to , an officer’s widow?

Senator ELLIOTT:

– A widow with one child is paid a pension of £2 12s. a week.

There is a matter not referred to in the Governor-General’s Speech which I consider is worthy of Attention. Section 44, sub-section 4, of the Constitution provides -

Any person who - (iv)Holds any office of profit under the Crown, …. shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting asa Senator or , a Member of the House of Representatives.

But sub-section (iv) does not apply . . . tothe receipt of pay as an officer or member of the Naval or Military Forces of the Commonwealth, by any person whose services are not wholly employedby the Commonwealth.

That provision was made with the object of preventing a Government insuring support for any part of its policy by providingpaid positionsunder the Crown to members of Parliament supporting it. At that time we had very small Naval and Military Forces, and as far as I can ascertain, no one serving in either the Army or the Navy, was receiving more than £30 a year, an amount which would not even cover the expense to which he was put. Therefore no one’s vote was likely to be influenced by such a paltryallowance. The position, however, has entirely changed. We find that Major-General Sir Neville Bowse, V.C., a member of the House of Representatives, occupies a part-time military job, at something over £800 a year, and a number of other senior officers in the Military Forces, who are also members of the Commonwealth Parliament, are in receipt of sums approaching , £300 a year, for positions which may, at any time, be brought into line with that which commands the salary paid to Major-General Howse. Surely it is a breach of the spirit, if not the letter, of the Constitution. Where will it end ? As our Forces develop, it might be quite constitutional to create the position of part-time Admiral of the Navy, carrying a salary of £5,000 a year, in order to take away the sting of criticism from the honorable member for Batman (Mr. Brennan). I feel sure that even the Leader of the Opposition in this Chamber, Senator Gardiner, would not find it in his heart to refuse a flattering offer of £10,000 a year for acting as nine-tenths Permanent Field Marshal of the Australian Forces. I have, perhaps, intentionally exaggerated this aspect of the question, but I have done so for the purpose of opening the eyes ofhonorable senators to the danger of the continued development of this practice which, I declare, is quite contrary to the spirit of our Constitution. Honorable senatorsopposite have harped on the subjectof immigration, and have alleged thatwe have no suitable land available on which to place settlers. I would remind them that twenty years ago the ‘best wheat land we have - the Victorian Mallee country - was classed as unsuitable and useless. To-day the Mallee promises the best reward to the enterprising settler who is not afraid of hard work. The construc tion of water channels has solved tie difficulty.

Senator Guthrie:

– And cheap superphosphates.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– Yes. With the provision of the vastwater storages in the Murray Valley, and particularly with the development ofour railways, we may expect a new ; State or province to spring up intheRiverina.

It hasbeen said thatthe Government have notkept their promise in regard to the settlement of soldiers on the land. Speaking for my own State, at least, Ican say that the Government have carried out their promise to the fall. I think I am right in saying that only some four thousand soldiers, whilst overseas, originally applied for land, but the returned men were stimulated by the prospects of those who took up the land at first. More and more qualified themselves and applied, and up to date about 14,000 have been settled in Victoria. There is surely not the slightest ground for alleging that the Government have not done all that was promised. In some instances the soldiers have made extraordinary progress, and some have paid off every penny the Government advanced to them.

Senator Guthrie:

– In the Mallee, too.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– It is a wonderful record. Taking the soldiers as a whole, if they were allowed to resell their holdings, they could, almost without exception, realize more than the Government ;.re charging them for the land.

I welcome the announcement that an attempt will be made to draw a dividing line between labour disputes that are essentially Federal and those that are local. At the same time I do not think that this will altogether solve the difficulty. I look for a solution rather to the Labour Unions themselves aspiring to own and control their own production - not in the direction of confiscating the works of employers, but by organizing and finding their own capital and carrying ou their own businesses. An example of what I mean is afforded by the action of a number of returned soldiers who were wharf labourers by occupation. They combined and formed the Returned Soldiers Stevedoring Company. They accepted contracts, and I believe that they are now rapidly becoming wealthy men. One ideal of the Labour party has been attained by these men ; in that they control the whole of the product of their own industry. Surely that system could be extended.

Much criticism has been levelled against the Government for selling the Commonwealth Woollen Mills. Why did not the labour unions get into the field ahead of the private syndicate and purchase the mills? They could have organized a fund, floated a company, and acquired control of the undertaking, thus securing the whole of the fruits of their industry.

Senator Gardiner:

– Nobody ever dreamt that the mills would be disposed of for less than a million sterling.

Senator Duncan:

– Not less than half a million, at any rate.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– That merely shows the lack of trained knowledge and business acumen on the part of the party leaders. What a splendid chance employees in the building trade have st present to form themselves into a company for the purpose of owning their own brickworks. They could then accept contracts for building houses for all and sundry, and secure to themselves the whole profit of their .labour. There is still some talk of this being done, but the project appears still to be only in the air. I appeal to honorable senators opposite to endeavour. to find a solution of the labour problem to that end. .

I was greatly heartened to find in Senator Ogden a recruit for the system of proportional representation. Last year I was told that it was all very well for .me to support such a’ proposal in view of the fact that I had not to seek reelection at the then approaching general elections; but if I have a chance this session I shall show my bona fides by endeavouring to get a measure through, and I hope to hav.e the support of honorable senators opposite.

Senator McDougall:

– Labour senators voted for proportional representation before the honorable senator came here.

Senator ELLIOTT:

– Then I hope that they are still in. favour of it.

Senator McHUGH:
South Australia

– I desire to express my pleasure in having a direct voice in the affairs of my country, and I hope that during my occupancy of this high and honorable position, I shall show that the confidence that the people of South Australia have reposed in me has not been misplaced. I realize that there are many pressing problems engaging the attention of Parliament. We should all be proud of the franchise that has been applied to the National Legislature.. Every man and woman, over the age of twenty-one years, has a voice in the affairs of government, and every eligible person should exercise that valuable right, which makes all the difference between a free man and a slave. I have been in the Labour party for about twenty years, and I am not “ one of the young men in the movement,” as Senator Pearce described me the other day. Ever since I have been able to take an intelligent interest in politics I have been in the Labour movement, and I assisted in putting into the Senate men who, years ago, helped to make Senator Pearce a Minister in a Labour Administration. Although I am not very old in years, I am at least old in the work of the Labour party, and I hope that, by the time I reach the age of Senator Pearce, I shall still be in it; in fact, I know that I shall be.

The Labour party stands for constitutional government, and we think that, when there is legislative work to be done, Parliament should do it. The present composite Government, however, seem, for some reason or other, to be afraid of Parliament. Early this year Parliament was called together for a very brief session, and the present session, too, is to b a short one. Then we shall go into recess, while the Prime Minister (Mr. Bruce) proceeds to England. The Labour party maintain that the first duty of the National Parliament is to Australia. There are men in England who can manage British affairs even better than our Prime Minister, bub he seems to think that he is the only man in Australia capable of conducting the affairs of this country.

Senator Findley:

– He thinks himself “ it and a bit.”

Senator McHUGH:

-He certainly imagines he is the only one who counts. We hear a good deal about autocrats, and the Prime Minister in this connexion reminds me of Cromwell. He will put the key of the Parliament in his pocket, and the parliamentary work of this country will be hung up until he sees fit to return from England. Why should not his twinbrother in the Government, Dr. Earle Page, be left in charge during his absence? The Country party say that they are capable of managing the affairs of Australia. If I were in Dr. Page’s position I should consider it a direct insult to suggest that I was not fit to take charge of the Government. It is called the Bruce-Page Ministry, and surely Dr. Page can be trusted to carry on, if it is necessary for the Prime Minister to leave Australia. The first essential in a Democracy is to have free and open discussion of all measures appertaining to the government of a country. We are legislating for over 5,000,000 of people, and the least the Government can do is to allow the fullest and most open discussion on every measure brought down. When we go into recess, even some of the followers of the Government will possibly not know the full effect of the legislation that is evidently to be rushed through. I have no doubt that the closure will be used fairly frequently this session. Its application does not make for free and open discussion, but it often ‘ creates bad feeling, and that is not in the best interests of Australia.

– It will be my very great pleasure to do so, and every honorable senator should assist. The Government may rest assured that honorable senators on this side will place no obstruction in the’ way of the improvement of the Northern Territory. This vast area of land once belonged to South Australia, but it was1 taken over’ by the Commonwealth Government! because it was thought that that Government could handle it to better advantage. There are; people who- say that the. South Australian Government should1 not have- parted with the Northern Territory, but I aim not one of them. It can be administeredproperly if the Federal Government, carry ‘ out the covenant which- they entered intowith the South Australian Government. There is- no prospect of developing, the Territory without railway facilities-. A. railway to the Northern Territory is a rational, undertaking, and its- construction will provide extensive employment. Honorable, senators who have been through) the Territory will agree ‘ with me that there are large tracts of land there which can be made productive. I do not believe ia State “frights” or State rights to- any great, t extent;. I place the> rights of the* nation, f foremost. When the Bill for the construction of a. railway to the Territory is before the Senate, I ask honorable senators to consider that proposal from a national viewpoint, quite apart from any State interest. The Northern Territory comprises one-sixth of the area of Australia, and if it is opened for settlement by means of railway communication, all credit will be due to the Nationalist Government. I commend the proposal to the Government, and hope that honorable senators will have an opportunity of discussing the matter before this session cuds; if not this session, then as early as possible.

Senator Pearce:

– The honorable senator will have the opportunity this session.

Senator McHUGH:

The Labour party’s attitude towards immigration is very often misunderstood. We want more people in Australia but we contend that suitable provision should be made for them in Australia, either before their departure from the Old Country or immediately upon their arrival here. We know it is a difficult undertaking. It is very easy for a person to say, “ Introduce 10,000 emigrants from the Old Country, and put them on the land.” I have lived in the Mallee, and I have seen men from the Old Country settle there, but they could not stick to the work because they were not used to the country. Men taken from congested areas, without experience, cannot work successfully in the bush. The necessary experience could be gained by employing these men on large railway construction works, such as the uniform-gauge project, where extra labour would be required. After this experience, men would be able to enter other avenues of employment open to them, including settlement on available land. Imagine men leaving England in the cold weather, arriving here in the middle of summer, and then being placed in the Mallee, where the temperature is sometimes 118 degrees in the shade.

Senator Guthrie:

– They could be employed on reproductive works, such as water conservation.

Senator McHUGH:

– On water conservation and any other essential works of development. I do not advocate the wholesale introduction to Australia of men and women from the Old Country to the detriment, possibly, of our people and the lowering of the standard of life here. Honorable senators do not wish to see the standard of living in Australia lowered. In their national pride, they would insist on a decent standard of living, and on a possible improvement rather than a retrograde step. I was surprised to hear Senator Lynch relate an incident concerning an Australian Workers Union organizer. I know something of the Australian Workers Union, and if the union organizer did as Senator Lynch states, he was acting contrary to the instructions of the organization. I have never known an Australian Workers Union organizer to do anything of that nature. On the contrary, I have known them to prevent strikes at certain camps. The organizers are appointed by the men, and would not knowingly foment a strike. The office is balloted for every year, and if an organizer has brought about an unsuccessful strike he suffers defeat at the next ballot. His business is to keep the nien in work, to see that they enjoy decent conditions, and give a fair return for their wage. I do not know whether Senator Lynch was present when the incident he described took place, but if his statement is correct, then the organizer was acting contrary to the constitution of the organization. It must not be forgotten that the

– They did not strike. They had more remunerative employment to which to go. If I were working for the honorable senator this week, and some one else offered me an extra 2s. a day to work for him, I would not be striking it’ I did not turn up to work for the hon- ‘orable ‘senator on Monday. These men had move remunerative employment; consequently theydid not turn up atthe sheds when the sheep were ready tobe shorn.

It is impossible, of course, to deny or overlook the legitimate claims of an industry that pays £6,000,000 in wages to some 25,000 employees, and produces a crop worth up to £9,000,000 per annum. It ranks among the very largest primary producing interests in Australia in any or all of the States. Economically the sugar industry is of even greater importance to the nation than a superficial examination of trade statistics would indicate. For it -should always be remembered that, if sugar were not produced in Australia, from £5,000,000 to £0,000,000 would have to be remitted each year to foreign countries, which buy, in return, scarcely any of our goods. During the Government-control period just expiring over £47,000,000 was thus ‘kept and spent in Australia in respect of the locallygrown tonnage.

This is one of the strongest arguments that could be brought forward to show that the sugar industry should be treated with generosity. Coming as it does from a right honorable member of another place who represents a southern constituency, this utterance should impress the people in the south. The industry should be helped either by extending the embargo against black-grown sugar for five years, or by imposing the duty which, during the last Parliament, Victorian Liberals and the Labour party in another place declined to pass.

I congratulate the Government on their proposal to afford protection to the Boy Scouts Association, and to forbidthe unauthorized use of the uniforms, medals, badges, &c, of their organization. The Boy Scouts’ movement is one of the most beneficial of its kind.

Senator Gardiner:

– It is to be hoped that the Government will let it grow without putting their crippling hands on it.

SenatorREID. - The Government are taking a very wise step. Bogus people dressed in scouts’ uniforms and wearing scouts’ badges have been collecting money allegedly on behalf of the Boy Scouts Association, and the scouts have asked for the protection which the Government are now affording them. By creating a spirit of comradeship, and breaking down class prejudices, the Boy Scouts’ movement is proving most beneficial to the youth of the Commonwealth. In a Democracy it is necessary to teach the young selfreliance, and to bring out the best that is in them. Every scout promises to do some kind act every day in his life.What better teaching could we have than that ? The scouts learn to be obedient, and they are taught discipline. It is also very necessary in a Democracy like this that the young should be taught to treat others with respect. The movement brings out the very best qualities in the boys. Therefore, without interfering with the voluntary spirit or with the splendid work the association is doing, I think the Government should give it some official recognition, while not at the same time, to use Senator Gardiner’s phrase, putting their crippling hands on it.

Labour party preach class consciousness, which is one of themost damnable things any Democracy could possibly have. They talk about brotherhood, comradeship, and the uplifting , of the working class. The whole of the community are moreor less creatures of circumstances and environ- ment.

Senator Hoare:

– The honorable senator was once a good “ red-ragger.”

Senator REID:

– I am not ashamed of it; but experience and common sense has taught me that a lot of things I once advocated are empty fads. The position was clearly explained by Senator Lynch this afternoon, when he said that it was all very well to have Socialistic ideas, but when the experiment developed to a certain stage the old Adam in human nature asserted itself; therefore one can easily understand why many of these fads have disappeared. The ruination of the State industries of Queensland has been brought about by the very men who work in those industries. The industries have not beenproperly managed; a fair return was not given for the wages received. That is the position in a nutshell.

Senator Hoare:

– Did not the woollen mills pay?

Senator REID:

– The woollen mills at Geelong did not pay. They paid only during the war time, when material fetched a high price. Sincethen they have not paid. There was not sufficient work for the mills.

The Labour party have always more or less been opposed to immigration.

Senator Hoare:

– On what grounds ?

Senator REID:

– They wish to employ everybody in the community before any immigrants are brought in.

Senator Hoare:

– Quite right, too.

Senator REID:

– That is very good in sentiment and on paper. Progress in any civilization can take place only from pressure, and it is the pressure of population that will develop Australia.No one deplores more than I do the sight of a person trying to sell his labour and ability, and being turned down every time. There is no more distressing or heartbreaking experience to a man who knows his ability, than to continue day after day looking for work, only to be turned down, and to go home to a starving wife and children: Other countries of the world are ten times worse offin respect of starvation than is Australia.

SenatorHoare. - There is no reason why we should starve here.

Senator REID:

– Australia can only be developedbyimmigration.Every immigrant that arrives in Australia has a certain amount of money, and iseager to work and. go ahead.When the pressure of population is applied throughout Australia, the hands of the State and the Commonwealth Government willbe forced. Inspite of the possibility ofsuffering caused byan influx of population, I maintain that we should bringas many immigrants as possible to Australia. ‘The best lessons we have learned have been taught through suffering. A policy of immigration will not only relieve Australia financially, but will fill the vacant lands. There is plenty of room for all in Australia. This country depends largely upon its primary products, and markets have to be found in other parts of the world for them if Australia is to be properly developed. It will be difficult for us to export our secondary products, because the high wages paid and the conditions under which they are manufactured will saddle them with such a cost that we shall be ata disadvantage in the world’s markets. If we devote our best attention to the question of secondary production and the finding of markets we. shall eventually solve the difficulty because of the quantity of raw material we possess. At the present time we haveto devote our energies mostly to primary production. Even some of our primary products are getting beyond the outside demand. We know that the markets for dried fruits are choked up. We cannot export our sugar and compete successfully with that which has been grown by coloured labour. If a largenumber of immigrants are brought to Australia it will lead to a greater consumption of our primary products, and the building up of our secondary industries in order to supply the people with the commodities they require. We have everything to gain by bringing population to the country. The Commonwealth Line of Steamers ought to provide us with cheap freights. I hope that that Line will expand and eventually control the whole of Australian shipping. We must remember that we are a long distance from the countries thatconsume our products. The Commonwealth Line of Steamers pays the highest wages and operates under the best conditions. The employees have not responded in a proper manner to the excellent treatment they have received, but on the contrary have done everything they possibly could to ruin the Line.

Senator Lynch:

– If the men do not do the fair thing there will not be a Commonwealth Line shortly.

Senator REID:

The Constitution is only twelve yearsold, but it already wants amending, and very badly. It was drafted on wrong lines. New conditions have arisen, and no means exist to deal with them. The Federal Parliament cannot deal with the most important problems confronting modern society. It cannot deal with combines and monopolies. It cannot protect the consumer from extortion, nor insure to the worker a fair and reasonable wage for his labour.

In regard to trusts, the Labour party, including these honorable senators, said -

They are the real rulers of the world. They fix. prices. They charge the people what they please for almost all the necessities of life. Daily their power grows greater.

Senator Drake-Brockman:

– That is what the Labour party said, but. the people of Australia replied, “We will not trust the Labour party with these powers for which they ask.”

Senator FINDLEY:

– Yes, they did not approve of clothing the Federal Parliament with powers for their own protection, at least they did not at that time; but if they had the opportunity to-day they would give to the Federal Parliament the powers which every State Parliament enjoys.

Senator Drake-Brockman:

– That is what you thought at that time.

Senator FINDLEY:

– And I still think it to-day. We went on to enumerate the number of trusts, combines, and monopolies in existence at that period, and we told the people there were at least thirtythree of them. We said of the sugar monopoly -

This monopoly levies toll on every man, woman, and child in Australia. All have to pay. There is no alternative.

We had a few words to say about the Shipping Combine, the Coal Vend, the Tobacco Trust, and Meat, Flour, Timber, and many other Rings. In regard to the nationalization of monopolies, which was proposal No. 6 for the alteration of the Constitution,we said -

This proposed amendment will give the Commonwealth power to purchase on just terms any business which, in the opinion of the Parliament, is a monopoly, and run it as a Commonwealth concern for the benefit of. the community.

That is what these honorable senators said then. In a moment I shall ask them what they say to-day. We said -

The people must control all monopolies in thepublic interest. … If there is to be a monopoly it is surely better that this should be run by the community for the benefit of all, than by a few for their own benefit.

SenatorReid. - The honorable senator would not say that to-day.

Senator FINDLEY:

– We say exactly the same to-day ; but Senators Pearce, Newland, Russell, and others say the reverse! They are linked up with a party which is vigorously opposed to everything for which they formerly stood. They are associated with those who. have declared against any form of Government trading, and to whom State enterprise is anathema.

Senator Pearce played a prominent part in the establishment of the Commonwealth Woollen Mills at Geelong, yet to-day he is associated with a Government which did not sell the mills, but absolutely gave them away. What they have done is a public scandal. It pained me when I read the announcement that the mills were to be sold, but no doubt it pleased the party that supports Senator Pearce, Senator Newland, Senator Lynch, and others. And undoubtedly it gave special pleasure to at least one honorable senator.

Senator Guthrie:

– Why does not Senator Findley buy some shares in the syndicate? They are available.

Senator FINDLEY:

– I shall have a word to say about Senator Guthrie in a moment or two. The mills were established in peace time because it was the Labour party’s policy; and in order to satisfy ourselves, and convince the community in general that the manufacture of woollen cloth and the making of uniforms could be undertaken in the interests of the people, a Committee was appointed in 1911, consisting of Mr. Pethebridge and Lieut. -Colonel. Legge, representing the Defence Department, and Mr. C. E. Bright and Mr. J. A. Mason, representing the Department of the Postmaster-General. These gentlemen, in their report, said -

Having fully considered the whole question, and given due weight to the views expressed by the several witnesses examined-, the Committee is of opinion that it would be a distinct advantage to the Commonwealth Service if a clothing factorywere established. The reasons which influence the Committee in forming this conclusion are as follow: -Better uniforms would be obtained at no greater, and probably less cost;uniformprices for similar garments would obtain throughout the Commonwealth; in all cases materials andworkmanship would be subjected to a standard test; Australian manufacture of material would be insured ; the labour conditions and rates of wages of employeeswould be strictly under the control of the Government; the Government, in providing for its own requirements, would be able so to arrange and regulate delivery that any inconvenience would be reduced to a minimum.

– If the mills were necessary in 1911, there is even greater necessity for them to-day. One can understand their sale by a Government who are opposed to Government enterprise, but it is hard to understand the attitude of those honorable gentlemen who formerly belonged to the Labour party. It will stand to the everlasting discredit of the Government that they disposed of a public property at an altogether insufficient price, considering the value of the plant and machinery. The Government did not proceed in a business-like way* and it ill becomes any Government to admit that they were so incompetent in coming to a decision concerning a certain tender that the ex -Minister for Trade and Customs (Mr. Massy Greene) had to interview Senator Guthrie, a supporter of the Government, for his advice as to what should be done with this property.

I now wish to refer to the composition of the present Government. Prior to the elections the Nationalist, Country, and Labour parties were in the field. The Labour party stood for a definite and distinct programme. The Nationalist party had a policy, as also did the Country party, and overtures were made by the then Leader of the Nationalist party to the Leader of the Country party, but they were turned down. The exPrime Minister (Mr. W. M. Hughes) said that unless the members of the Country party formed an alliance with the Nationalists he would unsheath his sword and fight the Country party to the death. That party refused to form an alliance,and the political battle continued. During the course of the campaign the then Federal Treasurer (Mr. Bruce) had a few complimentary words to say concerning the Country party and their capacity to govern this country. Speaking at Maryborough, in Victoria, he said -

– In the GovernorGeneral’s Speech there is a paragraph stating that the Government intend appointing a Royal Commission to investigate allegations made in regard to a certain contract entered into in connexion with the erection of War Service Homes. I know something about two or three contracts, but as this particular contract has not been specified I shall postpone the remarks I desire to make on that subject. Serious criticism has been levelled against that Department from time to time. The Royal Commission, we are informed, is not to be a roving Commission. I do not want the Commission to wander all over Australia, but I think that some of the statements contained in an article which appeared in the Argus a short while ago are so serious and so startling that the Commission ought to inquire into their correctness or incorrectness. This. article dealt with the War Service Homes Commission (Disposals Board) Bulk Stores, an institution on the South Wharf. It states -

Mystery is tire dominant- note of the institution. How or by whom its contents were collected is one of its most jealously guarded secrets. What prices were paid for the strange things it contains will probably never be known, not, at any rate, if the responsible officials can possibly prevent it.

It goes on to show what some of these exhibits are,- arid continues -

When the buying frenzy was at its height one manufacturer received an order for over 1,500 of a special plumber’s brass fitting. Knowing it was a line not allowed by tlie Metropolian Board ,of Works, he interviewed the Department and mildly suggested that fifteen, and not 1,500, would be sufficient. He -» was told that the Department knew its own business best, and the order must be filled. The citizens of Australia still own these fittings.

There at least was an honest manufacturer, but when he told the Department that the article would not be in accordance with the regulations of the Board of Works and suggested that he should supply fifteen, he was told to mind his own business, and supply 1,500. The article goes on to say -

There is another strange line to be found at the stores. On a notice-board where the list of material is displayed is one notification referring to cement wash troughs. Across it is the significant announcement, “ Not approved by Metropolitan Board.” These troughs were made to order of reinforced concrete, and cost about 40s. each. Their exact number cannot be ascertained, but there were several hundreds of them, and they were ordered and made with outlets smaller than the Metropolitan Board will allow. They cannot be altered, and they cannot be used anywhere in Melbourne.

Senator Lynch:

– Were the accounts passed for payment?

Senator FINDLEY:

– Yes. The article continues -

There is one interesting exhibit that comes under the heading of “Damp course, ls. a roll.” This damp-proof course is one of the most important parts of. a home. . . . The material in question was manufactured in Melbourne from paper felt, saturated with tar, and was used in the soldiers’ homes. … A builder’s comment was to the effect that a black line painted on the wall would be as effective. . . . There were other lines in sewerage brassware that had an interesting history, and might have ‘been bought, at a very reasonable price had not the Metropolitan Board of Works been disagreeable about allowing them to be used. It is stated that they were eventually sold as scrap brass.

In regard to. timber, the article says -

So far as the timber is concerned, the fact that dressed weatherboards are offered at the Stores for 10s. per 100 lineal feet, while the price of good quality boards from the merchants is 20s. to 21s.’ per 100, would indicate that either the Disposals Board is very generous, or that the goods are not quite of firstclass quality. … It is quite interesting to inspect this particular line, as it offers the most extraordinary contortions of which the timber which has been machined green is capable.

Apparently there were thousands of pounds’ worth of material in that exhibition that now have little or no value. The Government ought to make the closest inquiry into some, at least, of these allegations. They ought to find out by whom the material was ordered, and from whom it was purchased. Apparently orders were given haphazardly, by men who did not understand their business; otherwise the materials would not have been rejected by the Metropolitan Board of Works. Everybody knows that builders have to comply with certain health regulations, regulations of the Metropolitan Board of Works and other institutions. If those regulations are not complied with, then the materials, no matter what they cost, are not permitted to be used in a building. It is necessary that those regulations should “be enforced. These people apparently did not care what sort of order they gave, and would not accept advice from men who knew their business. The name of the officer who was advised to order fifteen, and not 1,500, brass fittings, ought to be ascertained. I hope, that the Royal Commission will be given the opportunity to go into this and other matters that are of moment to the taxpayers of Australia.

Senator Lynch:

– A lot was said regarding” the War Service Homes, and particularly the Minister in charge of the Department, which had no foundation in fact.

Senator FINDLEY:

– I am not Collcerned about that. I am not making an attack upon the Minister or anybody else. I am quoting statements which appeared in the Argus respecting exhibits in that institution in the South Wharf. According to the article, the institution itself is wrapped in mystery.

– But if the election had been held, as elections formerly were held, in the autumn, both branches of the Legislature would have met about the same time, which would have been a much more business-like arrangement. I hope there will be no departure from the Constitution in future, and that the wishes of the people will be respected by not holding an election in the last month of the year.

The Government have a long programme. I do not believe, and neither do they, that they will be able to carry it through. It will be a. matter of impossibility. However, we shall play our! part in the discussion of measures brought forward. We shall criticise them when it is necessary to do so. We shall support those measures we deem worthy of support. But at all times we shall do our level best to strengthen our position, both within this Parliament and - outside. We are satisfied that whether the present Government remains in power for a short period only or for the whole term of this Parliament, the longer it holds office as a composite Ministry the stronger will our position grow, both within this Parliament and outside. We are satisfied, also, that when the next appeal to the people takes place, we shall com© into our own again and have a majority in both Chambers. We shall be what we were in the past, a force and power in Federal politics, and the legislation we shall enact when the administration of affairs is again intrusted to our hands will be for the advancement of Australia, and the happiness and betterment .of the majority of its citizens.

Debate (on motion by Senator Kingsmill) adjourned!

page 920

ADJOURNMENT

Bird of Paradise Plumage

Motion (by Senator Pearce) pro posed -

That the House do now adjourn.

Senator DUNCAN:
New South Wales

– Two years ago, the Government of Australia decided that traffic in the plumage of birds of paradise was to cease, and they have since taken strong measures to suppress what we may call this nefarious trade. I was rather surprised, therefore, to notice in an article in the Melbourne Argus, that one of the leading actresses, in a theatrical show called “ Rockets,” appears on the stage wearing bird of paradise plumage in her head-dress. This lady’s attire occasions a great deal of comment among those who witness the performance, and I should like to know whether it is a fact that members of the theatrical profession can obtain permission to wear plumage that others are forbidden to wear. Is there any way- in which members of that profession can get behind the law, as it were, and take advantage of the good nature of a Minister, or his desire to assist a theatrical performance of this sort? I suppose that numbers of women are not yet educated to a standard that will enable them to realize the brutality entailed in obtaining these feathers, and there are many of them who desire to wear them. But this they are forbidden by the law of the Commonwealth to do, and I think the Government should also insist that people engaged in the theatrical profession, who appear nightly decked in this plumage, should be called upon to offer some explanation as to how they have become possessed of these forbidden feathers.

Senator GRANT:
NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– Would the Minister when replying be good enough to indicate whether the killing of birds of paradise seriously interferes with the numbers of these birds in New Guinea?

Senator PEARCE:
Minister for Home and Territories · Western Australia · NAT

– If, tomorrow, honorable senators will supply me with proofs of their remarks, I shall bring both questions under the notice of the Minister for . Trade and Customs.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Senate adjourned at 10.45 p.m.

Cite as: Australia, Senate, Debates, 11 July 1923, viewed 22 October 2017, <http://historichansard.net/senate/1923/19230711_senate_9_103/>.

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Senate11 July 1923

PAPERS

QUESTION

MIDLAND RAILWAY COMPANY

Senator NEEDHAM:WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Senator PEARCE:Minister of Home and Territories · WESTERN AUSTRALIA · NAT

QUESTION

TYPEWRITERS AND SILENCERS

Senator GRANT:NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

Senator WILSON:Honorary Minister · SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

QUESTION

CURE FOR DIABETES

Senator DUNCAN:NEW SOUTH WALES

Senator WILSON:NAT

Senator GRANT:NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

Senator PEARCE:NAT

QUESTION

EIDMAN-MAYOH CASE

Senator GLASGOW:for Senator FOLL

Senator PEARCE:NAT

NORTHERN TERRITORY ORDINANCE

Senator GARDINER:NEW SOUTH WALES

LEAVE OF ABSENCE

NORTHERN TERRITORYCROWN LANDS BILL

QUESTION

GOVERNOR-GENERAL’S SPEECH: ADDRESS-IN-REPLY

Senator LYNCH:Western Australia

Senator Duncan:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator McDougall:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator McHugh:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Hoare:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator McDougall:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Hoare:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator McDougall:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator McDougall:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Mcdougall:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator Hoare:

Senator LYNCH:

Senator GRAHAM:Western Australia

Senator Reid:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator Pearce:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator Pearce:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator Drake-Brockman:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator Drake-Brockman:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator Gardiner:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator Thompson:

Senator GRAHAM:

Senator Guthrie:

Senator Drake-Brockman:

Senator ELLIOTT:VICTORIA

Senate
11 July 1923

Senator NEEDHAM:
WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Senator PEARCE:
Minister of Home and Territories · WESTERN AUSTRALIA · NAT

Senator GRANT:
NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

Senator WILSON:
Honorary Minister · SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

Senator DUNCAN:
NEW SOUTH WALES

Senator WILSON:
NAT

Senator GRANT:
NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

Senator PEARCE:
NAT

Senator GLASGOW:
for Senator FOLL

Senator PEARCE:
NAT

Senator GARDINER:
NEW SOUTH WALES

Senator LYNCH:
Western Australia

Senator GRAHAM:
Western Australia

Senator ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA

Senator McHUGH:
South Australia