House of Representatives
30 June 1938

15^th Parliament · 1^st Session

QUESTION
- TRADE PACT WITH JAPAN
QUESTION
- SERVICE PENSIONS
QUESTION
- PETROL TAX
FEDERAL CAPITAL TERRITORY
- Ordinances and Awards
QUESTION
- MARKETING OF AUSTRALIAN WOOL
QUESTION
- FURTHER ISSUE OF CROWN PIECES
PAPERS
OUT GLASS INDUSTRY
QUESTION
- YAMPI SOUND IRON ORE DEPOSITS
QUESTION
- NON-OFFICIAL POST OFFICES
QUESTION
- OVERSEAS AIR-MAIL SERVICE
QUESTION
- STABILIZATION OF WHEAT INDUSTRY
QUESTION
- NATIONAL HEALTH AND PENSIONS INSURANCE
QUESTION
- MEDICAL RESEARCH FUND
QUESTION
- MANUFACTURE OF MOTOR-CAR ENGINES
QUESTION
- AUTOMATIC TELEPHONE EXCHANGE FOR RYDE DISTRICT
QUESTION
- MANUFACTURE OF AIRCRAFT IN AUSTRALIA
QUESTION
- COAL FREIGHTS
QUESTION
- MANUFACTURE OF DEFENCE EQUIPMENT
QUESTION
- FORCED AEROPLANE LANDING BYTHE MINISTER FOR DEFENCE
NATIONAL HEALTH AND PENSIONS INSURANCE BILL 1938
QUESTION
- PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE
EMPIRE AIR SERVICE ( ENGLAND TO AUSTRALIA) BILL 1938
- Second Reading
NATIONAL HEALTH AND PENSIONS INSURANCE BILL 1938
TARIFF PROPOSALS 1938
- Excise Tariff Amendment (No. 1) 1937-1938
- In Committee of Ways and Means:
- Ordered -
EXCISE TARIFF 1938
GENEVA CONVENTION BILL 1938
- Second Reading
PASSPORTS BILL 1938
INCOME TAX COLLECTION BILL 1938
DAIRY PRODUCE EXPORT CONTROL BILL 1938
DRIED FRUITS EXPORT CONTROL BILL 1938
- Second Reading
MEAT EXPORT CONTROL BILL 1938
- Second Reading
CANNED FRUITS EXPORT CONTROL BILL 1938
- Second Reading
CANNED FRUITS EXPORTS CHARGES BILL 1938
- Second Reading
CITRUS FRUITS BOUNTY BILL 1938
- Second Reading
ASSENT TO. BILLS
BILLS RETURNED FROM THE SENATE
SUPPLEMENTARY APPROPRIATION BILL 1936-37:
- Second Reading
BILLS RETURNED FROM THE SENATE
SPECIAL ADJOURNMENT
LEAVE OF ABSENCE TO ALL
MEMBERS
ADJOURNMENT
ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS
- Defence: Questioning of Departmental Officers
- Standardization of Railway Gauges
- Windsor Telephone Exchange

Mr. Speaker (Hon. G. J. Bell) took the chairat 11 a.m., and read prayers.

page 2958

QUESTION

TRADE PACT WITH JAPAN

Mr JOHN LAWSON:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

– Is the Prime Minister able to say whether the signing of a trade pact with Japan for one year is contemplated by the Government, and can he inform the House of any details of any such proposed pact?

Mr LYONS:
Prime Minister · WILMOT, TASMANIA · UAP

– Obviously I am not able to announce any of the details until complete agreement has been reached. The Government is optimistic concerning the reaching of an agreement at ahearly date.

page 2958

QUESTION

SERVICE PENSIONS

Mr WARD:
EAST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

– On the 12th May last I asked the Minister representing the Minister for Repatriation as to whether consideration would be given to a request to amend the provisions of the Repatriation Act, relating to the pension rights of the wives and children of service pensioners, in order to bring them into line with those provided in the case of the wives and children of the recipients of war pensions. The ‘honorable gentleman replied that (be matter would be referred to the’ Minister for Repatriation for his, consideration. Has the matter yet been considered ? If so, what is the decision of the department?

Mr THOMPSON:
Minister without portfolio, assisting the Treasurer · NEW ENGLAND, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

– I have not yet received a reply from the Minister for Repatriation. I shall again take the matter up with him and ascertain the reason for the delay.

page 2958

QUESTION

PETROL TAX

Non-road-usino Taxpayers.

Mr FRANCIS:
MORETON, QUEENSLAND

– On the 22nd June

I asked the Treasurer if he would communicate with the States to ascertain how each State had expended its portion of the special grant of £600,000 a year which was designed to assist nonroadusing payers of the petrol tax. Has the honorable gentleman yet been able tocom- municate with the States? If so, has he received any replies? If not, willhe advise me during the recess?

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · CORIO, VICTORIA · UAP

page 2959

PAPERS

The following papers were presented : -

Customs Act - Regulations amended - Statutory Rules 1938, No. 05.

Defence Act - Royal Military College - Report for 1937 .

Post and Telegraph Act - Regulations amended - Statutory Rules 1938, No. 55.

Nauru - Ordinance of 1938 - No. 2 - Provident Fund.

Arbitration (Public Service) Act - Determination by the Arbitrator, &c. - No. 17 of 1938 - Commonwealth Public Service Clerical Association.

Northern Territory Acceptance Act and Northern Territory (Administration) Act - Ordinances of 1938-

No. 8 - Roads.

No. 9 - Mining.

Scat of Government Acceptance Act and Seat of Government (Administration) Act - Ordinance of 1938- No. 23 - Education.

OVERSEAS AIR-MAIL SERVICE

Internal Distribution

Mr SPENDER:
WARRINGAH, NEW SOUTH WALES

– Will the Minister for Defence state what re-organization, if any, has been made with respect to the internal air-mail . services which are to be ancillary to the overseas service? If any re-organization has been made what companies are involved, and what is the estimated additional cost?

Mr THORBY:
Minister for Defence · CALARE, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

-I made a fairly full explanation of this matter when dealing with the Empire air-mail agreement yesterday. Although it is not. actually covered by the agreements in the bill now before the House,I explained that the Government had decided, and that arrangements have been completed with the exception of a few final details which are awaiting the passage of the bill, in favour of the distribution of the South Australian mails from Darwin to Adelaide, the Western Australian mails from Darwin to Perth, . the Victorian mails from Adelaide on to Melbourne, and the Tasmanian mails from Melbourne direct. This arrangement will enable the mail’s to be distributed in every capital city approximately within an hour on the same afternoon or evening. I cannot very well make available until the bill is passed and the agreements with the respective companies are finalized, information in regard to the cost. Three different companies will probably be involved.

Mr HAWKER:
WAKEFIELD, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

– Can the Minister for Defence say, what arrangements are being made for the continuation: of some of the old ancillary inland air services, such as those from Charleville. to Daly Waters a nd Cootamundra to Charleville? If those particular services are not to be continued, arc arrangements being made to transfer the contracts to some other service in connexion with which they would be useful?

Mr THORBY:

– The plan to which the Government is working provides for the alteration of certain air routes. For example, the air route through to Cootamundra will no longer be necessary, in view of the fact that the mails will be distributed through two other channels, but the operating company will be invited to take over another route which will absorb its organization. The same may be said of the route from Brisbane through to Darwin. As the flying boat service will in future provide for the traffic between these two bases, it is proposed that this internal service shall be diverted at . Daly Waters through to Wyndham. Every effort isbeing made to utilize the existing services. The operating companies have been asked to vary their routes as may be necessary to keep their machines fully engaged.

page 2960

QUESTION

STABILIZATION OF WHEAT INDUSTRY

Mr WILSON:
WIMMERA, VICTORIA

– Can the Acting Minister for Commerce state whether the Government has taken any action in the direction of speeding up in the matter of providing some stability for the wheat industry?

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:
Minister without portfolio assisting the Minister for Commerce · BARKER, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · CP

– In this connexionI have nothing to add to the very full and complete statement that I made on a motion for the adjournment of the House last week.

MANUFACTURE OF AIRCRAFT IN AUSTRALIA

Sir HENRY GULLETT:

– Will the

Minister for Defence inform the House of the terms upon which the Commonwealth Aircraft Manufacturing Company is manufacturing aircraft for the Defence Department? I should like information as to prices, &c.

Mr THORBY:
CP

– A definite contract has been placed with this company for 40 aircraft of the N.A.33 type at a competitive price in relation to imported machines of similar type. A further order will be placed later for 60 or 70 additional machines to be delivered, at intervals, over a specified period. I cannot give the honorable member detailed information as to the price of the 40 machines already definitely ordered, but it is very satisfactory.

NATIONAL HEALTH AND PENSIONS INSURANCE BILL 1938

Bill returned from the Senate, with amendments; and a message intimating that it had agreed to the bill as amended by the House, at the request of the Senate.

Ordered -

That the foregoing message be taken into consideration, in committee of the whole House at a later hour this day.

page 2962

QUESTION

PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE

Proposals for the Erection of a New Hospital and Gaol at Darwin,

NORTHERN Territory.

Mr McEWEN:
Minister for the Interior · Indi · CP

– I move -

That in accordance with the provisions of the Commonwealth Public Works Committee Act 1913-1936, the following proposed work be referred to the Parliamentary Standing Committee on Public Works for investigation and report: - Darwin, Northern Territory - Erection of hospital.

It is proposed that a new hospital shall be erected on a site bounded by McKaystreet, Lambell-terrace and Kahlin Beach. This site is at present used as an aboriginal compound, but will be vacated as such when the new compound is available. The existing hospital buildings are situated on a site which is too restricted to permit of their expansion on planned lines. The buildings are unsuitable and incapable of being remodelled or added to. With a daily average of 40 inpatients, the hospital is overcrowded, and there is no margin for an epidemic, prevalence of disease, or influx of population. There are no private wards, and practically no facilities for the segregation of white and coloured patients. The accommodation for staff and other facilities is also unsatisfactory and inadequate. Owing to the growth of military, naval and aerial activities, the matter of hospital accommodation at Darwin is one of urgency.

The proposed hospital, which has been designed, after investigations in Darwin, Java and Singapore, to conform with the principles of tropical architecture, will consist of four ward blocks, children’s ward, two isolation blocks, administrative block, X-ray block and operating theatre, medical officers’, matron’s, sisters’ and nurses’ quarters, kitchen block, ambulance station, laundry, garages and services.

The buildings, it is proposed, shall be laid out on a cruciform type at the correct angle to take advantage of the prevailing winds. Construction will be of concrete and fibre-cement with fibrocement adjustable louvres on the outside walls and fibro-cement roofing. A commencement has already been made with the isolation blocks, which are being erected urgently at a cost of £7,890 to take cases now unsuitably housed.

Thescheme provides for 131 beds, comprising 106 in four main wards, nine in the children’s ward, and sixteen inthe isolation blocks. In emergency, this number of beds could be increased by using the verandahs and, by adding a story to each of the main wards, a further 106 beds could be accommodated. The present intention is that approximately 100 beds should be provided for initially. The approximate cost of the complete scheme, excluding equipment, some of which is available from the existing hospital, is £85,000.

I lay on the table plans, &c., in connexion with the proposed work.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Mr McEWEN:
Minister for the Interior · Indi · CP

– by leave - I move -

That in accordance with the provisions of the Commonwealth Public Works Committee Act 1913-1936, the following proposed work be referred to the Parliamentary Standing Committee on Public Works for investigation and report: - Darwin, Northern Territory - Erection of gaol.

It is proposed to erect a gaol on a site comprising 160 acres, which is portion of section 2, hundred of Bagot. The existing gaol is situated in the vicinity of the civil aerodrome. The buildings being on high ground to the north-west of the landing ground interfere with the landing of overseas planes, and those taking off during the north-west season. The buildings are unsatisfactory for the purposes of a gaol, being badly ventilated and unsuitable for the climate. The yard enclosure is too small, and creates difficulties in segregating white and aboriginal prisoners. The surrounding galvanized iron wall is in a bad state of repair, and ineffective as a barrier.

The proposed site for the new gaol is favorably located about 4½ miles from Darwin and, whilst it is easily accessible, it is out of sight of, and away from the main roads. The scheme includes the following buildings: -

Administrative block.

Remand, first offenders’ and debtors’ block.

White prisoners’ block.

Aboriginal prisoners’ block.

Hospital block.

Medical inspection block.

Kitchen, garages block.

Worksheds, stores, &c., block.

Boundary wall.

Covered ways, watchtower.

Patrol-trackways, &c.

The accommodation provided for is -

White prisoners - 17.

Aboriginal prisoners - 98.

The buildings have been designed according to principles adopted after investigating similar establishments in other places, particularly at Changi, Singapore, where a new prison has recently been erected. The construction will be of reinforced concrete with steel doors, grilles, &c., and the outer verandah walls of the prison block will be composed of concrete posts, adjustable fibro-cement louvres, and expanding metal screen;. The estimatedcost is £42,000.

I lay on the table plans, &c, in connexion with the proposed work.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

page 2963

EMPIRE AIR SERVICE ( ENGLAND TO AUSTRALIA) BILL 1938

Second Reading

Debate resumed from the 29th June (vide page 2811). on motion by Mr. Thorby -

That the bill be now read a second time.

Mr FORDE:
Capricornia

.This is a bill to which the Opposition intends to give its general support. I intend, however, to interrogate the Minister for Defence (Mr. Thorby) on the various aspects of the measure. It is a bill to ratify and authorize agreements which have been made between the Government of the United Kingdom and the Government of the Commonwealth of Australia, and between the Government, of the Commonwealth of Australia and Qantas Empire Airways Limited, to bring Australia into the Empire air-mail scheme giving Australia, an air service between Southampton and Sydney, which will, in the initial stages, take nineanda half days, a period which is subsequently to be shortened to seven and a half days. While the Opposition agrees that it is a great step in national progress to link England and Australia by an efficient, a ir service; the Government cannot be congratulated either on. the manner in which it has dealt, with this important subject, or on bringing down a measure, which is of such importance to Australia, in thedying hours of the session without giving honorable members sufficient time to study the whole of the ramifications of the bill, which consists of 22 pages of very small type. It is absolutely impossible’ for anybody to give that close study which is warranted by the importance of’ the measure. The second-reading speech of the Minister was made only yesterday. The Government’s action in respect of this measure, however, is in keeping . with its legislative actions for some time.. It takes months, and sometimes years, for the Government to make up its mind on an important matter and, when a certain course is decided, the legislation is brought before Parliament and forced through, sometimes with the aid of the guillotine, without allowing members the opportunity for the constru ctive criticism that is so essential to efficient legislation. They have been told by the Minister that this agreement has been entered into.

Mr Thorby:

-Subject to ratification by Parliament.

Mr FORDE:

– I agree, but the attitude of the Government when such agreements are put before Parliament is “ Take it or leave it “. When the Ottawa Agreement was placed before Parliament for ratification, we. were told that it could not be amended. It had to be accepted, asa. whole; otherwise the whole of the negotiations that had led to the agreement would have to be re-opened. In bringing down this bill the Minister for Defencesaid that, instead of being subjected to criticism, the Government should be complimented on what it had done. That is where I join issue with the honorable gentleman because I have no doubt that the action of the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Curtin), in moving the adjournment of the House on this subject recently, expedited the finality of certain aspects of the distribution of the mails after they arrive in . Australia, because there was a good deal of apprehension as to what wasto happen-

Mr Thorby:

– Only in the press.

Mr FORDE:

-No definite pronouncement had been made by the Minister.

Mr Thorby:

– The plans had been in operation for months.

Mr FORDE:

– I shall deal with that, aspect. Not only honorable members 011 this side, but also honorable members opposite, have seen fit to criticize the Government’s lack of decision in this matter. On the 7th June, the honorable member, for Henty (Sir Henry Gullett). speaking on the adjournment motion moved by the Leader of the Opposition, said -

It is fifteen months sinceI left the Ministry and evenwhen I was a Minister I was heartily ashamed ‘of the delay in the inauguration of the overseas air-mail service. Since then that delay of which I was ashamed has gone on for another fifteen months. The Minister for Defence is not responsible for all of it, but the matter seems to be dragging on as hopelessly to-day as it was two years ago. I cannot for a moment understand why there should be delay in the making of a plain statement as to how the mails will be distributed after they arrive at Darwin.

The honorable gentleman’s comments were typical of the criticism of some honorable gentlemen opposite.

The overseas air-mail service has been the subject of a great deal of propaganda for a number of years. Promises and. assurances were given by various Ministers of the governments that have been led by the right honorable member for Wilmot (Mr. Lyons). In December, 1935, Senator Sir George Pearce, who was then Minister for External Affairs and the Leader of the Government in another place, commenting upon certain aspects of the Imperial Airways Service, said that the new flying-boat service would be started at a very early date. In September, 1936, the then Minister for Defence, Sir Archdale Parkhill, said that the Commonwealth Government “will now proceed to finality with the air-mail agreement “. That was 21 months ago. Speaking as the Acting Prime Minister on the 27th May, 1937, the right honorable member for Cowper (Sir Earle Page) said -

I am gratified that the long negotiations between the governments of the United- Kingdom and Australia regarding the Empire Air Mail have resulted in agreement on all points which had originally been at issue. The scheme will he put into operation in January I0HS.

Sir Archdale Parkhill, on the 24th August, 1937, in reply to a question, said -

It is hoped, that consideration of. thu air agreement will lie completed at a comparatively early date.

This shows that the Government in ‘the last two or three years has not known where it has stood. One day one Minister would say something and the next another would say something else. In February, 1936, tho Sydney Morning Herald, in a leading article, said -

The whole conduct of the administration has been from the outset characterized by ignorance and a lack of imagination.

Mr THORBY:
CP

– Thai was because the Sydney Morning Herald could not get the inside story that it wanted.

Mr FORDE:

– The honorable gentleman is at liberty to attribute motives to that newspaper, but I am not aware of them. .1 take it that that was a fair statement from a newspaper that is noted for its constant support of the Government on political issues. From time to time other newspapers have commented on the delay. On the 9 th June last the Sydney Morning Herald said -

In every detail of preparation for performance the Government has so procrastinated as to induce the suspicion that it does not want the agreement. The Government has rebutted every inquiry, and has. exhibited an indifference. ‘and an inertia that; lias become scandalous.

The delivery of the mails in the Commonwealth is an integral part of the scheme. This is another matter in which the public has had grave doubts “as to the ability of the . Ministry. On the 8th August, 1935, the then Minister for Defence (Sir Archdale Parkhill) :said -

That the existing internal land -plane route front Darwin to the south must be maintained and improved.

On the 9th December, 1937, Sir Archdale Parkhill wrote a letter to the Leader of the Opposition, in which he said: -

The question of the rearrangement of the internal routing of the overseas mails has udt yet been considered.

Before that letter wai written the publicity branch of the Prime Minister’s Department issued a statement .on the “‘Record of the Lyons Government”, in which it referred to the Imperial Airways Service, and said -

It was decided to reorganise and develop internal subsidized air services to connect them to the main trunk ‘services:

According to the present Minister for Defence (Mr. Thorby.) it was clear that u]) to the 4th June, 1938, the Government had not seriously considered internal services. According to the Sydney Morning Herald on the 4th June, 1938, the Minister for Defence said -

Probably in the early stages all mail will bc carried to Sydney and bc distributed from there instead of from- Darwin.

Mr Thorby:

– On a basis to be agreed upon. . We have taken the precaution to insert in theagreement a provision which will enable the Government of the day to enter, into further agreements with the company to. have new planes constructed in Australia or to have any heavy repair work undertaken in this country. That has been done in order to give our own workmenemployment, and the Commonwealth is prepared to bear a proportion of the increased cost.

Mr.Patterson. - It is a subsidy to an Australian industry.

Mr FORDE:

– The honorable member cannot catch me in that way. Ibelieve in keeping all. the work within Australia that it. is possible to’ do, but if an organizationwhich is making profits finds it necessary to carry out repairs in . Australia, why should it be given a subsidy for that purpose? Why should the Commonwealth assist the company because rates of wages and livingcosts are higher in the Commonwealth than in the United Kingdom? If ‘that be done in this case, couldwe’refuse the wheat-growers- a subsidy because’ they find’ that the cost of harvesting their crop in Australia is greater than in other countries?

Mr Thorby:

– The . real reason is because no duty is to be imposed on the importation of these flying boats or their parts. The principle has been accepted in this country for many years that a bounty . or a subsidy may be paid to an industry if it be found that it will result in additional employment for Australian workmen.

Mr FORDE:

– True; it failed at that point, but otherwise it covered itself. Qantas naturally desired to do the same thing. Nevertheless, I urge that arrangements should be made as soon as possible to service within this country the flying boats on our part of the route. That does not mean that I in any sense suggest that the craft will not be adequately serviced by Imperial Airways’ engineers, or not be expertly flown by Imperial Airways’ crews; but obviously men will find it difficult to take the same pride in the aircraft of another company as they take in their own. It is desirable also that the craft to be used in this service should bc confined as far as practicable to uniform climatic conditions. This will contribute to efficiency. A wide variety of conditions will be experienced on the complete route from the United Kingdom to Australia, and I think it will be generally agreed that aircraft which are confined to the conditions known to predominate in a given section of the route are likely to give better service than machines which would have to meet the great variety of conditions of the whole route. Moreover, mechanics dealing with machines on certain sections of the route will be able to service them more effectively, and will have, a more intimate knowledge of them, than they could possibly have of machines travelling over the whole route.

I do not call into question, in any respect, the ability of the officials and men of the Qantas and Imperial Airways to co-operate in the fullest possible degree. On the occasion of ray recent journey from Australia to England I saw something of the spirit of co-operation that exists. I did not hear one Qantas official criticize one Imperial Airways official or vice versa. But if anything should go wrong with a machine on a certain section of the journey, it would be only human for the engineers of one company to suggest that those of the other company are responsible. Regarding the spirit of co-operation already existing between the two organizations, I well remember that in flying between Penang and Singapore we entered a storm which frightened the life out of me. When we landed at Darwin Captain Lester Brain, of Qantas, said to me “ I am sorry that I cannot spend the afternoon with you ; but I am taking a spare tyre to Penang in the DH86.” I knew that the journey involved travelling through 250 miles of storm, yet this official took it as a matter of course in order to assist the officials of Imperial Airways.

One feature of this proposed service which disturbs nic is that the mail matter which will come to Australia from the United Kingdom will carry no surcharge, whereas that which goes from Australia to the United Kingdom will bear a surcharge of 3d. a half ounce. I also appreciate the difficulty of our postal authorities in connexion with this matter. If the surcharge were lifted from air-mail matter from Australia to Great Britain, undoubtedly an agitation would quickly arise for the lifting of the surcharge from internal air-mail matter. Of the total cost of £130,000 a year for this service, about £70,000 will be collected by surcharges, so naturally the abolition of the surcharge would tremendously increase the cost of the service to the Government, and the abolition of surcharge for internal services which would have to. follow would be an even greater expense. Obviously, however, a greater bulk of airmail matter will come into Australia at the I4d. rate than will go out of it at the 5d. rate, for people are naturally a little parsimonious in these matters. It may be said that the reduced tonnage of outward air-mail matter will make more room for passengers, but if so many hundred people travel from Australia to England by this service, approximately the same number will make the return journey, unless the expedient of reduced fares for the outward journey is adopted. As things are, it seems to me that a considerable waste of pay load is probable. I realize the financial difficulties which have faced the Government, but it seems to me to be .inevitable that before very long the surcharge on outward mail matter will have to be discontinued. We should, therefore, make up our minds at once to bear the additional cost. After all, two-penny postage has been justified by saying increased postal facilities are now being paid for out of revenue, and have in fact been paid for in this way during the last few years, loan money not being available for the purpose. If the Government abolished the surcharge it would still have a very considerable margin of profit on the operations of the whole department. For this reason it would, in my opinion, be justified in taking the course that I am advocating.

The Deputy Leader of the Opposition made another point upon which I am at variance with him. He said that the imperial air-mail service really only interested commercial firms doing business in England, and people who have relatives and friends abroad to whom they write regularly. That, I submit, leaves out of account a very important factor. The reduction of travelling time between Australia and countries overseas must benefit not only our business interests, but also all the cultural business and social activities of Australian life. One of the great handicaps from which Australian professional and business men, medical practitioners, artists and leaders of our cultural life suffer, is their separation from kindred interests overseas. Our people definitely suffer in consequence of their lack of personal contacts overseas. When it becomes possible for professional and business men, educationalists and industrial leaders to make quick journeys abroad to keep in touch with new thoughts and methods it will be immeasurably to the benefit of Australia as a whole. For this reason, I feci that the observations of the Deputy Le ad el* of the Opposition concerning the probable advantages of this service showed a lack of adequate appreciation.

Like that honorable gentleman, however, I feel that this is an appropriate opportunity upon which to pay tribute to Qantas. Australians have every reason to be proud of the romantic growth of many of their industries, and also of the outstanding careers of many of our citizens in various professions and commercial undertakings, but I do not think a greater romance has occurred in the history of Australian enterprises than that of the development of the Qantas Empire Airways.

Mr Beasley:

– Does the honorable member consider that Australia has properly treated its notable pioneer aviators?

Mr FAIRBAIRN:

– Probably the Chair would consider that I waa departing from the provisions of the bill if I discussed that subject at any length, but I may in passing point out, with the indulgence of Mr. Speaker, that the fact that an individual has shown himself to be a wonderful aerial explorer does not necessarily make it easy to fit him into civil activities or public life. I have the greatest admiration for the wonderful work of our aerial explorers but, in some cases, their very virtues and extraordinary fearlessness in attempting great feats have made it difficult to fit them into the ordinary walks of life. We must all have regretted that some of these airmen have been obliged, for financial reasons, to engage in hazardous flights which were not of real value. Speaking in general terms it may be said that the governments of Australia, according to the prosperity of the times in which they have been’ in power, have accorded our aerial explorers very considerable support.

People are apt, at times, to complain that Australia does not provide facilities for aviators comparable with those available in the United States of America; but it must be remembered that although our air routes are as far flung as those of the United States of America, they serve only about 7,000,000 people, whereas those of the United States of America serve between 110,000,000 and 120,000,000 people who are among the wealthiest in the world. Having travelled ‘over the back country air routes of Australia I have felt called upon, again and again, to pay tribute to the magnificent work done by our civil aviation authorities in making these routes so safe with the limited money at their disposal. I have flown right across the northern parts of this continent over to Broome, crossing some of the most rugged country in the world, and I have seldom been more than 30 miles from an .emergency landing ground, yet on one occasion, when I flew up the Rhine in Germany in thick fog, my eyes nearly popped out of. ray head looking for landing grounds. At one stage of the journey I flew a distance of 150 miles in which there was only one landing ground. Probably if I had deviated 20 or 30 miles on either side of the route that I was taking I might have seen emergency landing grounds. When the difficult conditions of this country are considered in relation to the amount of money available for aerial developmental work, it must bo admitted that those closely identified with civil aviation have done a remarkably good job.

Sitting suspended from 12.%.5 to 2.15 p.m.

Mr FAIRBAIRN:

– I propose to conclude my remarks by giving a short sketch of the remarkable record of Qantas, which is of interest because the company is the Australian agent to carry out this agreement. The company was formed in 1920 by Mr. Hudson Fysh and Mr. T. J. Mcinnes, two flying corps officers, who had returned from the war. They commenced a taxi service between the Longreach rail-head and the Winton rail-head, with two war-time aeroplanes purchased from the Government. In 1922, the Government of the day gave them their first subsidized route between Charleville and Cloncurry, a route of 577 miles. In 1925 this route was extended to Mr Isa and Camooweal. The route flown then became825 miles. In 1927 a branch line from Cloncurry to Normanton was established, bringing the number of miles flown to 1,040. In 1928 the Cloncurry flying doctor service, which has since become famous, was established by the Australian Inland Mission with transport provided by Qantas. Qantas has been carrying out the flying doctor service ever since. In 1929 the company extended its route from Charleville to Brisbane, making the total number of miles flown 1,484. An interesting point in the growth of this company is that, unlike the usual transport companies which generally start from the city and work out, Qantas started from the bush and worked in to the city. It has developed from a bush company to an international service. In 1930 Qantas pilots had completed 1,000,000 miles of flying. In 1931 Qantas co-operated with Imperial Airways in an experimental service from the United Kingdom to Australia. By 1934 the number of miles flown by Qantas aeroplanes had increased to 2,477,000, entirely free of fatalities to the passengers. In 1934, when the BrisbaneSingapore service was permanently established, the Qantas Company ended its fourteenth year of existence. Its record was recognized then as one of the most outstanding in the world in air transport. It is certainly an outstanding chapter in the history of Australian aviation. In 1934 Qantas became Qantas Empire Airways and the company initiated its service to Singapore, which it has been flying ever since, until its aeroplanes have flown 3,100,000 miles between Singapore and Australia. They have flown over the Timor Sea 576 times.

Mr. SPEAKER (Hon. G. J. Bell).I am afraid that the interesting history of Qantas has nothing to do with this bill.

Mr FAIRBAIRN:

– I submit that it has to do with this bill to the extent that I am dealing with the record of an agent of the Commonwealth Government. To show how efficient the Qantas company has been is surely to indicate the good fortune of the people of Australia in having such an agent to carry on their work. I shall not continue further with statistical detail, if Mr. Speaker thinks I am not in order in doing so, except to point out that in 3,100,000 miles flown, not only have there been no fatalitiesor injuries to any passenger or member of the staff, but also on no occasion has there been a forced landing. That is a record which is unique in the history of aviation. With all due respect to Mr. Speaker, I do not intend to make any apology for commenting upon the wonderful record of Qantas, because it shows what an excellent agent Australia has to carry on this new service on which we ‘ are embarking.

The honorable member for Capricornia (Mr. Forde) asked what subsidy was being paid by the British Government in connexion with this scheme. For the first three yeans the British Government will pay £750,000, and at the end of each subsequent three-year period, the amount of subsidy will be reduced to £675,000, £600,000. £525,000, and £450,000, respectively. Those amounts include the subsidies from .the various participating countries which will be receiving part service from this organization.

The honorable member for West Sydney also raised the point as to why the Commonwealth Government varied the original proposal that the service should end at Darwin and then be taken up by land aeroplanes throughout the Commonwealth. The British Government’s proposal was for an Empire flying-boat service, and if the Commonwealth had insisted upon breaking the service at Darwin it would have been necessary to institute a separate service from Sydney to Auckland. A break of this sort in the flying-boat service would have probably resulted in the destruction of the project the British Government had in mind to deliver all outward mails to the various parts of the dominions free of surcharge. The Commonwealth ‘Government originally took exception to Imperial Airways continuing the . service right through to Sydney, thus virtually taking control of the air-mail service within the Commonwealth. A compromise of the kind referred to by the honorable member for Flinders (Mr-. Fairbairn) was effected, -as the result of which the Commonwealth retained under its control the Australian section of the air route and in return agreed to cooperate with Imperial Airways in the service to Darwin. The Commonwealth even went so far as to say that, as the Qantas Company had successfully established an , air route from Singapore through to Darwin and Brisbane, it should be entitled to retain control of that section of the route. The British Government, however, promised to provide an Empire flying-boat service in respect of which it undertook to contribute the larger proportion of the cost. It believed that such a service would be a national asset and that it would be possible gradually to extend it right throughout the British Empire. The dominions were asked to contribute only a minor proportion of the cost. It was then decided to accept that proposal, and the agreement embodied in the bill was drawn up. The retention of the surcharge in the case of the Commonwealth will meet only a portion of the total cost of its share of the subsidy, and the reduction of the surcharge from1s. 4d. to 3d. a half ounce, should be welcomed by the people generally. The agreement has been drawn up very carefully to protect Australia’s interests in every possible way. The Common wealth Government, has agreed to contribute towards the cost of themanufacture in Australia of flying boats and parts asa definite contribution towards the establishment of an aircraft industry in this country.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time, and passed through its remaining stages without amendment or debate.

page 2980

NATIONAL HEALTH AND PENSIONS INSURANCE BILL 1938

In committee (Consideration of Senate’s amendments) :

Amendment No. 1.

Clause 4 - (1.) In this act, unless the contrary in ten tion appears - “Pharmaceutical chemist” means a person who is registered as a pharmaceutical chemist or pharmacist under the law in force in the State or part of the Commonwealth in whichhe supplies drugs, medicines, or appliances in pursuance of a contract made under this act:

Senate’s amendment. -After “supplies” insert “. or proposes to supply.”.

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · Corio · UAP

. -I move -

That the amendment be agreed to.

This amendment of the Senate extends the definition of “ pharmaceutical chemist “ fromone who is supplying drugs to one who not only supplies but also proposes to supply drugs.

Motion agreed to.

Amendment No. 2 -

Senate’s amendment. - After clause 55 insert the following new clause: - “55a. - (1.) For the purpose of enabling the Commission to determine the terms of any contract or agreement proposed to be entered into by it under thisPart for the supply of drugs, medicines and appliances, the Commission may, by notice in writing, call upon any manufacturer or wholesale distributor of drugs, medicines and appliances to furnish to it, within such time as is specified in the notice, such hooks and documents and such information as the Commission thinks necessary in relation to drugs, medicines and appliances the subject of any such contract or agreement. (2.) Any person who, without reasonable excuse (proof whereof shall lie upon him) fails after receiptof a notice under the last preceding sub-section, to comply with the requirements of the notice, shall be guilty of an offence.

Penalty: Fifty pounds, or imprisonment for three months.”

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · Corio · UAP

– I move -

That the amendment be agreed to.

This is a simple amendment,the purpose of which is to enable the commission to obtain any information necessary to the determination of the terms of any proposed contract or agreement for the supply of drugs, &c.

Motion agreed to.

Amendments Nos. 3 to 7.

Clause180- (1.) In the event of the bankruptcy of an employer or the winding up of the affairs ofa company, all contributions payable by the employer or company in respect of employed contributors during the twelve months before the making of the sequestration order or the commencement of the winding up shall receive priority over other liabilities of the bankrupt or of the companyexcept the costs of and incidental to the administration of the estate or the winding up the proper funeral and testamenary expenses of a deceased bankrupt and the wages or salary duetoany employee of the bankrupt or company.

Senate’s amendments. - After “bankruptcy”, first occurring, insert “ within the meaning of the Bankruptcy Act1924-1933.”. Leave out “ before the making of the sequestration order “, insert “ preceding the date of the bankruptcy “. Leave out “ bankrupt “ wherever occurring, insert “employer”.

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · Corio · UAP

– I move -

That the amendments be. agreed to.

This is a series of small amendments. The clause as passed by this committee provided only for those bankruptcy proceedings under the Bankruptcy Act in whicha sequestration order had been made. Under the Bankruptcy Act, the word “ bankruptcy “ includes any proceedings under the act. “I am advised that, as the clause left this chamber, the word “ bankruptcy “ did not have the full meaning given to it under the Bankruptcy Act. The amendments are designed to remedy that oversight, and to ensure that the clause will not fail in its purpose in respect of those proceedings for which provision is made in the Bankruptcy Act, where no sequestration order has been made. I understand that the honorable member for Bourke (Mr. Blackburn) is in agreement with the amendments. They provide further protection for the employee.

Motion agreed to.

Amendment No.8.

First schedule -

Part II. - Excepted employment -

Employment by a hospital in respect of which the commission certifies that the terms of employment provide health insurance benefits on the whole not less favorable than the health insurance benefits provided by this act.

Senate’samendment. - Leave out paragraph (c).

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · Corio · UAP

– I move -

That the amendment be agreed to.

I am advised by the Crown Law

Department that sub-clause c as it stands, will preclude employees of hospitals from making contributions or obtaining benefits under this legislation. I understand that that was not the intention of the honorable member who moved for the inclusion of the paragraph; that he wished to confine the exemption to the medical benefit. I ventured to address the committee when this matter was before it previously. I believe that honor able members are convinced that hospital employees should not be denied the right to make contributions or to obtain benefits under this scheme. If it be necessary to embark on a longer dissertation, I shall be only too glad to do so.

Mr MAKIN:
Hindmarsh

– I cannot feel at all satisfied with the explanation given by the Treasurer (Mr. Casey) for the omission of paragraph c. The request which the amendment featured was that hospital employees who to-day receive a medical benefit the equivalent of or superior to that provided under this bill should to that extent be exempt from the provisions of the bill. The Treasurer says that this paragraph will deprive hospital employees of the right to participate in this particular form of insurance. The honorable gentleman knows that that difficulty could easily be overcome by a consequential amendment in an earlier clause.

Mr Beasley:

– How does the Treasurer make his point?

Mr MAKIN:

– He says that he has received an intimation from the officers of the Crown Law Department that, by the passage of this particular paragraph, hospital employees will be disqualified from any participation in the scheme. That, definitely, was not the purpose of this committee when the paragraph was inserted in the schedule. It was then made clear to the Treasurer that he would be required to make the necessary consequential amendment adequately to provide for the position. His unwillingness to do so is shown by his declaration this afternoon. He knows full well that he could deal with the position adequately if he wished to do so.

Mr Beasley:

– These benefits are generally taken into consideration when wages are being calculated.

Mr Casey:

– I do not believe that they are.

Mr MAKIN:

– They are regarded as being equivalent to a consideration provided by the hospital authorities on behalf of their employees. If the paragraph he omitted from the schedule, those employees will definitelyhave imposed upon them the obligation to make ‘ a contribution in order to receive a benefit which they now receive without that contribution. I consider that the Treasurer has been most inconsiderate in respect of hospitals. The bill makes no provision to aid them in their work. On the contrary, an added obligation will be placed upon them to deal with the many cases that will be referred to them by doctors under this insurance scheme. This paragraph was a medium whereby hospital boards could at least have been relieved of the financial obligations which the bill proposed to place upon them. In a speech that I made earlier on this matter, I said that not only is the Government imposing on hospitals an added obligation in that under this scheme they will have to provide for a larger number of patients, but that it is also ruining their prospects of obtaining the public subscriptions which formerly were made possible by means of the voluntary schemes of different firms. If this ban be imposed on all employed persons, many of them will be under the impression that national insurance covers the whole of the treatment in respect of sickness and ill health, and, consequently, they may forego the opportunity to contribute voluntarily to the funds of a hospital. That will deprive hospitals of a substantial amount of. revenue which they now receive. As a further hardship, hospitals are to be required to make a contribution on behalf of their employees for what is now provided by means of their medical services.’ The whole thing is grossly unjust. An unfair burden will be placed upon these institutions, and the employees will definitely be deprived of that consideration which is due to them as a part of their employment. I hope that the committee will see the wisdom of rejecting the Senate’s amendment, and will insist upon the retention of the paragraph. The necessary consequential amendment could then be made, and equity and justice would be done to hospital employees as well as to the institutions themselves.

Mr BEASLEY:
West Sydney

. -t-I support the honorable member for Hindmarsh (Mr. Makin). The whole matter is embraced in one point. In the calculation of wages by boards, conciliation committees and other tribunals, consideration of the services provided by the employer in these matters is assessed at a certain value and the wages are determined accordingly.

Mr Casey:

– Only in some cases.

Mr BEASLEY:

In my opinion, when this measure is in full operation, the position of the hospitals will be better than it is to-day. We know very well that in some cases, hospital employees who fall sick are paid, if not the whole, at any rate a proportion, of their wages by the hospital authorities. If the Government’s intention is implemented the hospital finances will be relieved of any such burden in respect of insured persons.

Sir Frederick Stewart:

– Under the British scheme extended hospital benefits are provided for definite contributions.

Mr CASEY:

– It may be true that in certain hospitals themedical practitioners give free treatment to nurses who need it, but we can have no guarantee that that procedure will not be varied. If hospital employees are insured under this bill, the medical -practitioners on the one hand and the hospital authorities on the other will be relieved of any obligation to provide them with medical treatment and medicines without cost for, as the insured persons will be entitled to the benefits of this measure, the medical practitioners and hospital authorities will be fully entitled to make the specified charges in respect of them. I, therefore, urge that the Government’s view be accepted.

Mr BLACKBURN:
Bourke

.- I do not propose to discuss the merits and demerits ofthe clause, as they have once been settled by this House. I am concerned about the Treasurer’s suggestion that, if this amendment is adhered to, hospital employees will be entirely exempt. The object of the honorable member for Hindmarsh (Mr. Makin) is to secure exemption from payments for medical benefits for only those hospital employees whose terms of employment assure them of medical benefits. On the consideration in committee of clause 24 it was pointed out that the carrying of this amendment in the First Schedule wouldnecessitate the insertion in subclause 2 of clause 24 a reference to paragraph c as well as to paragraph b of Part II. of the First Schedule. I urged the postponement of clause 24 until that schedule had been disposed of, andI think that suggestion was supported by the honorable member for Warringah (Mr. Spender). Had it not been for the guillotine, clause 24 could have been recommitted at the report stage and the amendment in sub-clause 2 made here, but if the House adheres to its amendment sub-clause 2 can be consequentially amended in the Senate.

Sir FREDERICK STEWART:
Parramatta

– I hope that the committee will revert to the status quo in this connexion. The honorable membra for West Sydney (Mr. Beasley) stated in temperate language what sounded like a good case, but I do not think that his examples were altogether true to the facts of the case. I was an inmate of a hospital recently, and I know that the nurse who attended me was a contributor to a hospital fund in New South Wales She did not enjoy the right to hospital treatment as part of the terms of her engagement. Where is the real difference in persons paying for these benefits by means” of a pay envelopes tux and paying for them by means of friendly society contributions? In each case the benefit is purchased. If hospital employees are entitled to exemption because of certain contributions they- make to’ specified funds, surely the 400,000 members of friendly societies in Australia are also entitled to exemption because they contribute to their societies for medical services and medicines-.

Mr SCULLIN:
YARRA, VICTORIA

– But will not certain adjustments he made by the appropriate approved society in respect of such individuals?

Sir FREDERICK STEWART.Yes; but undoubtedly adjustments will also be made in the emoluments of hospital employees. Obviously, the Hospitals Commission of New South Wales will bear this point in mind. The area of the application of this measure should not be restricted in any further degree. I am sorry that public servants have been granted exemption from contributions. I do not know whether that was done in the interests of the State as an employer, or of the public servant as an employee; but certainly it was a mistake.

Mr NOCK:
Riverina

.- I hope the committee will restore the clause to its original wording. Last week I met a nurse employed in one of the largest hospitals in Sydney, and she said to me, “Who has taken upon himself the responsibility to say nurses wish to be excluded from the national insurance scheme?’’ She told me. that some medical practitioners gave free treatment to the nurses at the hospitals in which they were interested, others charged half-fees, and others felt no obligation at all in regard to the matter. Unless we are careful, we shall add to the anomalies of the scheme. It may be that maids and cleaners in hospitals will be excluded, although clearly they are on a. quite different footing from nurses, and do not enjoy quite the same goodwill from the doctors as do the nurses. This nurse said to me that they would rather pay 2d. a week and have medical attention as a light than save that 2d. a week and accept it as au act of kindness. I appeal to the committee to agree to the Senate’s amendment, and leave thu clause as it was originally framed.

Mr BARNARD:
Bass

.- I cannot accept the statement of the Treasurer (Mr. Casey) as to the value of restoring this clause to its original wording. I am aware of the conditions that operate in subsidized hospitals in Tasmania, and to some extent in Victoria, as the result of my association with a union. In Tasmania one of the conditions of employment of the nurses and the general staff is free medical treatment. When they are ordered off duty as the result of illness their pay continues for a time, but, of course, it eventually ceases: There is no suggestion of charity in the provision of free medical treatment for the staffs in Tasmania. It is their right. In Victoria the same position applies. Free medical treatment of the staffs of the hospitals is provided for in the awards of the State wages board. I have no knowledge of what obtains in New South Wales, where the position may be as the honorable member for Parramatta. (Sir Frederick Stewart) states it. The Treasurer claimed that the hospitals would benefit when the scheme had settled down. But I do not think that would work out in practice. The hospital boards will have to find extra money to make contributions in respect to their employees through the national insurance fund, and I do not know where they are going to find it. The cost of hospital treatment will have to be increased. I agree with the honorable member for “West Sydney (Mr. Beasley) that the troubles of the auxiliary comm.it.tees that provide money to assist the hospitals will be greatly increased. Perhaps the Treasurer has in mind that eventually the hospitals will be wholly maintained by the States from general taxes. The suggestion made by the honorable member for Bourke (Mr. Blackburn) would overcome the difficulty that the Treasurer anticipates. If the hospital employees were excluded from the provisions of the bill, the position would be more satisfactory, not. only for the employees but also for the hospital hoards, which are the employers.

Mr GANDER:
Reid

.- In my electorate there are two State institutions, one at Newington, where there are 700 women, and one at Lidcombe, where there are 1,400 men. At both hospitals some of the inmates have been employed for many years. At Newington, the wages range from £1 a week to as low as1s. 6d. Does the Treasurer intend to deduct1s. a week from the women who receive 1s.6d. a week for washing floors? At Lidcombe, the wages range from nearly the basic wage for the man who drives the motor bus from the railway stationto the hospital, to ft very low level. Does the Treasurer intend to take1s. 6d. a week from those who are receiving, say, only a few shillings a week? One man at Lidcombe has been earning 7s. or8s. a week for years. Surely he will be exempted. This matter should be cleared up by the Treasurer. I want a. definite statement as to what the position willbe. I propose to vote for the amendment made by the House of Representatives.

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · Corio · UAP

– There is full provision for the commission to exercisecommonsense discretion.

Mr Gander:

– I do not want the exercise of discretion.I want provision in the bill.

Mr CASEY:

– If the honorable gentleman will provide me with full particulars, I shall see what can be done.

Mr Gander:

– Will the Treasurer guarantee that the people to whom I have referred will not be called upon to pay anything?

Mr CASEY:

– No. We want to cover as many people as possible in this bill. If it appeared to the commission that it would not be common sense to take1s. 6d. a week from certain persons it would not be taken. The commission has plenty of scope to exercise discretion.

Question put -

That the amendment be agreed to.

The committee divided. (Chairman - Mr. Prowse)

AYES: 30

NOES: 27

Majority . . 3

In division:

AYES

NOES

Mr CHAIRMAN:

– The honorable member must know that he is being facetious.

Mr Curtin:

– No; the honorable member forReid knows that the honorable member for Barton is being inconsistent.

Question so resolved in the affirmative.

Motion agreed to.

Amendment No. 9.

Third schedule -

Rates of benefit payable … (1.) Sickness benefit -

Unmarried minors . .

Senate’s amendment. - Paragraph 1, subparagraph c, after “minors” insert “(not being juvenile contributors) “.

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · Corio · UAP

– I move -

That the amendment be agreed to.

This is merely a clarifying amendment.

Motion agreed to.

Amendment No. 10.

Fourth schedule -

Additional Benefits.

The payment of the whole or any part of the cost of medical or surgical advice, or treatment, by any registered medical practitioner, not being advice or treatment within the scope of any other additional benefit, or of medical benefit, under a special scheme approved by the Minister for the purpose.

Senate’s amendment. - Leave out “ Minister “ insert “ Commission “.

Motion (by Mr. Casey) agreed to.

That the amendment be agreed to.

Resolution reported; report adopted.

page 2986

TARIFF PROPOSALS 1938

Excise Tariff Amendment (No. 1) 1937-1938

In Committee of Ways and Means:

Consideration’ resumed from the 19th

May (vide page 1316), on motion by

Mr White:
Minister for Trade and Customs · vide page 460 · UAP

–

That the Schedule to the Excise Tariff 1921-1030 bo amended as hereunder set out . . . and on the amendment by Mr. Perkins (vide page 1314)- .

That the item be amended as follows: - By omitting the whole of sub-item (l) and inserting instead the following subitem: - . . .

Mr CURTIN:
Fremantle

.- When this matter was before the Parliament ion. the last occasion, I asked that consideration be deferred to permit me to look into the proposed change in practice for which provision is made. The Department of Trade and Customs has hitherto had to rely on both by-laws and regulations in order to carry on its administration. I have examined the proposal, and I see no reason to object to the proceeding contemplated in this measure.

Amendment agreed to.

Item, as amended, agreed to.

Item 6 agreed to..

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended; report adopted.

Ordered -

That Mr. Perkins and Mr. Thompson do prepare and bring in a bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

page 2986

EXCISE TARIFF 1938

Bill brought up by Mr. Perkins, and passed through all stages without amendment or debate.

page 2986

GENEVA CONVENTION BILL 1938

Second Reading

Mr HUGHES:
Minister for External Affairs · North Sydney · UAP

.- I move -

That the bill be now read a second time.

On 27th July, 1929, an International Convention was signed at Geneva, relating to the treatment of the wounded and sick of combatants in time of war. This convention - to which Australia is a party - is popularly known as the Geneva Convention. The convention makes provision for the use of a distinctive emblem - a red cross on a white ground - by those engaged in medical services. Article 24 of the convention provides that such an emblem may not be used, either in time of peace or in time of war, except to protect or to indicate the medical officers and establishments, and the personnel and material protected by the convention. In order to give effect to this provision, the convention further provides, in article 28, that the governments of the parties to the convention whose legislation is not at present adequate for the purpose, shall take legislative action to prohibit the use of the red cross on a white ground, or a white or silver cross on a red ground, except in the circumstances contemplated by the convention.

It is, accordingly, provided by clause 4 of the bill that no person shall use any such emblem for the purpose of his trade or business, or for any other purpose, unless the authority of the Minister, or an authorized person, has been obtained. The clause also prohibits the use of the words “ red cross “ or “ Geneva cross “, or any similar words.

The bill also terminates the application to Australia of certain British legislation on the subject. The convention of 1929 supersedes a convention dated the 6th June, 1906, which also made provision for the protection of theRed Cross, but did not go so far as the more recent convention. Legislation to give effect to the 1906 convention was passed by the Parliament of the United Kingdom in 1911, and this legislation applied throughout the whole of the King’s dominions. In 1937, the Parliament of the United Kingdom passed a further act to give effect to article28 of the 1929 convention, but this act does not extend to the Commonwealth. The act contemplates, however, that legislation will be passed by the Commonwealth Parliament, and, in order to remove any doubt as to the powers of the Commonwealth Parliament, it expressly provides that the Commonwealth Parliament shall have power to legislate to give effect to article 28 of the convention, and also authorizes the Commonwealth Parliament to terminate the application of the British act of 1911 to the Commonwealth and its territories. This bill will, therefore, make provision to give effect in Australia to the Geneva Convention of 1929, and will terminate the operation in Australia of the British act. which will be no longer necessary.

Mr HOLLOWAY:
It is almost a pleasant surprise to hear the Minister for External Affairs (Mr. Hughes · Melbourne Ports; [3.55].

propose that this Parliament should ratify one of the conventions of the League of Nations. It is true that this is a convention associated with the League itself, and not with one of its auxiliary bodies, but Australia’s representatives have agreed to other conventions which Australia has not honoured, much to our disgrace. However, the Government has decided to adopt this convention in order to bring Australia into line with other nations, and its purpose is to secure the co-operation of all the signatory nations in doing all that is humanly possible for the sick and wounded members of all armies on the battlefield, whoever and wherever they may be. Two or three decades ago, most of us believed that conventions of this’ kind would be respected, and that the emblem of the red cross would serve to protect, in all circumstances, those who bore it. It is, however, useless for us to fool ourselves. We know that it is now more of a danger than a protection to shelter under the red cross on the battlefield. Thus, while it is impossible for us to have a great deal of faith in international agreements of this nature, it is our duty to subscribe to them in the hope that some good may come from them.

It isalso provided in the convention that the red cross, or the Geneva cross, may not be used for trade purposes. For years past certain first-aid and medical organizations have used the red cross emblem in theirpeace-time work, but there is a growing tendency for the emblem to be exploited for trade purposes, thus destroying its peculiar significance. In brief, this convention covers the following matters -

) The treatment of the wounded and sick of combatants in time of war.
The protection of the buildings, equipment, and personnel of the medical services of the opposing forces. (3)Thedefinitionofadistinctive emblem or badge which can be easily recognized and respected by all those engaged in war.

As I have said, at one time the emblem of the red cross was regarded as an absolute safeguard against deliberate molestation for all those engaged in caring for the sick and wounded in time of war. Unfortunately, we have reached a stage when practically all our efforts to humanize war have been proved futile. Someone has said that we might as well try to Christianize hell as to humanize

Avar. I believe that to be largely true, but it is still our duty to do what we. can, and therefore I support this measure. Question resolved in ‘the affirmative. Bill read a second time, and reported from committee without amendment or debate; report adopted.

Bill-byleave a third time.

page 2988

PASSPORTS BILL 1938

In committee (Consideration of Senate’s Amendment).

Clause 5 -

In this act, unless the contrary intention appears - “ Administrator “, in relation to a Territory, means the person in control of the administration of that Territory;

Senate’s amendment - Leave out “ in control of the administration of that Territory,” insert “ charged with the duty of administering theGovernment thereof on behalf of the Commonwealth.”

Mr THOMPSON:
New England · CP

. - This amendment makes no alteration of substance. It has been made solely for drafting reasons. ‘ It was thought that the definition of “ Administrator “ of a territory as being “ the person in control of the administration of a territory” was ambiguous, inasmuch as it might include other persons than the Administrator himself, even possibly the Minister. This is not intended. The words substituted by the Senate’s amendment more properly describe the administrators of the various territories. The new word ing accords with the language in the act whereby the office ofAdministrator is constituted. I move -

That the amendment be agreed to.

Motionagreed to.

Resolution reported. [Quorum formed.]

Report adopted.

page 2988

INCOME TAX COLLECTION BILL 1938

Thirdreading.

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · Corio · UAP

– I move-

That the bill be ; now read a third time.

Two honorable members asked that there should be a slight delay in respect of thefinal completion of this measure. I understand, however, that they are now both satisfied with regard to it. The. only further point which I should like to mention is that neither the State of Victoria nor the State of South Australia has yet applied to the Commonwealth Government for an arrangement such as thisbill envisages. In South Australia there is no tax that is directly relevant to this bill, and the Victorian measure entails assessment by the Commissioner and, therefore, there is no provision for agreement with the Commonwealth on these lines. Neither of the States has approached the Commonwealth and there are no current agreements with them, and therefore, the arrangement runs only in the other four States.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a third time.

Debate resumed from the 21st June (vide page 2397) on motion by Mr. Archie Cameron -

That thebill be now read a second time.

Mr FORDE:
Capricornia

– This bill merely provides for the alteration of the name from “ Canned Fruits Control Board “ to “ Australian Fruits Board “. I support it.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time, and reported from committee without amendment or debate; report adopted.

Bill - by leave - read a third time.

page 2989

CITRUS FRUITS BOUNTY BILL 1938

Message recommending appropriation reported.

In committee (‘Consideration of Administrator’s message) :

Motion (by Mr. Archie Cameron) agreed to -

That it is expedient that an appropriation of revenue be made for the purposes of a bill for an act to provide for the payment of a bounty on the export of citrus fruits from the Commonwealth during (the years 1938, 1939 and1940.

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended ; resolution adopted.

Ordered -

That Mr. Archie Cameron and Mr. Casey do prepare and bring in a bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

Bill brought up by Mr. Archie Cameron, and read a first time. [Quorum formed.]

Second Reading

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:
BarkerActing Minister for Commerce · CP

– I move -

That the bill be now read a second time.

This measure provides for bounty at a reducing rate on citrus fruits exported to all destinations other than New Zealand, over the three years 1938, 1939 and 1940’. The bounty will be at the rate of 2s. an export box for 1938,1s. 6d. an export box for 1939, and1s. an export box for 1940. These amounts apply to the box which contains approximately l1/2bushels. For the bushel box they are to be propar- , tionately reduced.

Assistance has been rendered to this industry since 1933. In that year, following the imposition of the New Zealand embargo on Australian citrus fruits, growers were guaranteed their out-of-pocket expenses on oranges exported to the United Kingdom. The guarantee was renewed in . 1934, and, as that year turned out to be particularly disastrouson account of adverse seasonal conditions, a bounty of 6d. a case was granted on oranges exported to the United Kingdom. For the years 1935, 1936 and 1937, bounty at the rate of 2s. an export case was paid.

Although the New Zealand embargo has been partially lifted in each year since 1933, in favour of fruit from areas certified to be free from fruit fly, it has proved a serious handicap, particularly to New South Wales growers, in the marketing of their crops. These growers have been unable to ship any fruit to New Zealand for six years, with the exception of small quantities from the Murrain bidgee irrigation area, where there is no fruit fly. They must, therefore, look to the local market, and to export markets other than New Zealand, to absorb their fruits.

When the crop is at the peak, the local market cannot absorb the whole of it, so that growers are forced at this time to export, to sell locally at reduced prices, or to allow the fruit to go. to waste. This applies especially to fruit from the northern districts of New South Wales, where it is liable to develop, black spot if left on the trees, andmust, therefore, be marketed as soon as it is ripe. The New Zealand market had proved a useful outlet for much of this fruit, and its availability assisted in maintaining a reasonable price on the Sydney market. The assistance rendered over the last few years lias enabled growers in these districts to secure an outlet for much of the fruit which they would otherwise have been forced to sacrifice or .to waste. The bounty has also assisted in establishing in the United Kingdom market, ‘South Australian oranges of a very high quality. The success so far achieved in placing these oranges in the United Kingdom, encourages the belief that a permanent market will be available there, even though only a limited quantity may be sent forward each year. Other exporters also have benefited from the assistance rendered by the Commonwealth Government in the past, but it has mainly been of value for the reasons mentioned.

Two years ago, when the industry was seeking the continuance of the bounty, its representatives were informed that, unless the industry did something to help itself through its own organization, the Government could not even consider any further claims for assistance. As the result, the industry formed the Australian Citrus Advisory Council in 1937. The objects of the council are, briefly, to investigate and to advise the Govern- ment upon matters relating to the production and . marketing of citrus fruits, with a view ito improving the status of the industry, and ensuring better marketing conditions for producers. The council has been hampered in its activities because of the uncertainty in the minds1 of growers regarding the future, and it has, therefore, recommended that, instead of dealing with the bounty question from year to year, the Government should approve a. bounty over the next three years at reducing rates. With a knowledge of what they are to expect over the next three years, and of the fact that the bounty will cease at the end of that period, the council and the industry can devote their attention to solving some of the problems which to-day militate against the satisfactory marketing of their fruit. *

The Australian Agricultural Council at its last meeting, passed a resolution in favour of the bounty on citrus .fruits exported being continued for a period of three years. In passing this resolution, the council had in mind the matters to which I have just referred. As a matter of fact, it- expressed the view that pay- ment of subsidies without evidence of improvement, or the likelihood of improvement, in the conditions of production and marketing surrounding the industry concerned, is wrong . in principle except in the case of major economic adversity. The citrus industry has given evidence of its desire to improve its production and marketing conditions, and is, therefore, in the opinion of the Government, entitled to some measure of assist ance over a definitely limited period, to permit of such improvement being achieved.

In past years the assistance to the citrus industry has not been very costly compared with the benefits obtained in the greater stability of markets. The figures for the various years are : -

It is anticipated that the crop for 1938 will be considerably heavier than for 1937, and that, even with the opening of the New Zealand market to greater supplies .of Australian citrus, there will be a larger export to other markets. The bounty for 1938 will probably cost £13,000, but there will be a progressive reduction in each year until 1940, after which it will cease.

From time to time in the discussion of bounties it has been suggested that the bounty does not always go to the person whom the Government desires to assist, namely, the grower. It is the definite intention of the Government that the present bounty shall go to the grower, and provision to ensure this has been included in the bill. The Department qf Commerce has been instructed to see that the grower receives this bounty. The only exception is in the case’ of approved co-operative organizations, which pool the fruit and pay the proceeds to their growermembers. Provided the Minister is satisfied that these organizations actually pay the proceeds to their growers, and that the growers desire the bounty to bc paid to them through their own co-operative organizations, he will approve of the bounty being paid to such organizations for subsequent distribution to growers.

I submit the bill for the favorable consideration of honorable members.

Mr FORDE:
Capricornia

.- In supporting this bill I express my pleasure that the Government is proposing to continue this bounty for three years although at a diminishing rate each year. No doubt this is intended to serve as a notice to the citrus growers that at the end of that period the Government expects them to stand upon their own feet. This provision is wise, for bounties are intended to assist industries only in the initial stages of their development.

Mr Anthony:

– Just like protection !

Mr FORDE:

– I am sure that the honorable member for Richmond (Mr. Anthony) would not like the protection at present accorded butter producers and bacon growers to be lifted; nor would he be pleased if New Zealand potatoes were admitted free to Australia; but I am not “ one-eyed “ in my advocacy of protection ; I believe that both primary and secondary industries should bc protected. I regret, however, that the Country party is “ one-eyed “ in this respect.

The citrus industry is of importance to the Commonwealth because it makes possible the settlement of relatively small areas. It is really one of the outcomes of our closer settlement policy. Numerous returned soldiers are settled on citrus groves in various parts of Australia. In 1916-17 we had 17,000 acres under citrus cultivation, and our production totalled 1,450,000 bushels of fruit. By 1935-36 tho area had increased to 41,000 acres and the production to 4,430,000 bushels. More than 50 per cent, of our citrus fruits is grown by returned soldiers. Un- fortunately, some returned men were settled on unsuitable land for which the Government paid too high a price, and we have also had to cope with a certain degree of over-production. Quite recently Mr. J. R. Crawford, the economist of the Rural Bank of New South “Wales, directed attention to another difficulty of the industry. According to a report in the Sydney Sim, of 27th June last, he said -

Thu change in the demand from common oranges and mandarins to. navels and valencias has hit badly the coastal and metropolitan growers.

Evidently, a remarkable alteration has occurred in the kind of citrus fruit demanded by the market. Sir Richard Linton, when Agent-General for Victoria in London, reported that South Australian navel oranges sold well on the British market. It is interesting to note that 10,000 acres of our citrus country is planted with navel orange trees, and 30,000 with other varieties. Steps should be taken to replace the unpopular varieties by the varieties demanded by purchasers overseas. The Acting Minister for Commerce ,(Mr. Archie Cameron) could, no doubt, through his department, do something to stimulate a movement in this direction.

Mr Archie Cameron:

– Production is a subject over which the Commonwealth has no direct control.

Mr FORDE:

– But it could undoubtedly, at periodical Premiers Conferences and meetings of the Australian Agricultural Council, direct, attention to the subject.

Mr ARCHIE Cameron:

– I have conferred with the citrus growers’ organizations on the subject.

Mr FORDE:

– I hope that the Prime Minister (Mr. Lyons) will also, direct attention to it at the next Premiers Conference. Probably something could be done through the instrumentality of the Council for Scientific and Industrial Research to deal with the problem.

The organized marketing of citrus fruits and the extension of the export trade would undoubtedly be of great value to the industry. Steps to achieve these ends would, in my opinion, be of more assistance to the industry, in the long run, than the provision of a limited amount of money for bounty payments. Unless steps are taken to deal with the root, causes of the troubles which surround the citrus growers at present, it will be found, in three years’ time, that they will again need to come cap in hand rn the Commonwealth Government for additional assistance. Temporary alleviation of the kind now proposed does not gi’t to the root of troubles in which the growers find themselves.

Under the Ottawa Agreement it was expected that the Australian citrus growers would obtain a larger share of the market in the United Kingdom, but actually our exports of citrus fruits to that market have decreased.

Mr Archie CAMERON:

– But we are in a better position on the Canadian market.

Mr FORDE:

– I am glad to hear that that is so. It is in that way that the industry will be permanently improved. Temporary patches upon it will be ineffective. The citrus growers of Spain and Palestine are the largest exporters to the United Kingdom market; but the growers of Brazil and the United States of America also enjoy a large share of the trade, while those of South Africa exported more than 1,000,000 cwt. of citrus fruits to Great Britain last year. The following table sets out the value and total imports ‘‘of citrus fruits to the United Kingdom and also Australia’s share of the trade: -

Those figures show that our exports of citrus fruits to. Great Britain could be substantially increased. Why is it that we are not obtaining a larger share of Britain’s trade?’ Undoubtedly the present, situation is most, unsatisfactory. Although the Commonwealth and State governments may be actuated by good motives in seeking to develop this industry, their activities are obviously ineffective.

In the press report of the remarks of Mr. J. R. Crawford on this industry, a passage from which I have already cited, it, is stated -

The loss of the New Zealand market as the result of the embargo applied by thu Dominion Government in 1932 was one of the main causes in the decline of the Australian citrus industry.

The speech just delivered by the Acting Minister for Commerce did not indicate clearly whether this embargo had been completely lifted. If not, I urge that negotiations be entered into with that, object. At a conference held in Canberra during 1935, and attended by pathologists and representatives of the Commonwealth and State governments, and also of the Government of New Zealand, it was unanimously decided that the interests of public health were no longer being served by the existing quarantine prohibitions. The present Labour Government of Now Zealand has, on several occasions, expressed the opinion that the continuation of any restrictions on the trade between Australia and New Zealand was not justified. We know that a good deal of the trouble originated in consequence” of the action of the Commonwealth Government in prohibiting the importation of New Zealand potatoes to Australia because of the fear of introducing the diseases known as corky scab and fire blight. No doubt this subject was discussed at some length by the Minister for Trade and Customs during his recent visit to New Zealand, and 1 hope that, a statement will be made at an early date to the effect that all the remaining difficulties have been overcome.

The embargo on the importation of Australian citrus fruits to New Zealand was imposed by the Dominion Government in 1932. I believe that that action was retaliatory, at least, to some extent, for the treatment accorded by the Commonwealth Government, to New Zealand potatoes”. The prohibition was modified in 1933 to permit a limited importation of South Australian oranges to New Zealand. In 1934 the Dominion Government again decided to allow oranges from South Australia to enter New Zealand in specified quantities and by certain vessels. I have been assured that a real demand exists in New Zealand for Australian oranges for which the consumers of that country are prepared to pay quite satisfactory prices. In view of Australia’s trade position with the sister dominion, everything possible should be done to encourage reciprocal action. The following table indicates the volume of our trade with New Zealand, including bullion and specie, for the period 1927-28 ro 1930-37 :- ‘

In these circumstances I trust that in the coming parliamentary recess the Acting Minister for Commerce .will do everything possible to improve the present position in regard to both Australian citrus fruits and New Zealand potatoes. Although the State governments control land settlement, and also the closer settlement programmes at. present on foot, the Commonwealth Government could undoubtedly do a great deal to obtain more satisfactory markets for our various primary products. Probably if the standard of living of the Australian people were substantially improved and their purchasing power increased they would be able to buy a much larger proportion of the Australian citrus crop, but [ shall not dilate further on that aspect of the subject at the moment. Citrus fruits are health-giving, but thousands of Australian families cannot purchase them because they have no margin over what is required to purchase the bare necessaries of life. Consequently, fruit on many orchards is left to rot on the ground. 1 believe that the Acting Minister for Commerce will take this matter up with enthusiasm during the recess, and I hope that he will be able to make a satisfactory report! to Parliament when it meets again.

Mr GARDNER:
Robertson

.- I commend the bill to the House. The bill is proof that the Government realizes that, although part of the difficulties of the industry have been removed, those difficulties are still very considerable. [Quorum formed.]

Before I was interrupted by a futile attempt to count out the House - such attempts must be futile - J was referring to the fact that many difficulties still confront the citrus orchardists, and that, when all the circumstances of industry are considered, it must be apparent that it needs further assistance: .In my electorate there are rnor.0 citrus growers than there are in any other Commonwealth electorate, but none of them will share directly in the benefit from the partial lifting of the embargo’ against the importation of Austraiian ^citrus fruits into New Zealand, although they will receive indirect benefit. There is a certain reason, which there is no need to specify, why those growers cannot participate in that direct benefit. The partial lifting of the restrictions by the Government of New Zealand has resulted in a larger quantity of Australian citrus fruits going to New Zealand now than even went to that country before the embargo was imposed, but the fruit mainly comes from South Australia and a part of Victoria. I hope that in addition to this bill, which T am glad to note has the support of the Deputy Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Forde), there will be further scientific investigation of the citrus areas on the eastern coast, in order, .if possible, to enable the growers in those areas to export their fruit to New Zealand. The bounty offered under tin’s bill- is to be paid for three years on a sliding scale. The growers are pleased that it has not been restricted to one year. ‘ As the result of the payment of the bounty, a large quantity of citrus fruit will be exported overseas, and the result will be a diminution of the quantity of fruit that ‘will be sold on the local market, with a. consequent appreciation in the local prices. Therein will be the indirect benefit that some of my constituents will enjoy. New Zealand is anxious to have the disability which reacts against the lifting of the embargo against the importation of oranges from the eastern parts of Australia removed, and to that end it has sent several experts to the eastern Australian citrus-growing districts to investigate the matter. It cannot be gainsaid that at least in certain times of the year there is no danger of harm resulting to New Zealand from the import of oranges from those districts. When the Minister for Defence (Mr. Thorby) was Assistant Minister for Commerce, his experience in the New South Wales Department of Agriculture

Stood him well in his efforts on behalf of the citrus industry of New South Wales to eliminate this trouble. I trust that the department will not allow the splendid work that he did to remain incomplete. New Zealand- is anxious to meet the growers of New South Wales, and I think that if further scientific investigation is undertaken the present difficulties can be surmounted.

I hope that the efforts that have been made to ensure that this bounty will be paid to the citrus growers will have the desired results. I understand that every precaution has been taken to ensure that the bounty will go into the pockets of the growers themselves. I commend to the citrus-growers the need for them to organize. I regret the disunity that exists among them. They should realize that they would have more hope of obtaining assistance from the Government if they presented a united front. ‘ It is essential that this, industry should be assisted. The wealth of the country comes from the soil and, although the citrus industry does not rank in importance with the wheat and wool industries, it does contribute substantially to the wealth as well as to the health of the nation.

Mr NOCK:
Riverina

.- Protection is the declared policy of Australia and, in that respect, there is no reason why the primary industries should not be on tho same footing as the secondary industries. The citrus industry is also entitled to consideration by reason of the fact that there is no justification for any section of industry to be called’ upon to carry the burden of national policy. Every ‘ honorable member will admit’ that the citrus industry was disorganized as the result of the embargo which was imposed by New Zealand in retaliation for the embargo which was placed on the importation into Australia of New Zealand potatoes. Ever since that action was taken, the producers who had been planting in anticipation of an extended market in New Zealand have been prejudiced by national policy. In these circumstances, there is an obligation on the part of the Commonwealth Government to try to compensate the growers. Secondary industries have protection, because their costs are higher than are the costs in competitive countries, and, on the ground that tariffs add to the growers’ costs, the citrus industry is entitled to assistance. The popular conception was that when the New Zealand embargo was lifted there would be no need for further assistance to the citrus-growers, but prices slump when there is a surplus of the fruit. Citrus fruits are perishable and cannot be held back from the market. The Government i3 justified in granting this assistance to enable the citrus industry to recover from the harm that occurred when ‘the New Zealand embargo was in full force. The bounty will be paid on a sliding scale, for three years. That is of benefit to the growers.

It must be recognized that, although the embargo in New Zealand has been removed from fruit which comes from fruit-fly-free areas, it is the declared policy of the Government of New Zealand to purchase the dominion’s citrus requirements through one organization, thus eliminating competition. I believe that the Government has taken the fact that the elimination of competition in New Zealand will result in reduced returns from that dominion into consideration in deciding to pay this bounty as a means of assisting the citrus-growers in exploiting and securing some competition: from markets in other parts of the world. I commend to the growers what was said by the Acting Minister for Commerce (Mr. Archie Cameron) about their need to organize on a united basis. That is good advice. While the citrus-growers are divided,, their interests are prejudiced. I hope that the market for citrus fruits in the eastern countries will be extended. I impress upon the House, however, the fact that this bounty is to be -payable only in respect of fruit that is shipped abroad to places other than New Zealand; it is not a bounty on production, nor on all exports, and the amount is most moderate.

Mr Beasley:

– Are refrigerating facilities now satisfactory for the export of fruit over long distances?

Mr NOCK:

– They are reasonably satisfactory for fruit exported from Western Australia and South Australia, but the journey from ‘Sydney to England is rather too long, and the fruit does not usually arrive in the best condition. However, the taking of fruit off the Australian market tends to prevent a glut, and makes for better prices.

Mr JOHN LAWSON:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

– I support the bill, and I offer the Acting Minister for Commerce (Mr. Archie Cameron) my congratulations, not only on bringing down this bill, but also on interesting himself in all phases of the fruit-growing industry, and on taking the trouble to acquaint himself with the difficulties that confront the industry, difficulties which vary from State to State, and also in different parts of the one State. I believe that I speak accurately when I say that no other primary industry has suffered more in the last six or seven years than has the citrus fruit-growing industry. In common with all primary industries,’ it was, of course, the victim of the general depression, but it suffered more than most because oranges, grapefruit and other citrus fruits are unfortunately, and I believe wrongly, regarded as semi-luxuries. For that reason- they arc among the first to be cut out when bad times come, and purchasing power is reduced. Thus the industry associated with their production suffers more than those engaged in the production of basic necessities. The citrusgrowers have also suffered because of the increasing output of the industry. In the case of wheat, and other annual crops, production may be regulated from year to year, but that is not possible in the case of citrus fruit. The undoubted prosperity which the industry enjoyed before 1932 encouraged the growers in all States to plan ahead, and to go in for fairly heavy plantings of young trees. These are now coming into full bearing, and the industry is faced with the pro blem of finding a market for the increased production. This year, . it is estimated that the- production of oranges alone will exceed that of last year by 500,000 bushels. Finally, the industry ha3, if I may so describe it, been nailed to the cross of political expediency, both in this country and in New Zealand.

Mr Beasley:

– Then the honorable member admits that the restriction of trade was not due to a desire to keep out , pests ?

Mr JOHN LAWSON:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

– To some extent this matter of pests was not put in its true light. The estimated production of oranges for the year 1936-37 was 3,S56,889 bushels, while for 1937-3S the estimated production is 4,303,000. [Quorum formed.] I have here a table prepared by the officers of the Department of Commerce setting out the production of oranges for 1932-33, and the estimated production for each of the succeeding years up to 1937-3S. I ask leave to have the table incorporated in Hansard. [Leave -not granted.]

Trade relations between New Zealand and Australia have been in an unsatisfactory condition for the last five or six years. I do not wish to d well on the .cause ; suffice it to say that differences have existed, and the citrus fruit-growing industry has suffered very severely in consequence. Those trade difficulties were the original cause of the embargo imposed by the Government of New Zealand on the importation of citrus fruits from this country. Some time ago, the Government of New Zealand embarked upon a policy for supplying the needs of that dominion in regard to citrus fruits entirely from its own territories, and orchards were established in the Cook Islands and elsewhere. While those efforts were not wholly successful, it is a fact that considerably more citrus fruit is being produced in New Zealand and the islands under its control than was the case five or six years ago. The desire of the Government of New Zealand to protect this newly established industry was one of the reasons for the imposition of the embargo on the importation of Australian citrus fruits, but there were other reasons. However, the position to-day is vastly improved.

The honorable member for West Sydney (Mr. Beasley) asked, by way of interrjection, whether the restrictions on trade between New Zealand and Australia were really due to a desire to prevent the introduction of pests. We know that the excuse given both in New Zealand and Australia for the embargo was that New Zealand desired to protect itself against the introduction of the Mediterranean fruit-fly. To-day, however, New Zealand is prepared to admit citrus fruit without any restriction, except in regard to fruit grown in certain specified areas which cannot be guaranteed free from Mediterranean fruit-fly. Those areas are almost wholly within the the coastal districts of New South Wales represented by the honorable member for Robertson (Mr. Gardner) and myself. Most of the citrus-growing areas of Australia are free to export fruit to New Zealand throughout the whole of the year without restriction, and that, to a great degree, has had the effect of improving the general position.

It is estimated that, during the present year, New Zealand will import from Australia 320,000 oases of 70 lb. each. For the three years prior to the imposition of the embargo by New Zealand, imports from Australia’ were as follows: -

Thus, the average importations over those three years amounted to 145,095 cases, and those were 60-lb. cases. Compare that with this year’s estimated importation of 320,000 cases of 70 lb. each, which are equal to 373,333 cases of 60 lb. each. This is more than two and a half times the average quantity imported for each of the three years immediately prior to the imposition of the embargo. That indicates the extent to which the trade position has improved in regard to citrus fruits, and it will be still further improved.

It is proposed in this bill to inaugurate a long-distance policy for helping the citrus fruit-growing industry by the granting of a bounty, not on fruit exported to New Zealand, which is a rela- tively lucrative market, but on fruit sent to the United Kingdom, Canada, the East and other places. The reason for this distinction is evident. It costs about 13s. a case to market fruit in Great Britain, where the market is much more precarious than in New Zealand and the wastage due to long distance transport much greater. Nevertheless, it is necessary to encourage exploitation of this and similar markets in order to relieve the local market of surplus production.

The Acting Minister for Commerce expressed the hope that, during the next three years, the industry would put its house in order, and in this I entirely agree with him. It will not be an easy thing to do. I have to admit, as did the honorable member for Robertson, that the domestic affairs of the industry are not in the happiest state. There is a- certain amount of disruption within the industry itself. Several distinct organizations of growers are in existence, and I suggest that, when the Government is negotiating with the representatives of the industry, it should see that it gets into’ touch with the representatives of all the organizations which justifiably claim to represent important sections of the industry. There is a Fruit Growers’ Federation, which represents all sections of fruit-growers generally, and there is, in addition, the Hawkesbury Citrus Association and the Citrus Growers’ Defence Association, which are especially representative of the citrus fruit-growers. I understand that, in recent negotiations between the Minister and the representatives of the industry, the last two organizations were ignored. I suggest that they be invited to send representatives to discuss their problems with the department.

In my opinion, the chief difficulty with which the citrus fruit-growers in New South Wales have to contend is the Mediterranean fruit-fly, which is extremely difficult to eradicate. I suggest that, as a preliminary, this problem should be brought under the notice of the Australian Agricultural Council. The average commercial fruit-grower is beset by a large number of pests, and although lie is capable of dealing with many of them, he cannot deal very adequately, particularly in the coastal areas of New South Wales, with the Mediterranean fruit fly for the simple reason that flanking the citrus-growing districts in the coastal areas is a multitude of back-yard orchards in the suburban aud outermetropolitan areas of Sydney. These back-yard orchards simply represent a multiplicity of septic pockets, in which are incubated 90 per cent, of the pestilent diseases that cause so much damage to the crops of fruit growers in the coastal areas.

Mr Curtin:

– Does not the New South Wales Government compel everybody who has a fruit tree in his back yard to register it?

Mr JOHN LAWSON:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

– Every commercial grower is required to pay a registration tax, but no registration is required of back-yard orchards.

Mr Curtin:

– 1 have half a dozen fruit trees at my place at Cottesloe; I do not sell fruit, but I have to pay a registration fee for those trees.

Mr JOHN LAWSON:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

– That is not the case in New South Wales. I suggest that the Australian Agricultural Council take up this very important question. The position is that the average commercial fruitgrower takes very great care of hia trees in order to keep pestilent diseases away from his orchard. He takes all proper precautions that are either laid down in the regulations, or advised by agricultural and horticultural inspectors. But the back-yard orchardist is in a totally different category. He does not grow fruit for profit; he is not concerned whether he gets a clean crop or a quality crop; and, unfortunately, his trees are not subjected to the regular and ruthless inspection of orchard inspectors. The result is that back-yard orchards, particularly in the metropolitan and outer suburban areas of Sydney, are riddled with disease and are the main breeding grounds for the Mediterranean fruit fly, which has caused the citrus growers of New South Wales and other parts of the Commonwealth the loss of hundreds of thousands of pounds in recent years. I urge the Government to submit this matter to the Australian Agricultural

Council at its next meeting, which, I understand, is to take place in August, ami endeavour . to formulate some scheme whereby this problem can be tackled in a much more effective way than it is at present. I say most emphatically that it is being neglected to-day. I have lived in a suburb of Sydney for the last six or seven years, and I know that the average back-yard orchard is inspected only once in about five years. Even that inspection is a very cursory one. It is impossible, in these circumstances, to expect that orchard diseases will be eradicated. I urge this course upon the Minister with a view to giving those men, who have worked hard and endeavoured to keep their fruit free from disease, a chance to rid their properties of the Mediterranean fruit fly, which, as I have said, has cost them hundreds of thousands, of pounds in the past, and will cost even more in the future. I support the hill, and I trust that it will have a speedy passage through the House. *[Quorum formed. *

Mr FROST:
Franklin

– I congratulate the Acting. Minister for Commerce (Mr. Archie Cameron) upon the introduction of this bill. Although the State which I represent in this House is not interested in the growing of citrus fruits, I know the value of the industry to this country. I cannot agree with the contention of the honorable member for Robertson (Mr. Gardner) that the citrus-growers of Australia are placed in a difficult position because of the embargo placed upon the importation of potatoes from New Zealand. As a matter of fact, there has never been a complete embargo on the importation into that dominion of Australian citrus fruits. Restrictions are imposed only in respect of fruit grown in those areas which are not free from disease. The same conditions apply to the Australian embargo, on the importation of New Zealand potatoes. Australians are not a fruit-eating people, and as a means of solving the difficulties which beset fruit-growers generally every encouragement should therefore be given to the people to eat more fruit. The climatic conditions of Australia, and the composition of its soils, are favorable for the production of fruit of high quality, and, in my opinion, we produce fruit equal in quality to that grown anywhere in the world. I was unable to understand the statementmade by the honorable member for Riverina (Mr. Nock) that New South Wales citrusgrowers were unable to ship their fruit to Great Britain.

Mr Nock:

– They found that a large quantity of the fruit was damaged before it arrived on the British market.

Mr FROST:

– While I was in England in 1935 I had an opportunity to sec New South Wales citrus fruits exhibited for sale in the borough markets. The lemons exhibited were of especially good quality and, judging by appearances alone, the oranges were equal to any exhibited for sale. That fruit was packed in New South Wales and shipped from Sydney, and commanded the highest prices. In 1928, the South African citrusgrowers were shipping a good deal of fruit to England, but much of it was of inferior quality. The South African Government offered inducements to the citrus-growers to produce varieties which were found to be. most popular in the markets of the Old Country, with the result that when I was in England 1 saw a Union Castle boat at Southhampton unloading over 50,000 bushels of South African oranges, which upon inspection proved to be as good as any produced in any other part of the world. I was informed that, as the result of the assistance granted to the citrus-growers by the Government of South Africa, the quality of the product had improved materially. I urge upon the Minister the desirability of instituting inquiries to ascertain the most favoured varieties in the export markets with a view to producing those varieties especially for export. In the opinion of the English buyers the Australian oranges have too many seeds in them; but no fault is found with the condition of the oranges on arrival on the English market.

The citrus industry is well worth fostering and I trust that every honorable member in this House will support this bill as representing an effort on the part of the Government to improve the conditions of the industry. Honorable members opposite too frequently blame Tasmania for the absence of markets for Australian citrus fruits, and only too often do we hear the statement repeated that the embargo placed upon the importation of New Zealand potatoes has had a disastrous effect on the citrus industrygenerally. As I have said on many occasions, the embargo on the importation of certain New Zealand potatoes had nothing whatever to do with the decision of the New Zealand Government to impose an embargo in respect of the importation of Australian citrus fruits grown in certain areas.

Mr NOCK:
RIVERINA, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

– Although there is no disease in Australian cherries, the New Zealand Government will not permit their importation.

Mr FROST:

– I can quite understand that if the cherries are grown in an area infested with fruit fly, but I am quite sure that no embargo is placed on the importation of cherries from disease-free areas. Tasmania had much the same experience as New South Wales in connexion with its attempts to eradicate orchard pests. As a preventive measure the Tasmanian Government passed a law which requires that all trees grown in back yards must be sprayed, and provides that those found to be infested with disease may be destroyed. . In Tasmania a householder must either keep his trees clean or lose them. I agree with the honorable member for Macquarie (Mr. John Lawson) that a neglected orchard is a veritable nursery” for pests. Apparently, however, the New South Wales Government is afraid to bring in a law requiring all householders to keep their fruit trees clean, and because of that, the commercial fruit-growers are penalized. The Commonwealth Government has no power to deal with these matters except in relation to the Federal Capital Territory. They come within the province of the States, and unless the State governments bring down legislation designed to aid the fruit-growers in the eradication of insect pests, the fruit-growers will continue to suffer heavy losses.

Mr HAWKER:
Wakefield

.- I approve the main purpose of this bill. I congratulate the Acting Minister for Commerce (Mr. Archie Cameron) upon having introduced a measure providing for assistance to be given for a period of three years. To that extent, this is an improvement on . previous measures. I also agree that it is fair to provide for a tapering off of the bounty over a period, at the expiration of which the industry may be expected to have reorganized itself and improved the quality of its product. I suggest, however, that the period hero fixed is too short to achieve any practical results in certain most important directions, and that the tapering off is too sharp to give either a sense of security, even for the period covered by the bounty, or the necessary encouragement to induce growers to incur the risk, trouble and expense of establishing a stable, self-supporting market.

Mr Frost:

– The period should be not less than five years.

Mr HAWKER:

– I agree with the honorable member; and the tapering down should be no sharper than at the rate of 3d. a case a year. Most of the trouble in this industry has been experienced in New South Wales, which has never exported considerable quantities of citrus fruits other than to New Zealand. Encouragement of this sort for three years will not be sufficient to induce any grower to make a change of the varieties grown. In the past, a consistent plan has been followed only in South Australia, and the results have been so uncertain and discouraging that it is unlikely that this bounty will lead to any considerable development or improvement of the existing, rather chaotic, and struggling condition of the industry. However, for the present year the bounty is on a ‘ satisfactory basis, and the provision in respect of subsequent years can bc dealt with when the time arrives. I, therefore, do not press the Minister for any alteration of the schedule to the billIn committee, however, I propose to direct attention to the safeguards provided in respect of the growers, for whom the bounty is being provided. As the bill is drafted, some fruit may pass into the hands of dealers and be exported by them, the grower being unaware that he is entitled to the bounty. Some obligation should be placed upon the exporter to notify the grower of his intention to export, and thus enable the grower to apply for the bounty. I have much pleasure in supporting the bill. [Quorum formed.)

Mr PRICE:
Boothby

.- I join with other honorable members in congratulating the Government upon having introduced this measure, and the Acting Minister for Commerce (Mr. Archie Cameron) on the able manner in which, so far, lie has handled it. I consider that he has made quite a good showing as a Minister in this House, and that he should be commended for the work he is doing.

I am not altogether enamored of bounties, but in the present instance a bounty is justified. In the first year it will be at the rate of 2s. a case, in the second year at the rate of ls. 6d. a case, and in the third year at the rate of ls. a case. Some of the finest oranges grown in the world are produced in the electorate of Boothby. Whilst I was in London as Agent-General for South Australia, many experimental shipments of oranges were made from that State, and I was pleased at the manner in which they were received on the London market; there was a great demand for them, and eventually a good trade was developed. Even when the embargo on the export to New Zealand was imposed, oranges from Renmark and the Torrens Valley were admitted into that dominion. The bill is drafted on right lines, and I hope that it will have a speedy passage.

Certain remarks have been made in regard to the period of the bounty. I should have liked it to be five years, but I am prepared to support the three-year period in the hope that it will prove of benefit to-: this particular industry.

Mr POLLARD:
Ballarat

.-I support the bill, and am, indeed, gratified that the Acting Minister for Commerce (Mr. Archie Cameron) has seen fit to assist the growers of citrus fruits in such a material fashion. The greatest measure of my approval is given to the encouragement of primary producers to be members of a co-operative organization. I am conscious of the fact that, under the prevailing economic conditions, those engaged in different callings must, if they are to obtain, justice, belong to an organization. The advantages of co-operation n.re greater in the case of primary producers than in the case of any other class in tlie community. It goes against my grain to congratulate a government to which I am politically opposed, but I believe in giving credit where it is due, and on this occasion, at least, every member of this Parliament can support the Government in the measure it has introduced. If the citrus-growers of Australia are entitled to a bounty, by the same rule so also are the wheat-growers, the woolgrowers, and the exporters of every other form of primary production. I hope that, after this exhibition of political wisdom, the Ministry will introduce in the ensuing session measures of a like character in relation to wheat, butter, wool and other exportable primary products. I have always been a supporter of the policy of protection, but only because I prefer to be robbed by the local rather than by the overseas manufacturer. If I support a protectionist policy in respect of secondary industries, I must also support the protection of primary industries.

I commend the bill to honorable members, and hope that it will pass. I take particular pleasure in commending the Government, for having endorsed the principle that no grower shall be eligible for the bounty unless he is a member of a co-operative organization.

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:
BarkerActing Minister for Commerce · CP

– in reply - The States have complete control of production, and the Commonwealth , is not able, by any force of its own, to compel adherence to the planting of certain varieties. The matter of the Mediterranean fruit, fly, raised by the honorable member for Macquarie (Mr. John Lawson), was discussed at the last meeting of the Australian Agricultural Council, and arrangements w-ere then made for efforts to be initiated to eradicate that pest.

The Deputy Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Forde) has referred to the New Zealand market. I was particularly struck with some of his remarks in regard to the potato market, and assure him that I shall keep them in mind. It seems that be and T are getting on to common ground. Qnorwm formed.’] The Com monwealth Government has no power to control local marketing although it would like to see improved methods adopted. Reference was made in the course of the debate to markets in the East. I regret to say that within the last few days information has reached us from Ceylon that fruit fly dangers have been discovered there. This is additional evidence of the need for the drastic control of orchards. Although I appreciate the complimentary remarks of some honorable members in connexion with the introduction of this bill, I remind them that I am merely the instrument chosen by the Government to implement this part of its policy.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time.

In committee:

Clauses 1 to 5 agreed to. [Quorum formed.]

Clause 6 (Payee of bounty).

Mr BEASLEY:
West Sydney

– I understand that this clause is designed to ensure that bounty payments shall be made direct to the growers. The Labour party has always been insistent upon that course being adopted. It is totally opposed to bounty payments being made to intermediaries of any description. . The corresponding provision -of certain other bounty bills has not been satisfactory in this regard, for we know that at times agents have arranged for bounty payments to be made to them to meet certain alleged contingencies which they have asserted have arisen in connexion with the growers’ .business relations, or even in connexion with liens on properties. The Labour party does not believe that any bounty payments should be made except to the growers of the fruit. It is not our responsibility to provide money from the Consolidated Revenue merely to improve the financial position of agents and intermediaries. Our purpose should be to assist the grower of the fruit, and we should ensure that any payments made under this or any other bounty measure are actually used for that purpose. Sub-clause 2 of the clause reads -

Where the grower of the citrus fruits exports the citrus fruits through an agent the bounty may be paid to the agent who shall bc liable to pay the amount thereof as a debt due from him to the grower.

I do not know why that roundabout method should be adopted to express the intention of the Government.Why should the agent be mentioned? In any case, an agent may become bankrupt. In such an event what redress would the grower have in respect of the amount of bounty due to him from the agent? “I ask the Minister to give me an unequivocal assurance that this bounty will definitely find its way into the hands of the grower.

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:
BarkerActing Minister for Commerce · CP

– I assurethe honorable member that this clause, in conjunction with clause 7, which obliges exporters to furnish returns in relation to citrus fruits exported by them, absolutely safeguards the position of the growers. [Quorum formed.] Some growers prefer to act through agents as they do not live near capital cities where facilities are available to handle their fruit easily. The Government also has power under this measure to make regulations which will still further strengthen the position of the growers.

Mr Beasley:

– What would happen if litigation became necessary

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:

– I understand that the contest would be between the Minister and the agent, for the agent, cannot export citrus fruit without a licence. The regulation-making power under this measure is a handy lever by which to enforce compliance with its provisions. The honorable member may rest assured that these bounty payments will actually reach the growers.

Clause agreed to.

Clause 7 (Returns by exporters).

Mr HAWKER:
Wakefield

.- Will the Acting Minister for Commerce (Mr.Archie Cameron) assure me that adequate provision has been made to oblige persons who purchase citrus fruit from growers and afterwards export it to inform the growers concerned that the fruit has been exported, so that they may apply for the bounty? Unless I am given an absolute assurance on that point I shall move an amendment to compel exporters to notify growers that fruit purchased from them is intended for export.

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:
BarkerActing Minister for Commerce · CP

– I give the honorable member for Wakefield (Mr. Hawker) a definite assurance that every grower who does not apply for a bounty in respect of fruitsold by him and subsequently exported will be advised to make an application for it. I also undertake that no bounty will be paid to an exporter except on the written authority of the grower.

Clause agreed to.

Clauses8 to 12 agreed to.

Schedule agreed to.

Preamble and title agreed to.

Bill reported without amendment; report adopted.

Bill read a third time.

page 3001

ASSENT TO. BILLS

Assent to the following bills reported : - .

Science anil Industry Research Appropriation Bill1938.

Invalid and Old-age Pensions Appropriation Bill 1938.

Representation Bill1938.

page 3001

BILLS RETURNED FROM THE SENATE

The following bills were returned from the Senate without amendment or requests : -

Supply Bill (No. 1) 1938-39.

New Guinea Loan Guarantee Bill 1938.

National Health and Pensions Insurance (Employers’ Contributions) Bill 1938.

National Health and Pensions Insurance (Employees’ Contributions) Bill 1938.

page 3001

SUPPLEMENTARY APPROPRIATION BILL 1936-37:

Second Reading

Debate resumed from the 28th June (vide page 2731) on motion by Mr. Casey -

That the bill be now read a second time.

Mr FORDE:
Capricornia

.- I take this opportunity to raise a question in connexion with the administration of the Australian Broadcasting Commission. I have asked questions in the last fortnight or so about the refusal of the Australian Broadcasting Commission to broadcast the address of the Anglican Archbishop of Brisbane, Dr. Wand, from St. Barnabas’ Church, Ithaca, at 7 o’clock in the morning, and the replies that I have received are not satisfactory. It is no wonder that the public objects to commissions and boards created by Parliament which become autocratic and egotistical in the extreme and develop an exaggerated opinion of their own importance and a disregard for the general public. The position into which the Australian Broadcasting Commission is drifting is one that calls for investigation and reorganization of the commission itself and of its activities.

I was amazed recently to read in the press of the Australian Broadcasting Commission’s refusal to provide facilities for Archbishop Wand, of Brisbane, to broadcast from St. Barnabas’ Church, Ithaca, on the occasion of the church’s jubilee. The press paragraph sets out the reason as one of cost. The Prime Minister, in reply to a question, said that the General Manager of the Australian Broadcasting Commission had advised that the granting of the request would entail a special opening of the station at 7 o’clock on Sunday morning, whereas the normal broadcasting hours were from 6.30 a.m. to 11.30 p.m. on week days, and from 8 a.m. to 10.30 p.m. on Sundays, and that the commission considered that the present hour of opening on Sundays, viz. 8 a.m., was a reasonable one. I am not satisfied with that reply. Archbishop Wand and the church authorities in Brisbane in particular and in Queensland generally are also dissatisfied. It was pointed out that the refusal was in accordance with an agreement with the Postmaster-General’s Department not to broadcast church services except at 11 a.m. and 7.30 p.m. This, in my opinion, is absurd, for three reasons :

On occasions, several times a year, St. Barnabas’ Church services have been broadcast at 7 a.m., such as on Palm Sunday, for the distribution of palms and the first communions, the service being followed by a breakfast at which the address is given by some notable person.
Many people prefer their religious exercises early in the morning. The 11 o’clock service is distinctly weak in many churches.
Cost of overtime is alleged, but what is that compared with the high fees - some say hundreds of pounds - paid to certain individuals for half an hour’s performance. It also must be- borne in mind that the Australian Broadcasting Commission makes good profits, in view of which the extra cost would have been trifling.
Recently the test match results were broadcast until 4 o’clock in the morning for several days, and I presume the forthcoming matches will also be broadcast. I do not say one word against the broadcasting of the test matches. They are justified. In the opinion of all fairminded people, however, the needs of religion deserve au equally sympathetic consideration.

I would also add to the refusal of the broadcast by Archbishop Wand last Sunday week, the refusal to broadcast the Premier of Queensland last August at S a.m. from St. Barnabas’ Church, when lie gave an address to the communicants. Mr. Forgan Smith’s address was distinctly non-party and if it had been allowed to be broadcast from the national station his hearers would have derived benefit from it. When the commission refused to broadcast the address one of the commercial stations filled the gap. The Australian Broadcasting Commission has also refused to broadcast the Anglican Annual Communion Breakfast of that church, at which Mr. E. A. Cooper, the State Treasurer of Queensland, is to give the address. Although that address will be non-political the commission refuses to broadcast either the service or the address at the breakfast.

The lesson from all this is that Parliament has delegated its powers to a commission from whose decision there apparently is no appeal. This is surely a negation of democracy. The power of the commission savours of dictatorship which overrides democracy, and if I were the head of a government it would not be tolerated ‘ for five minutes. Ministers when approached individually say that they are in sympathy with those who protest against the unreasonable attitude adopted by the commission, but when they are asked to do something they say that they cannot intervene.

I wish, to emphasize that the Golden Jubilee of the St. Barnabas’ Church in Queensland was regarded as of sufficient importance that the press gave much space to it before and after the event, and yet the Australian Broadcasting Commission would not broadcast at that function the speech of a very eminent Anglican Archbishop, who has shown on more than one occasion that he is a broad, tolerant man with very high Australian ideals.

I ask the Minister to bring my complaint before the Cabinet meeting on Monday with a view to having the policy of the Australian Broadcasting Commission reviewed and to have permission granted for the broadcast of the services and addresses at the annual communal breakfast at St. Barnabas’ Church in the near future at which the Treasurer of Queensland is to deliver a non-political address.

Mr HOLLOWAY:
Melbourne Ports

– The Minister representing the PostmasterGeneral (Mr. Perkins) promised to try to get for me a report on the extraordinary censorship by the Australian Broadcasting Commission of Judge Foster’s proposed lecture on encroachments upon personal liberty in Australia. Judge Foster accepted an invitation by the commission to speak from an “A” class station on the subject of personal liberty, but, when some members of the commission objected to certain parts of his address, and it was censored, he decided not to speak. Judge Foster, whose proposed address I have read, carefully avoided any interference with or any statement that might be construed as hurting the religious susceptibilities of any section of the community. The people of Victoria, who, possibly, know Judge Foster better than do people in other parts of the country, although he is well known throughout the Common-‘ wealth, were ‘so disgusted at the attitude of the commission that I, along with other honorable members, was asked to raise the matter on the floor of the House. Ministers may be surprised to know that honorable members do not like bringing matters before Parliament; they would rather settle them privately with the Ministers, because that is a better way of having things done. The Minister repre- senting the Postmaster-General, however, is in a difficult position, because, when the Parliament is in recess, there is no need for him to represent the PostmasterGeneral, and he does not do so. I do not blame the Minister in this matter. The people of Victoria demand a final answer from the Australian Broadcasting Commission, and I- should be pleased if the Minister would approach the commission with a view to obtaining a report for submission to Parliament. I cannot understand the attitude of the commission because the Australian people, as a whole, possess a broad outlook on questions of religion. In the lecture which he submitted to the commission, Judge Foster referred to some figures of the past, and I am led to believe that some of the members of the commission thought that he should not be allowed to do so. The great body of public opinion in Victoria, and I think in the rest of Australia, is that there was nothing in Judge Foster’s lecture that warranted the drastic blue pencilling which it received from the commission’, and which led to the cancellation of the address. The bigoted attitude which the commission adopted in this matter is itself an encroachment upon the liberty of the people.

Sitting suspended from 6.15 to 7.30 p.m.

Mr RIORDAN:
Kennedy

– I rise to discuss a matter regarding which I have been in correspondence with the Treasurer (Mr. Casey) for some time. It was also the subject of a recent interview between us. It concerns certain grants made available by the Commonwealth Government to the various State governments for the purpose of encouraging metalliferous mining, largely for the purpose of providing work for the unemployed. In December, 1934, at the invitation of the ‘Commonwealth Government, Ministers for Mines in the various State governments were called into conference at Melbourne to discuss this matter, and at that conference the ‘Commonwealth Government agreed -to make assistance available. It was actually decided to make the gi’ant available for only one year, but it was subsequently agreed that payments should be continued for a period of three years. It was expected that the scheme would be put into operation immediately, but delays occurred, and it was not until February, 1935, that the first money was made available. By July, 1935, the scheme was fairly launched. Queensland submitted a definite proposition, and because it presented a good case, it succeeded in obtaining tho largest share of the grant. In 1935- 36, the first year in which the scheme was in operation, the Commonwealth Government contributed £70,000. This sum, together with the £10,000 made available by the State Government, was expended during the fifteen months which followed the inauguration of the scheme, and the result was a marked revival of metalliferous mining iu the back country of Cairns, Chillagoe and Charters Towers. At the request of the Commonwealth Government, in 1935, representatives of various States again attended a conference for the purpose of reviewing the progress of the scheme, and at that conference strong representations were made ‘to the Minister in Charge of Development for the continuance of the Commonwealth grant for at least three years, as originally intended. The Commonwealth subsequently advised the States that it had approved of the continuance of assistance, but on a reduced scale. In the succeeding financial years, 1936- 37 and 1937-38, Queensland received from the Commonwealth Government £35,600 and £24,900 respectively. Queensland has always observed strictly the requirements laid down by the Commonwealth Government for the expenditure of the grant, which was made available to the States solely for the purpose of bringing about a revival in metalliferous mining and a consequent decrease of unemployment. If the Queensland Government has desired to give assistance in any particular direction; it has always asked the Commonwealth Government to state whether or not such assistance would be within the terms of the grant. The conditions laid down by the conference have also been observed. The importance of such a scheme, having as its object the rejuvenation of a valuable industry, such as metalliferous mining, can be readily appreciated. Many years ago, thousands of miners were engaged in all forms of metalliferous mining, particularly in the back country around Chillagoe. This particular portion of Queensland has in latter years, however,

– I appeal to the Government to assist in the development of the forests of Tasmania. That State has vast areas which cannot be put to any other use, but yet are superior to all other parts of the world for the growing of forests. Two large firms have begun the manufacture of paper, one in the north, and one in the south. In order to maintain supplies for that industry, the forests of the State will have to be preserved. The practice has been to allow selectors to hew out 200 acres and perhaps destroy 88,000 acres of forest country in the process. The State Government has not the necessary funds to devote to the preservation of these forests.. Recently all the State governments received a pittance from the Commonwealth Government for this purpose, and it has been of considerable benefit. Timber supplies are becoming short throughout the world. Countries which formerly permitted the denudation of their forest areas have now altered then policy on account of soil erosion. We must learn the lesson taught by those countries, especially the United States of America, where there are now millions of acres which will never again be of any value because of the destruction of forests. If we permit our forests to be destroyed we shall have a barren country in another 100yearsorless.CertainPartsofTasmania have a wonderful rainfall, but” the country is suitable only for the growing of timber. It is necessary to prevent bush fires, cut out all waste timbers, and thus maintain a healthy forest. But to do that, money is needed. We know that the financial resources of the States are limited, because all the profitable avenues for the collection of revenue are exploited by the Commonwealth. Therefore, the Commonwealth should provide the necessary funds to enable the States to undertake these works.

It is time that the departmental report on non-official post offices was tabled in this House, and assistance was given to the officers in charge of that branch of the Postal Department’s operations. In my electorate, in which the population is scattered, some postal officers receive only 10s. or 12s. a week, and have to remain in the offices for long periods. A minimum rate for non-official postmasters and postmistresses has been sought. The lowest rate paid should be not less than £1 a week. I understand that the Government has received a report from the committee which inquired into this matter.

Mr SPEAKER:

– Order! I remind honorable members that the discussion must be confined to those matters for which money is provided in the schedule to the bill.

Mr Makin:

– On a point of order, for my guidance and that of other honorable gentlemen, is it not the practice, before Supply can be granted to His Majesty, that there shall be a rectification of all grievances which may be entertained by honorable members regarding public administration? If that be so,should not honorable members have the widest scope in the discussion of public matters?

– Order ! The honorable member for East Sydney is distinctly out of order and is deliberately offensive.

Mr Gardner:

- Mr. Speaker

Mr SPEAKER:

– Order ! The honorable member for Robertson will resume his seat. If the honorable member for East Sydney interjects again to-night, I shall immediately name him.

Mr Ward:

– Mr. Speaker-

Mr SPEAKER:

– Order ! The honorable member must resume his seat, or I shall name him.

Mr Ward:

– The honorable member for Robertson was offensive to me. [Quorum formed.]

Mr MAKIN:
Hindmarsh

.- I do not know whether the proposed appropriation for the Department of the Treasury includes any amount in connexion with the Repatriation Department.

– The Acting Minister for Trade and Customs (Mr. Perkins) made this move on his own account.

Mr BARNARD:

– If that is so, I give him a double meed of praise. I have no desire to protest against the payment of adequate out-of-pocket expenses to persons who perform useful services for the Government, but I should like to know exactly how this amount of £250 was expended, seeing that it is apparently supplementary to an amount provided under the same heading in the General Estimates.

An amount of £142 is provided under the heading, “District Laboratory” in the proposed vote for the Department of

Health. As this expenditure has apparently been incurred in Tasmania and probably at a place not far distant from my home in Launceston, I ask the Treasurer to give an explanation of it.

My reason for making these inquiries is that I believe the time has come for honorable members of this House to scrutinize much more carefully the expenditure of the money voted to the Treasurer in a lump sum. Under a recent measure, £2,000,000 was provided for the Treasurer to expend according to his discretion. My experience as a member of this Parliament is causing me to feel that such expenditure should be examined most carefully to ensure that the public funds are devoted wholly to legitimate purposes. The practice of the Government in forcing Parliament to remain in recess for long periods and then to call upon members to work under a very heavy strain to the point of fatigue does not lend itself to a careful examination of the various measures submitted to us.

Mr SPEAKER:

– The honorable member is not now discussing the bill.

Mr BARNARD:

– I have merely made those remarks in passing, Sir. I seriously request the Treasurer to furnishme with detailed information in connexion with the items to which I have specifically referred.

Under “ Miscellaneous Services “, controlled by the Prime Minister’s Department, an amount of £409 is allocated to the Commonwealth Grants Commission. This, I take it, entitles me to direct the attention of the Government to the manner in which certain recommendations of the Grants Commission in relation to Tasmania have been dis-. regarded. I do not criticize the commission itself on this account, but I ask the Treasurer to explain the Government’s attitude in connexion with the matter.

The item on page 38 of the bill, “ Secondary Industries Research - Motor Car and Aeroplane Engines, £1,000” also calls for some explanation. I should like some explanation of the appropriation of £100,000 for research by the Council for Scientific and Industrial Research into the manufacture of motor car and aeroplane engines. I should also like some explanation of the item “ Contributions towards cost of maintenance by State of reception and farm training depots, £16,926 “.. That is an unusually large item for a supplementary appropriation bill. Has the money already been spent or is it to be spent? I ask the Treasurer also to explain section A of Division 130, “ Central office “, under the Postmaster-General’s Department. If the Minister is able to give a satisfactory explanation as to why all these unusually large items are appropriated in a supplementary bill I shall be relieved. [Quorum formed.]

Mr SHEEHAN:
Cook

.- There are several items in this bill which warrant the consideration of the House. I cite the meagre amount of £642 set aside for the relief of unemployment.. That is an indictment of the Government.

Mr Casey:

– This is merely an appropriation of money that was spent eighteen months ago.

Mr SHEEHAN:

Mr.Beasley. - I rose, Mr. Speaker.

Mr SPEAKER:

– I did not see the honorable gentleman rise until I had given the call to the Treasurer. If honorable members engage in conversation and lose their opportunity, they cannot blame the Chair.

Mr Beasley:

– I shall take other action.

Mr CASEY:

– I point out to the honorable member for Cook (Mr. Sheehan) that these are Supplementary Estimates in addition to the ordinary Estimates that have already been passed. The remarks of the honorable gentleman showed clearly that he was not aware of the nature of the document with which the House is dealing. The honorable member for Kennedy (Mr. Riordan) spoke of the metalliferous mining grant. This matter has been considered by the Government on many occasions. The grant was made at the nadir of the depression in order to enable the States to help miners. A decision having been reached, the Government cannot reconsider this matter. The grant must end on the 30th June this year;

I shall bring under the notice of the Postmaster-General (Senator A. J. McLachlan) the representations of the Deputy Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Forde) and the honorable member for Hindmarsh (Mr. Makin) regarding the Postal Department. The honorable member for Bass (Mr.” Barnard) spoke of an under-estimate by the Minister for the Interior (Mr. McEwen), butas the honorable member has not remained in the chamber to hear the explanations for which he asked, I can only repeat that these are Supplementary Estimates, not the Estimates proper. They are merely the amounts by which theordinary Estimates have been over-expended. The payment has been taken out of the Treasurer’s Advance. The whole of the money was fully expended in the year which ended twelve months ago to-day.

Mr Sheehan:

-Was the £642 advanced for the relief of distress among the unemployed in addition to the £1,000 ?

Mr CASEY:

– It was additional to whatever amount was spent under that heading.

Question put -

That the bill be now read a second time.

The House divided. (Mr. Speaker - Hon. G. J. Bell.)

AYES: 22

NOES: 11

Majority . . . . 11

AYES

NOES

Question so resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time.

In committee:

Question put -

That clause 1 be agreed to.

The committee divided. (Chairman - Mr. Prowse.)

AYES: 20

NOES: 13

Majority . . . . 7

AYES

NOES

Question so resolved in the affirmative.

Clause agreed to.

Motion by Mr. Casey put -

That progress be reported.

The committee divided. (Chairman - Mr. Prowse.)

AYES: 20

NOES: 13

Majority . . . . 7

AYES

NOES

Question so resolved in the affirmative.

Progress reported.

Question put -

That the House will, at a later hour this day, again resolve itself into the said committee.

The House divided. (Mr. Speaker - Hon.g. J. Bell.)

AYES: 22

NOES: 12

Majority . . . . 10

AYES

NOES

Question so resolved in the affirmative.

page 3011

BILLS RETURNED FROM THE SENATE

The following bills were returned from the Senate without amendment or requests : -

Census and Statistics Bill 1938.

Empire Air Service (England to Australia) Bill 1938

Dairy Produce Export Control Bill 1938.

Meat Export Control Bill 1938.

Canned Fruits Export Control Bill 1938.

Canned Fruits Export Charges Bill 1938.

Dried Fruits Export Control Bill 1938.

Citrus Fruits Bounty Bill 1938.

Income Tax Collection Bill 1938.

Excise Tariff 1938.

page 3012

SPECIAL ADJOURNMENT

Motion (by Mr. Lyons) put -

That the House, at its rising, adjourn until a date and hour to be fixed by Mr. Speaker, which time of meeting shall be notified by Mr. Speaker to each member by telegram or letter.

The House divided. (Mb. Speaker - Hon. G. J. Bell.)

AYES: 23

NOES: 10

Majority . . . . 13

AYES

NOES

Question so resolved in the affirmative.

page 3012

LEAVE OF ABSENCE TO ALL

page 3012

MEMBERS

Motion (by Mr. Lyons) agreed to -

That leave of absence be given to every member of the House of Representatives from the determination of this sitting of the House to the date of its next sitting.

page 3012

ADJOURNMENT

Price Cutting in the Cotton Trade - Public Servants: Military Service in the Event ofWar - Attendants in Federal Members’ Rooms - Appointment to Defence Department.

Mr LYONS:
Prime Minister · Wilmot · UAP

.- I move-

That the House do now adjourn.

I intimate to honorable members who have asked questions, or who may still have questions on the notice-paper, that replies will be sent to them as soon as they are prepared.’ The remaining business on the notice-paper is not of such an urgent character that it cannot wait until the House meets again.

Mr BEASLEY:
West Sydney

– I take this opportunity to ventilate some matters which I consider of importance. I would not do so at this stage of the proceedings if another opportunity had been presented, because I have no wish to detain honorable members. The first matter relates to the failure of the Customs Department to deal adequately with the methods employed by a cotton combine, known as Coates Limited, in its endeavours to force an Australian firm of manufacturers’ agents, indentors and warehousemen out of business. It is interesting to follow the methods employed by the Coates combine to achieve its purpose. The Australian firm commenced trading in March, 1937, but the unscrupulous methods adopted by the combine to create a monopoly by selling certain lines below landed cost will eventually destroy its business. No one will deny the right of this firm to conduct a business in Australia such as that conducted by the Coates combine in other parts of the world, but no outside firm or combine should be permitted to use its influence and. its wealth to crush a competitor. Three different brands of cotton manufactured by the combine, known as “Hercules”, “New Century”, and “Martlet” were landed in Australia. Samples of all three were tested by the customs authorities in their Sydney laboratory, and the “ Martlet “ sample was found to be a better quality cotton than either of the other two brands. It is obvious that the combine set out to market, not an inferior grade of cotton, but an equally substantial cotton as its major line at a lower price, in its efforts to squeeze out its competitors. In a letter dated the 16th May, asking the Customs Department what had been done in regard to the matter, the Australian firm was informed that it had been referred to Canberra, and that appropriate action had been taken. Further inquiries revealed that it had been referred to Australia House, London, with instructions that the Coates combine should be interviewed in London with a view to having production costs produced. This matter, to some extent, touches upon the right of the department to examine costs of production in regard to articles imported into Australia. I understand that the required information was withheld by the combine. This indicates how the Ottawa Agreement operates in regard to these matters, when the Australian manufacturer is compelled to produce his costs of production, while his competitor, a wealthy overseas combine, is permitted to refuse to supply that information. The Collector of Customs then used his right under the act to assess a legitimate value on all importations of “Martlet” sewing cotton, and I am informed that duty is being levied on a price which is equivalent to the home price of “ Hercules “ cotton. Whether the manufacturers have increased the invoiced price of “Martlet “ or not, I am not in a position to say, but the fact is that the combine has not made any change in its selling prices, and it still continues to sell goods to the customers of the Australian firm at prices below landed cost. It has recently been stated that the same article is now being imported in colours as well as in black and white, and is sold at a ridiculous price. If this information is correct, it will be hopeless for the Australian firm to attempt to carry on. The Australian firm asked that this matter be ventilated in the appropriate quarter with a view to having action taken to prevent this worldwide combine from using methods in Australia, which have been effective in other countries to crush all competitors. It is not right that an Australian firm should be treated in this way, nor is it right that the power, wealth an’d influence of any combine should be permitted to override the powers of the Customs Department. It is the duty of this Parliament to take steps to see that no combine is permitted to continue these practices.

Yesterday, I asked the Minister for Defence (Mr. Thorby) a question concerning instructions issued to departmental heads in the capital cities. It has been reported - I know that it has actually occurred - that certain selected members of staffs have been asked whether, in the event of war in which Australia is involved, they would be willing to offer themselves for defence work either at home or abroad. I asked further what steps had been taken by the Government to protect employees who felt that in answering unfavorably they might be subjected directly or indirectly to victimization. The reply I received read -

From the information given by the honorable member, it is not possible to give a direct reply, but if he will furnish further details inquiries will he made. Speaking generally, those specific instructions of the nature referred to have been issued by the department. District base commandants have certain responsibilities for the preparation of plans for an emergency which involves consideration of staffing requirements.

My question had no relation whatever to base commandants, but applied to the heads of Commonwealth departments. I do not know whether this action has been taken in Canberra, but I know that questions have been asked in Sydney. I should like to know who issued instructions to heads of Commonwealth departments to arrange interviews with selected members of the staffs, and if the Government did not issue these instructions, am I to understand from the reply given that the base commandants have power to do so without the knowledge of the Government? I cannot believe that that is the case, but if it is wc are entitled to know whether departmental heads or members of the military forces have such authority. If no such authority has been issued, the members’ of the public service concerned will appreciate an expression of opinion on the subject. They are entitled to know who issued the instructions, and if the answer to my question is correct and not evasive, I take it that no such instructions have been issued by the Government and that heads of departments have no authority to do what has been done.

Mr Gander:

– It may have been done by some of Eric Campbell’s mob.

Mr BEASLEY:

– The heads of certain departments may be endeavouring to set up organizations or ascertain from members of their staffs whether they would be willing to do certain things, not only in regard to war, but perhaps in connexion with civil matters.

Another matter which I should like the Government to consider is the advisability of extending superannuation benefits to those officers who are performing very valuable work in the Federal Members’ rooms in the capital cities.

Mr Makin:

– I suppose that the honorable member includes typists?

Mr BEASLEY:

– Yes. During the last Parliament, a measure was passed in which provision was made for the members of the High Commissioner’s staff in London, the officers of the Repatriation Department and those in several other departments to receive superannuation benefits. At that time honorable members expressed the opinion that no section of the public service should receive special treatment in this respect and that superannuation benefits should be available to all Government servants. If officers who come in close contact with Ministers are fortunate enough to get their ear and have the Superannuation Act applied to them, other officers should have a similar privilege. I trust that during this recess the Government will look into this matter to see if it is not practicable to extend superannuation benefits to the officers employed in the Federal Members’ rooms in the various States. Many of us are prone to forget the very valuable services which these officers render. They undertake foi us work of a personal nature, and in many respects carry out responsibilities the value of which it is difficult to assess. They attend to our correspondence when we are indisposed or engaged on other public duties. They have been of great assistance to ‘ honorable members who have visited other parts of the world. Generally speaking, their work is important, and particularly do we appreciate the tact which they display in answering our correspondence.

Mr SPEAKER:

– The honorable member has exhausted his time.

Mr PERKINS:
Monaro - Acting Minister for Customs · Eden · UAP

.- The honorable member for “West Sydney (Mr. Beasley) has brought under the notice of the Government certain matters connected with my department. I do not know anything of the subject referred to by the honorable member, but I shall have full inquiries made and advise him of the result. The Minister for Defence (Mr. Thorby) wishes me to state that he has already answered in part the question raised by the honorable member, but that further inquiries are proceeding, ‘ the result of which will be conveyed to the honorable member. Consideration will also be given to the matter of superannuation benefits mentioned by the honorable member.

Mr WARD:
East Sydney

.- 1 bring under the notice of the Government a matter of political patronage. On the 23rd June, I asked the Minister for Defence whether he could supply information concerning the appointment to a position in the Defence Department of a Mr. Tart, a son-in-law of the Minister for Commerce (Sir Earle Page). The Minister informed me that he had no information on the subject-

Mr Gardner:

– I call attention to the state of the House.

There being no quorum present,

Mr. Speaker adjourned the House at 0.32 p.m. until a date and hour to be fixed by Mr. Speaker.

page 3014

ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS

The following answers to questions were circulated: -

Defence: Questioning of Departmental Officers

Mr Beasley:

y asked the Minister for Defence, upon notice -

On whose instructions have the departmental heads in the capital cities been permitted to call together selected members of their staffs to be asked such questions as whether they would offer themselves for work in connexion, with defence questions in the event of war? “
Has any direction been given that such members of the 6taff who, for reasons they may have, private or otherwise, do not feel disposed to agree to the proposals put to them, shall .be protected against victimization or other measures that may retard their progress in the department?

Mr Thorby:
CP

– The answer to the honorable member’s questions is as follows : -

From the information given by the honorable member, it is not possible to give a precise reply, but if he will furnish further details, inquiries will bo made. Speaking generally, no specific instructions of the nature referred to have been issued by the department. District Base Commandants have certain responsibilities for the preparation of plans for an emergency which involve consideration of staffing requirements.

Standardization of Railway Gauges

Mr Drakeford:
MARIBYRNONG, VICTORIA

d asked the Prime Minister, upon notice -

Hasthe Government yet taken any steps to call together, as agreed on atthe Premiers Conference in Adelaide in 1936,the representatives of the Federal and the State governments to deal with the standardization of railway gauges?
If no action has yet been taken, will he explain why and state whether it is intended to take action, and, if so, when?

Mr Lyons:
UAP

– As indicated in my reply to the honorable member on the 18th May, 1938, this matter has been listed for discussion at a conference of Ministers for Transport at a date to be arranged as early as possible. Conferences of officers representing the Commonwealth and the transport departments of several of the States have been held to draw up the agenda to be discussed at the conference of Ministers.

Windsor Telephone Exchange

Mr Holt:

t asked the Minister representing the Postmaster-General, upon notice -

When was a decision reached to replace the existing manual exchange at Windsor with an automatic exchange?
Has a site for the automatic exchange been selected?
What sum of money has been provided in the 1937-38 Estimates for the establishment of an automatic exchange at that place?
When will the work be commenced, and when is it anticipated that it will be completed?

Mr Perkins:
UAP

– The PostmasterGeneral has supplied the following information : -

March, 1937.
A sitehas been acquired and a new building is being provided thereon.
£40.000.
The new building is Hearing completion. The automatic switching equipment is now being delivered and completion of delivery is expected by the end of 1938. The equipment provides for 4,000 Tines to meet development and to replace the oldest portion of the manual switchboard. This work is expected to bo completed by December, 1938.

Migration from Holland and Denmark.

Mr Hutchinson:
DEAKIN, VICTORIA

n asked the Prime Minister, upon notice -

Has be received any cables fromthe Minister for Commerce (Sir Earle Page) on the question of a proposed migration agreement with Holland and Denmark, or cables dealing with migration from those countries to Australia?
If so, can ho give any information on the matters involved?

Mr Lyons:
UAP

– The answer to the honorable member’s questions is as follows : -

A cablegram has been received from the Minister for Commerce on the subject of the migration to Australia of people from Holland and Denmark. The information received from the Minister was general and preliminary, and consideration of the matter must await the receipt of definite proposals, which the governments of Hollandand Denmark are to submit. The Government has no intention of beginning schemes of assisted migration for migrants from countries other than the British Isles.

Inverell Rifle Range.

Mr Thorby:
CP

y. - On the 28th June, the honorable member for Gwydir (Mr. Scully) asked the following question, without notice : -

Will the Minister for Defence have funds made available immediately to the Inverell rifle range on account of the fact that, owing to the transfer of the site of the range,the Inverell Rifle Club is involved in considerable expense, and consequently requires immediate financial assistance, if possible, from the Defence Department?

I am now in a position to inform the honorable member as follows: -

The provision of funds for the construction of the Inverell rifle range will receive consideration early in the financial year 1938-39 when allocations are being made to the various military districts far construction and maintenance of rifle clubs ranges.

Naval Trainees at Port Melbourne,

Mr Thorby:
CP

– On the28th June, the honorable member for Melbourne Ports (Mr. Hollo way) asked the following question, without notice: -

Is the Minister for Defence aware that naval trainees at Port Melbourne, the principal naval depot of Victoria, arc compelled to do their exercises in the streets? If he is not aware of the situation, will he consult with the officers of his department and request them to make contact with the Port Melbourne Municipal Council to see whether a reserve ‘ cannot be made available for this purpose?

I am now in a position to inform the honorable member as follows: -

The naval drill hall at Port Melbourne is used to the utmost for drills and exercises. There is. however, no parade ground attached to this drill hall, andthe need for some such accommodation has been felt by the naval authorities, who made preliminary inquiries some months ago about a suitable site. The inquiries have not yet been completed, and the suggestion of thehonorable member will be given consideration.

Trade Mask Fees.

Mr Hughes:
UAP

s. - On the 29th June, the honorable member for Boothby (Mr. Price) asked a question relating to trade mark fees. I was then unable to answer the question in full, but the additional information has now been obtained, and is as follows : - 1.In what year in New Zealand, Australia, and Great Britain, respectively, didthe fees come into force with regard to (a) lodging of applications, (b) registration, and (c) renewal on the register? -

New Zealand - 1st July, 1922.

Australia - l6th August, 1929.

Great Britain - 31st March, 1920.

Whatwere the respective fees priorto these fees coining into force, and in what year, in each case, did the earlier fees come into force ? -

How manyunremoved trade marks were on the register at the cud of the years 1935-1936and1936-37?-

Cite as: Australia, House of Representatives, Debates, 30 June 1938, viewed 22 October 2017, <http://historichansard.net/hofreps/1938/19380630_reps_15_156/>.

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House of Representatives30 June 1938

QUESTION

TRADE PACT WITH JAPAN

Mr JOHN LAWSON:MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

Mr LYONS:Prime Minister · WILMOT, TASMANIA · UAP

QUESTION

SERVICE PENSIONS

Mr WARD:EAST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr THOMPSON:Minister without portfolio, assisting the Treasurer · NEW ENGLAND, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

QUESTION

PETROL TAX

Mr FRANCIS:MORETON, QUEENSLAND

Mr CASEY:Treasurer · CORIO, VICTORIA · UAP

FEDERAL CAPITAL TERRITORY

Ordinances and Awards

Mr McEWEN:Minister for the Interior · INDI, VICTORIA · CP

QUESTION

MARKETING OF AUSTRALIAN WOOL

Mr PROWSE:FORREST, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Mr LYONS:UAP

QUESTION

FURTHER ISSUE OF CROWN PIECES

Mr HOLT:FAWKNER, VICTORIA

Mr CASEY:UAP

PAPERS

OUT GLASS INDUSTRY

Mr PERKINS:Minister without portfolio assisting the Minister for Trade and Customs · EDEN-MONARO, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

QUESTION

YAMPI SOUND IRON ORE DEPOSITS

Mr GREGORY:SWAN, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Mr LYONS:UAP

QUESTION

NON-OFFICIAL POST OFFICES

Mr JOHN LAWSON:MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

Mr PERKINS:UAP

QUESTION

OVERSEAS AIR-MAIL SERVICE

Mr SPENDER:WARRINGAH, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr THORBY:Minister for Defence · CALARE, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

Mr HAWKER:WAKEFIELD, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

Mr THORBY:

QUESTION

STABILIZATION OF WHEAT INDUSTRY

Mr WILSON:WIMMERA, VICTORIA

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:Minister without portfolio assisting the Minister for Commerce · BARKER, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · CP

QUESTION

NATIONAL HEALTH AND PENSIONS INSURANCE

Mr BEASLEY:WEST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr CASEY:UAP

Sir FREDERICK STEWART:PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr CASEY:

Mr Beasley:

Mr CASEY:

Mr STREET:CORANGAMITE, VICTORIA

Mr CASEY:

Mr BEASLEY:WEST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP ; LANG LAB from 1931; ALP from 1936; ALP (N-C) from 1940; ALP from 1941

Mr CASEY:

QUESTION

MEDICAL RESEARCH FUND

Mr JENNINGS:WATSON, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:CP

QUESTION

MANUFACTURE OF MOTOR-CAR ENGINES

Sir HENRY GULLETT:HENTY, VICTORIA

Mr PERKINS:UAP

QUESTION

AUTOMATIC TELEPHONE EXCHANGE FOR RYDE DISTRICT

Sir FREDERICK STEWART:

Mr PERKINS:UAP

QUESTION

MANUFACTURE OF AIRCRAFT IN AUSTRALIA

Sir HENRY GULLETT:

Mr THORBY:CP

Mr THORBY:

Mr HOLT:

Mr THORBY:

Mr Holt:

Mr THORBY:

QUESTION

COAL FREIGHTS

House of Representatives
30 June 1938

Mr JOHN LAWSON:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

Mr LYONS:
Prime Minister · WILMOT, TASMANIA · UAP

Mr WARD:
EAST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr THOMPSON:
Minister without portfolio, assisting the Treasurer · NEW ENGLAND, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

Mr FRANCIS:
MORETON, QUEENSLAND

Mr CASEY:
Treasurer · CORIO, VICTORIA · UAP

Mr McEWEN:
Minister for the Interior · INDI, VICTORIA · CP

Mr PROWSE:
FORREST, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Mr LYONS:
UAP

Mr HOLT:
FAWKNER, VICTORIA

Mr CASEY:
UAP

Mr PERKINS:
Minister without portfolio assisting the Minister for Trade and Customs · EDEN-MONARO, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

Mr GREGORY:
SWAN, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Mr LYONS:
UAP

Mr JOHN LAWSON:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · UAP

Mr PERKINS:
UAP

Mr SPENDER:
WARRINGAH, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr THORBY:
Minister for Defence · CALARE, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

Mr HAWKER:
WAKEFIELD, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

Mr WILSON:
WIMMERA, VICTORIA

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:
Minister without portfolio assisting the Minister for Commerce · BARKER, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · CP

Mr BEASLEY:
WEST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr CASEY:
UAP

Sir FREDERICK STEWART:
PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr STREET:
CORANGAMITE, VICTORIA

Mr BEASLEY:
WEST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP ; LANG LAB from 1931; ALP from 1936; ALP (N-C) from 1940; ALP from 1941

Mr JENNINGS:
WATSON, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr ARCHIE CAMERON:
CP

Sir HENRY GULLETT:
HENTY, VICTORIA

Mr PERKINS:
UAP

Mr PERKINS:
UAP

Mr THORBY:
CP

Mr JAMES:
HUNTER, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr LYONS:
UAP

Mr LYONS:
UAP

Mr THORBY:
CP

Mr McEWEN:
Minister for the Interior · Indi · CP

Mr McEWEN:
Minister for the Interior · Indi · CP

Mr FORDE:
Capricornia

Mr THORBY:
CP

Mr FAIRBAIRN:
Flinders