House of Representatives
18 September 1925

9th Parliament · 3rd Session



Mr. Speaker (Rt. Hon. W. A. Watt) took the chair . at 11 a.m., and read prayers

page 2552

PETITION

Mr. LACEY presented a petition from the landowners and residents of Port Pirie, Telowie, Wandearah, and Port Germain, South Australia, in reference to the proposed route of the Port Augusta to Red Hill railway.

Petition received and read.

page 2552

QUESTION

ELECTION RUMOURS

Mr CHARLTON:
HUNTER, NEW SOUTH WALES

– Is it a fact, as rumoured, that at a Ministerial party meeting this morning; it was decided to accept my challenge, and go to the country forthwith?

Mr BRUCE:
Minister for External Affairs · FLINDERS, VICTORIA · NAT

– I do not know whence these rumours emanate. I have certainly no information on the matter I can give to the honorable member.

page 2552

QUESTION

DISLOCATION OF EXPORT TRADE

Use of Commonwealth Steamers

Mr GREGORY:
SWAN, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

– I have a copy of a cablegram received from London at 10 o’clock this morning to the effect that the shipping companies have drawn up a provisional arrangement curtailing the sailings of vessels to the dominions, and that this arrangement is likely to operate in the course of a few days if the position does not improve. What steps does the Government propose to take to secure the export of Australia’s produce in the event of such a curtailment?’ Furthermore, will the Prime Minister tell the House on Wednesday next the rates of wages ruling on British and foreign ships respectively trading to Australia?

Mr BRUCE:
NAT

– The information which the honorable member has received has not reached me, but if sailings to Australia are considerably curtailed our position will be most serious. I trust that it will not be necessary for the shipping companies to take this course, but, if they do, the Government will be obliged to consider all measures and means’ by which the export of Australia’s surplus products may be maintained.

Mr E RILEY:
SOUTH SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– As the Commonwealth has steamers lying idle, for which there would be no difficulty in getting crews, will the Prime Minister ask the Commonwealth Shipping. Board to consider the propriety of putting them into commission?

Mr BRUCE:

– I shall refer the honorable member’s suggestion to the board. But the unemployed tonnage owned by the Commonwealth would not provide the refrigerating space which is provided on the overseas vessels which are now being held up in Australian ports. It is that shortage of refrigerated space that will have the most disastrous effect on Australian industries, and the difficulties of the situation would not be overcome by the adoption of the honorable member’s suggestion, even if it were practicable to carry it into effect

page 2553

QUESTION

PARLIAMENT HOUSE, CANBERRA

Opening Ceremony

Mr E RILEY:
SOUTH SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– I should like to know who is to have the honour of opening the now nearly completed provisional Parliament House at Canberra, in which Parliament is likely to meet next year ? I should also like to know when the opening ceremony will take place ?

Mr BRUCE:
NAT

– The Government has not yet decided who is to be asked to perform the ceremony of opening the provisional Parliament House at Canberra. As to the date of the completion of the building, I refer the honorable member to statements which have already been made, and to reports which have been submitted by the Canberra Commission.

page 2553

QUESTION

CRUISER CONSTRUCTION

Correspondence with Successful Tenderer.

Mr MAHONY:
DALLEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

-Will the Minister for Defence lay on the table of the Library copies of all communications which passed before tenders were called for the construction of the two 10,000-ton cruisers between his department and John Brown and Company, of Glasgow, who were the successful tenderers?

Sir NEVILLE HOWSE:
Minister for Defence · CALARE, NEW SOUTH WALES · NAT

– I shall look into the matter, but as many of the communications were of a confidential nature, I think it is very doubtful that they can be made available in the way the. honorable member suggests.

page 2553

PUBLIC SERVICE BOARD

Mr MAKIN:
HINDMARSH, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

– Will the Prime Minister lay on the table a return setting forth the allocation of duties to each member of the Commonwealth Public Service Board as provided for in section 16 of the Public Service Act.

Mr BRUCE:
NAT

– I shall see what can be done.

page 2553

QUESTION

COTTON TWEEDS

Mr COOK:
INDI, VICTORIA

– I. wish to ask a question of the Minister for Trade and Customs in regard to the accuracy of the following statement made in a circular relating to the tariff : -

Taking cotton tweed - general tariff 2s. per square yard, and 45 per cent. ad valorem, which is extensively used in the manufacture of men’s trousers and boys’ knickers, under the former tariff, men’s trousers could be sold to the wearer at 6s. lid. per pair, under the revised tariff, not less than 13s.11d. per pair. A strong nap tweed,highly suitable and largely used for workingmen’s trousers, under the former tariff could be sold to the wearer at8s.11d.; under the revised tariff, not less than 15s.11d.

Mr SPEAKER:

– The honorable member is not in order in putting his question in that form.

Mr COOK:

– I ask the Minister whether the statement which has been made is accurate?

Mr PRATTEN:
Minister for Trade and Customs · MARTIN, NEW SOUTH WALES · NAT

– This is one of many exaggerated statements that have been made in regard to the incidence of the tariff since the amending schedule was tabled. I am pleased to be able to inform the honorable member that cotton tweed is already being made in large quantities in Australia.

page 2553

QUESTION

PUBLIC SERVICE HOLIDAYS

Commonwealth and State

Mr COLEMAN:
REID, NEW SOUTH WALES

asked the Prime Minister, upon notice -

  1. How many holidays were authorized by the Public Service Board during, the calendar, year 1924, in pursuance of section 76 (3) of the Public Service Act 1922-24?
  2. Is it intended by the Public Service Board to authorize four holidays in addition to the nine statutory holidays provided for in section 76 ( 1 ) of the Public Service Act during the present calendar year?
  3. Was a resolution carried by the last conference of Premiers to the effect that it would he desirable to introduce a uniform system, proclaiming thirteen holidays for each State and for the Commonwealth?
  4. Does the Public Service Board intend to authorize a public holiday on 24th September, 1925, for Commonwealth public servants located in Melbourne?
  5. Will he recommend to the Public Service Board that four authorized public holidays should he granted to all public servants in the Com mon wealth ?
  6. Is it intended that any corresponding privilege should be granted to public servants employed outside the metropolitan area of

Sydney, in lieu of the holiday granted to the latter class of officer on the occasion of the visit of the American Fleet?

Mr BRUCE:
NAT

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow : -

  1. The regulations in regard to holidays consequent upon the amending Public Service Act 1924 operated from 15th November, 1924, hence the only holiday authorized during 1924 was the day following Boxing Day in all States, and Proclamation Day in South Australia.
  2. No; the authorization of holidays is discretionary, and the grant is dependent upon the justification ‘therefor’ and public convenience.
  3. The resolution recommended the observance of ten uniform holidays in the Commonwealth and States, with two further discretionary holidays for local observance.
  4. The Board has authorized a half-holiday to be observed in the metropolitan area of Melbourne on the date mentioned.
  5. The matter is one entirely for the discretion of the Public Service Board.
  6. No; the grant of discretionary public holidays is dependent upon local circumstances, which are accorded full consideration. The statutory holidays (nine in number) are uniformly observed throughout the Commonwealth.

page 2554

QUESTION

SEAMEN’S WAGES RATES

British and Australian: Rations

Mr FORDE:
CAPRICORNIA, QUEENSLAND

asked the Prime Minister, upon notice -

  1. What monthly rates of wages were paid to able seamen on -

    1. Australian ships;
    2. British ships, in the years 1914, 1915, 1916, 1917, 1918, 1919., 1920, 1921, 1922, 1923, 1924, 1925?
  2. What is the ration scale for able seamen -

    1. on British ships in Australian waters;
    2. on Australian ships;
    3. in Peutridgc prison?
Mr BRUCE:

– The information desired by the honorable member is being obtained, and he will be more fully advised at an early date.

page 2554

QUESTION

AUSTRALIAN LOAN FLOATED IN AMERICA

Underwriters’ Offer

Mr BLAKELEY:
DARLING, NEW SOUTH WALES

asked the Treasurer, upon notice -

Is it a fact that, in connexion with the recent loan of £15,000,000 raised in America, a financial group offered to underwrite the loan on 10s. per cent. better terms than those accepted by the Commonwealth Government. If so, why was the higher rate accepted?

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · COWPER, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

– It is not in the public interest to give details of loan negotiations. Of the various terms and conditions offered, those which were most advantageous to the Commonwealth were accepted.

page 2554

QUESTION

MENTAL HOSPITALS FOR EX-SOLDIERS

Mr BRENNAN:
BATMAN, VICTORIA

asked the Minister for Defence, upon notice -

  1. How many, if any, mental hospitals are now in use for ex-soldier cases exclusively?
  2. Have such hospitals, it any, been found necessary and practicable in operation?
Sir NEVILLE HOWSE:
NAT

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow: -

  1. Three hospitals are used exclusively for ex-soldier mental patients in Australia. These are administered by the State authorities for the Repatriation Commission. Arrangements have been made for the establishment of two other hospitals on similar lines, one of which will absorb an existing institution. Negotiations are in train for the establishment of another such hospital.
  2. Such separate provision is not regarded as at all necessary, but is practicable where the number of patients warrants it and where, as at present, the specialist and trained staffs of the authorities controlling the State mental hospitals are available.

page 2554

QUESTION

WACKETT WIDGEON FLYING BOAT

Mr R GREEN:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

asked the Minister for Defence, upon notice -

When is it expected that the Wackett “ Widgeon flying boat.” will be officially tested?

Sir NEVILLE HOWSE:
NAT

– No definite date can be stated, but it is anticipated that this flying boat will be ready for its official tests in the near future.

page 2554

QUESTION

DEPORTATION BOARD

Refusal to Produce Books and Documents

Mr E RILEY:
SOUTH SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

asked the Prime Minister, upon notice -

In view of the proceedings of the Deportation Board in Sydney, and the refusal of the Overseas Steamship Owners Association to produce the books and documents of that association before the board, will he (a) issue in structions to the chairman of the board to discontinue the inquiry, and (b) take the necessary steps to repeal the deportation clauses of the Immigration Act?

Mr BRUCE:
NAT

– The reply to the honorable member is in the negative.

page 2555

QUESTION

AEROPLANE MAIL SERVICES

Broken Hill and Mildura : Sydney and Brisbane : Larkin Aircraft Supply Co. Ltd

Mr R GREEN:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

asked the Minister for Defence, upon notice -

  1. Is there an aeroplane service between Broken Hill and Mildura?
  2. If so. what company provides the service ?
  3. Is the service subsidized by the Government? If so, to what extent?
  4. Hid Captain G. C. Matthews first suggest this route to the Government? If not, who did?
  5. Were tenders called for this service? If not. why ?
Sir NEVILLE HOWSE:
NAT

– I regret that the information is not yet available.

Mr R GREEN:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · CP

asked the Minister for Defence, upon notice - 1.Is the Larkin Aircraft Supply Co. Ltd. subsidized by the Government?

  1. If so, what services are rendered by the company in return for the subsidy, and what is the amount of the subsidy?
  2. Was this company given a contract to supply an aeroplane service between Sydney and Brisbane?
  3. If so, why is this service not in operation ?
Sir NEVILLE HOWSE:

– I regret that the information is not yet available.

page 2555

PAPER

The following paper was presented : -

Northern Territory. - Report by the Secretary, Home and Territories Department, on suggested re-organization of the Public Service of the Northern Territory.

page 2555

TARIFF BOARD REPORTS

Mr PRATTEN:
Minister for Trade and Customs · Martin · NAT

.- I lay upon the table of the House the following reports of the Tariff Board: - 57, Glass bottles up to 1 ounce; 58, glazed ceramic tiles; 59, petroleum pitch or asphalt; 60, special machinery for primary and secondary industries; 61, flexible shafting for sheepshearing machines; 62, steel wire winding ropes; 63, shovels; 64, iron and steel tubes or pipes; 65, timber; 66, cork boards; 67, vessels (ships, &c); 68, X-ray apparatus.

I move -

That the report on timber be printed.

Mr MAHONY:
Dalley

– I ask the Minister whether he will permit some of the other reports to be printed. The proposed reduction in the duty on shovels will very seriously affect a large and growing industry in this country, and, in consequence, hundreds of men will be thrown out of employment. Such a happening would seriously affect a large industry in the Minister’s own constituency, and because of this I am sure that he will give the matter further consideration.

Mr Makin:

– We should also have printed the report on special machinery for primary and secondary industries.

Mr MAHONY:

– That is so. Surely honorable members who claim to represent the primary producers should be prepared to support my request that the report on shovels be printed.

Mr Prowse:

– There are fifteen men and three factories engaged in making shovels in Australia.

Mr MAHONY:

– The honorable member is talking utter nonsense.

Mr SPEAKER (Rt Hon W A Watt:
BALACLAVA, VICTORIA

– The honorable member must not be lured into a discussion on the tariff.

Mr MAHONY:

– I do not propose to be so. I wish to be able to read the report of the Tariff Board upon the shovelmaking industry. We know that the industry is established here, and that a reduction in duty will ruin it. I wish to know upon what grounds the Tariff Board based its recommendation respecting shovels. As the Minister is apparently not prepared to consider my request, I move -

That, after the word “timber,” the words “and shovels” be inserted.

Mr PRATTEN:
Minister for Trade and Customs · Martin · NAT

.- The attitude that I have adopted towards the printing of the reports of the Tariff Board has depended upon their relative importance. When important reports, copies of which may be asked for by a number of interests concerned have been tabled, I have moved without discrimination that they be printed. I have purposely omitted to move for the printing of minor reports, because the expense of printing them would not be justified. One copy of every report is placed upon the table of this House, and another upon the table in another place. Only three or four firms are interested in the shovelmaking industry. If it is the general wish of honorable members that any particular report should be printed, I am quite willing to move to that effect. I gave that intimation to the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Charlton) when I placed the first batch of Tariff Board reports on the table. It is hardly worth while printing a report such as this, when two copies are available to honorable members and to the press. However, I am entirely in the hands of the House in this matter.

Mr FENTON:
Maribyrnong

– I support the amendment of the honorable member for Dalley (Mr. Mahony). I am confident that if we are to have a proper and full discussion upon the tariff proposals, there will be such a demand for the Tariff Board’s reports on certain items that one type-written copy will not be sufficient. I am speaking with the experience of past tariffs. I knowwith what avidity honorable members peruse these reports to find out why certain items have been included in the tariff schedule and others excluded. If these reports are not printed, much confusion will be caused when there is an insistent demand for this information, and the Minister will consequently have to hurry the Government Printer in order to obtain information for honorable members. Of course, in the case of requests for further consideration by the Tariff Board on certain items, later reports may be submitted to the House. If this is likely, it would be preferable to print the full report later rather than a partial report now. The Minister will find that, if we are to have a full debate on the tariff items, there will be a demand made for further information.

Mr BRUCE:
Prime Minister and Minister for External Affairs · Flinders · NAT

– The Government is, of course, only too willing to meet the wishes of honorable members respecting the printing of the reports of the Tariff Board, but these are very numerous, and it is not desirable that considerable expense should be incurred in printing all of them. It is proposed to print those reports for which there is a pressing demand. Of course, it is difficult for honorable members who are interested in the tariff to know whether the list of reports read out by the Minister embraces every one that they regard as valuable. Might I suggest, therefore, that after the reports have been tabled honorable members should peruse them to ascertain which should be printed. They could then make representations to the Minister, who, I am sure, would be only too pleased to meet their wishes as far as possible by moving for the printing of those it was desired to print. The Printing Committee will also consider these reports, and. if it selects any that it thinks should be printed, will order the printing of them.

Mr Mahony:

– Can I obtain a copy of the report on shovels ?

Mr BRUCE:

– Certainly. If what I suggest meets the convenience of honorable members, a great deal of unnecessary expenditure will be obviated.

Mr MAHONY:

– In view of the Prime Minister’s promise, I ask the permission of the House to withdraw the amendment.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

page 2556

NORTHERN TERRITORY

Mr MARR:
Honorary Minister · PARKES, NEW SOUTH WALES · NAT

– On the 16th September, the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Charlton) asked whether I would make available the report of Mr. McLaren, Secretary of the Home and Territories Department, on the Public Service of the Northern Territory. I now lay on the table of the House a copy of his report.

page 2556

QUESTION

INFANTILE PARALYSIS

Sir NEVILLE HOWSE:
NAT

– On the 16th September, the honorable member for Gippsland (Mr. Paterson) asked certain questions relative to the preparation of poliomyelitis serum. For his information, and that of the House, I should like to point out that this is not a serum derived from the inferior animals, and, therefore, a large quantity of it cannot readily be prepared in a laboratory. It has to be obtained from the blood of convalescents from the disease, who are mostly children. Before this blood can be taken, the consent, not only of the patients, but also of the parents, must be obtained, and a number of children are not suitable for bleeding. The number of donors up to the present time has been 50, and their blood is being dealt with by a committee of medical men in Melbourne. The Federal Government has no control of the matter, except in regard to the work of separating the serum. The Department is prepared to assist in every possible way when the number of donors becomes greater. The number of cases of the disease occurring in Australia in 1924 was 238, and in 1925, to date, 210. This disease has been extremely prevalent in New Zealand, but this year there has not been an epidemic of it in Australia.

page 2567

DRIED FRUITS ADVANCES BILL

Motion (by Mr. Bruce) agreed to -

That he have leave to bring in a bill for an Act to Amend the Dried Fruits Advances Act 1924.

page 2567

ADVANCES TO SETTLERS BILL

Motion (by Mr. Bruce) agreed to -

That he have leave to bring in a bill for an Act to provide for the Supply of Wire Netting to Settlers.

page 2567

ENTERTAINMENTS TAX BILL

In Committee of Ways and Means:

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That in lieu of the rates of tax imposed by the Entertainments Tax Act 1916-1922 upon payments for admission to entertainments, there be imposed upon such payments as from a date to be fixed by Proclamation a tax at the following rates, namely: -

This bill will give effect to the intention of the Government, announced in my budget speech, to widen the field of exemption from the entertainments tax. It is the policy of the Government to distribute, as widely as possible, reductions in direct taxation. At present the entertainment tax applies to all payments of1s. arid upwards for admission to taxable entertainments, the rate being1d. on rhe first1s. and½d. for each additional 6d. No tax is collected upon any payment of less than1s. The bill will merely substitute, in the verbiage of the schedule of the act, “ two shillings and sixpence “ for “ one shilling,” and “ twopence and one halfpenny” for “one penny,”’ and will provide for the collection of½d. for each 6d. or part of 6d. in excess of the 2s. 6d. Thus, the present rate of progression will be maintained, but the general exemption will be raised from1s. to 2s. 6d. The Government believes that this increase in the general exemption will not only give relief to the poorer sections of the community, but will also obviate the irritation now caused by the fact that in connexion with entertainments for social purposes, for admission to which a charge of1s. or or1s; 6d. is made, returns must be furnished to the department and taxa tion paid thereon. Of course, the tax was never intended to apply to such entertainments.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended; resolution adopted.

Ordered -

That Dr.Earle Page and Sir Littleton Groom do prepare and bring in a bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

Bill presented by Dr. Earle Page:, and read a first time.

Second Reading

Motion (by Dt. Earle Page) proposed -

That this bill be now read a second time.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

.- I approve of the measure because it will grant relief to people who with their families patronize the cheaper forms of entertainment. This tax was imposed for war purposes, and as this Parliament has in the last few years made remissions, in both income and land taxation, it is only fair that the poorer people also should be. granted relief.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a. second time, and paused through its remaining stages without amendment or debate..

page 2558

INVALID AND OLD-AGE PENSIONS BILL

In committee (Consideration resumed from 17th September, vide page 2552) :

Clauses 1 to 3 agreed’ to.

Clause 4 -

Section 31 of the principal act is amended by omitting from sub-section (2) thereof the word “three” and inserting in its stead the word “ four “.

Section proposed to he amended -

If it appears to the magistrate that the claimant although otherwise qualified for, is unfit to be entrusted with, a pension, a pension at the rate of three shillings per week maybe granted to the claimant, and payment of thepension may be suspended until the claimant has become an inmate of a benevolent asylum.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

– I wish to move to amend the section in the direction of omitting the word “four” with a view to the substitution of the words “nine shillings and sixpence.” To-day the Commonwealth pays to institutions 10s. 6d. per week in respect of each pensioner inmate, and the pensioner receives 3s. per week, which the bill proposes to increase to 4s. My amendment will mean that each pensioner will receive 9s. 6d. per week, the Commonwealth thus paying the full amount of £1 in respect of each person qualified to receive the pension. The present practice is not based upon equity. The Commonwealth should pay the full pension in respect of each pensioner, irrespective of whether he lives in his own home or in an institution. If a person is entitled to a pension of 20s. per week, why should he, because of an infirmity which compels him to go to a hospital, receive less than is paid to other pensioners? When aged persons enter hospitals they frequently require additional money to purchase delicacies that are needed. As honorable members are aware, the hospitals do not supply patients with everything required in the way of comforts and stimulants. In the circumstances, I think it would be fair if the committee decided that, instead of the pensioner inmates of hospitals receiving only 4s. per week, they should be paid at least the difference between what is given the institution itself and the full amount of the pension. I do not deny that the present practice has been fol lowed by several administrations, but as we know that there are anomalies, and that some pensioners are not being dealt with equitably, we should rectify matters by making a necessary amendment of the law. I do not think a very large sum would be involved. I believe the Treasurer stated that it would be approximately £40,000 per annum.

Dr Earle Page:

– That was the amount when the rate was 2s. per week.

Mr CHARLTON:

– Then, of course, it would cost much more now to do what I propose. Pensioners will now be entitled to 20s. per week; but they should not be compelled to submit to any reduction while they are inmates of public institutions. There are at least four or five hospitals in my district maintained by the contributions of the workers and subsidies from the Government. It is not the wealthy people in my district who subscribe to the funds of these institutions, but the working men, by their weekly levies. The pensioners in these institutions, when they were working, paid their contributions towards the upkeep of them, and now, as inmates, they should not be compelled to accepta reduced pension. Irrespective of the amount involved, we should do what is just.

The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN (Mr Bayley:
OXLEY, QUEENSLAND

– Before accepting the amendment submitted by the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Charlton), I should like an assurance from the Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page) that if the amendment is agreed to the amount to be appropriated will not be increased.

Dr Earle Page:

– I am afraid that I am unable to give such an assurance. The payment of the additional amount to the inmates of public institutions must increase the appropriation. But I should also like to point out-

The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN.Unless I can receive such an assurance from the Treasurer, I have no option but to rule the amendment out of order.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

.- I understand that you have ruled the amendment out of order on the grounds that it will increase the amount to be appropriated under the bill, but it is not certain that it will. This bill provides that pensioners shall receive 20s. per week. lt has been the practice of Governments to reduce the amountpaid to pensioners who are inmates of institutions. But we are not in a position to know what number of pensioners are likely to receive treatment in the public institutions; and, therefore, it is impossible to say if the amount of appropriation would be increased if the amendment were agreed to. Some invalid pensioners -may decide to be treated in their own homes, and it is, therefore, very difficult for you, sir, to rule that my amendment would mean an increase in the amount to be appropriated.

Mr Prowse:

– What is the honorable member’s opinion?

Mr CHARLTON:

– I have already expressed my opinion. I have said that, on the ground of equity, a higher rate should be paid to the inmates of public hospitals.

Mr Prowse:

– Does the honorable member think that the amount to be appropriated would be increased?

Mr CHARLTON:

– I shall be very sorry if we are to be prevented from acting fairly in the interests of these people on what may be regarded as a technical point. If the Temporary Chairman rules that my amendment, if adopted, would be the means of increasing the appropriation, the Treasurer should arrange for a further message to cover it, or introduce another bill. It is hardly fair of the honorable member for Forrest (Mr. Prowse) to endeavour to take advantage of the point raised by the Temporary Chairman to prevent justice being done.

Mr Prowse:

– I only asked the Leader of the Opposition if he thought that the increased rate which he suggests would involve an increase in the amount to be appropriated.

Mr CHARLTON:

– I am glad to have the honorable member’s interjection. I believe 1 am voicing the opinion of a majority of honorable members when I say that the bill should be withdrawn and another message brought down. If that were done, honorable members on this side of the chamber would endeavour to facilitate the passage of the new bill, and would not have another second-reading debate on it. It cannot be said that we are endeavouring to obstruct business.

The Entertainments Tax Amendment Bill introduced by the Treasurer this morning passed through all its stages in a very short time. The object of this bill is to increase the rate of pension from 17s. 6d. to 20s. per week, and it is for the committee to decide how pensioner inmates of public institutions should be treated. Evidence could easily be adduced to show that the Commonwealth’s liability might not be increased by what I proposed. To prove that increased expenditure would be caused by it, the Government would have to show the number of pensioners who would go to public institutions.

The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN:

– I have no desire to curtail discussion on the amendment submitted by the Leader of the Opposition, but it appears to the Chair that if such an amendment were accepted it would have the effect of increasing the appropriation. Unless the Chair receives a definite assurance from the Treasurer that the amount to be appropriated will not be increased if the amendment is adopted, I have no option but to i-eject the amendment.

Mr COLEMAN:
Reid

.- I regret that the Treasurer has refused to further liberalize the provisions in this clause. The sub-section proposed to be amended gives the magistrate power to commit any applicant for a pension to a benevolent asylum or similar institution. If we are to deprive a pensioner of his liberty by saying that he is not fitted to be entrusted with his pension, and must go to an asylum for the aged, which, in a sense, is a form of punishment, he should receive the increase proposed in the amendment of the Leader of the Opposition. The Government has no right to withhold a portion of the pension from such a .person. The State institutions receive 10s. 6d. per week for Commonwealth pensioners, and under the proposal of the Treasurer the pensioner inmates themselves are to receive 4s. per week, the Government wrongfully retaining 5s. 6d. per week. If the Treasurer will not accept the proposal of the Leader of the Opposition that the difference between the . amount paid to the institution and the full pension be paid to these pensioners, he should pay to the institution responsible for the maintenance of the pensioner the difference between 4s. and the full pension. The Government is not, in any circumstances, justified in keeping back 5s. 6d. of the pension. I think that is the view generally accepted by honorable members. If the Treasurer would allow the committee to freely discuss this matter, I think it would be easily disposed of. I do not wish to repeat the statements I made last night, but seeing that the Government exercises power under this sub-section to compel pensioners to enter State controlled institutions, it should pay these institutions the difference between the amount paid to the pensioner inmate and the balance of the full pension, or give that difference to the pensioner.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– I trust that the Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page) will accept the amendment moved by the Leader of the Opposition. Its ac- ceptance may not mean an increase in appropriation. It may be argued that if this scheme which has been in operation for some time is extended a decreased amount may have to be paid in the form of old-age and invalid pensions. The saving effected at present is contrary to the spirit of the act. The people have decided in favour of the payment of oldage and invalid pensions, and if the Government is prepared to pay pensioners 20s. per week, they should receive the full sum, or where they are inmates of institutes, its equivalent. Under the past arrangement certain pensioners have not been receiving the full amount to which they are entitled ; they are receiving only a portion of it, and the Treasurer is retaining a portion, which iscontrary to the spirit of the act. Pensioners are entitled to the amount voted by Parliament, and the people wish them to receive it. . The sum of 4s. per week is insufficient to keep them in comfort while they are in public institutions. The hospitals get 10s. a week, while 4s. a week is to be paid to the pensioners. That means that 5s. 6d. a week is to be retained in the Treasury. There is no warrant for that. These people, who are doubly unfortunate, should not be penalized in this manner.

Mr Coleman:

– In many instances, they are committed to the institutions by magistrates.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– That is so; but that is no reason why they should be penalized. Many of them were pioneers in this country, and did much to bring it to its present stage of development. The present condition of many of them is due to the effects of droughts, floods, or fires. The Australian people, as a whole, are prepared to maintain them for the remainder of their days, and do not regard the pension as a charitable dole, as was suggested last night bythe honorable member for Swan (Mr. Gregory), who stated that he hoped that the Government would introduce a scheme of national insurance, so that the persons who received a pension could regard it as a return of money which they themselves had contributed. These unfortunate people in our midst have made their contribution by assisting in the development of this new country, and making it possible for us to enjoy the comfort which to-day surrounds us. Rather than let these people suffer, we should regard them as our special care. It would probably be better to pay them the whole of the pension and allow them to make their own arrangements with the hospitals. If they are fortunate enough to receive treatment for 10s. 6d. a week, we should be glad that they will be able to retain the remaining 9s. 6d. a week for themselves.

Mr Maxwell:

– The amendment, if carried, would increase the cost without increasing the appropriation.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– If payment of pensions is made on the scale desired by the people of Australia, the appropriation would necessarily have to be increased. I do not know the amount of the present appropriation, but I do knowthat when this legislation was passed it was intended that a sufficient sum should be appropriated to pay an adequate pension to every person qualified to receive it. Any scheme which decreases theamount of the appropriation is against the spirit of the act, and is therefore not acceptable to the people of Australia. Generally speaking, the Australian public will not countenance any scheme to deprive pensioners of part of their pension. That it has been done in the past does not necessarily mean that the action taken has been right. The people generally are of the opinion that pensioners, whether inmates of in- stitutions or not, should be paid a certain sum weekly. I hope that the Treasurer will accept the amendment of the Leader of the Opposition, and allow pensioners who are inmates of institutions, some voluntarily and some by order of the court, to retain 9s. 6d. a week for themselves. As a matter of equity, it should be done.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I desire to supplement my remarks of last night. The right honorable member for North Sydney (Mr. Hughes) placed the position plainly before honorable members last night when he said that the present condition has obtained ever since the Federal Parliament introduced a scheme for the payment of old-age pensions. The question to be decided is, not whether the old-age pensioners shall obtain more, but whether the Commonwealth or the State shall be responsible for the care of pensioner inmates of hospitals and other institutions. Because of representations which were made to me, I went into this matter very carefully. The payment of old-age pensions was intended to supplement the action taken by the States in caring for aged and infirm people in the community. Pensions were’ given primarily to enable old folk to live in their own homes. When they found it necessary to enter public institutions for medical treatment, they came under the care of the States. If we study the wording of the principal act. we shall see that it would be wrong to accept the amendment. Section 31 of the principal act, as subsequently amended, reads -

If it appears to the magistrate that the claimant although otherwise qualified for, is unfit to be entrusted with, a pension, a pension at the rate of 3s. per week may be granted to the claimant, and payment of the pension may be suspended until the claimant has become an inmate of a benevolent asylum.

That section deals with those cases in which, in the judgment of the magistrate, the old-age pensioner is unfit to be entrusted with the pension. I am glad that honorable members on both sides have spoken favorably of the sympathetic manner in which the act is administered. The officers of the department think that the present arrangement is a satisfactory one from the point of view of the pensioner. They inform me that only 1 per cent. of the old-age pensioners who are inmates of hospitals come under this heading, and they point out that, instead of its being a kindness to grant them the comparatively large sum of 9s. 6d. a week, it would be detrimental to their best interests to pay them that sum. After careful consideration of the whole position, the Government decided, two years ago, to make a payment of 3s. a week to those pensioners who are inmates of hospitals. Although I have received hundreds of letters from old-age pensioners throughout Australia, I have not received one containing a request that the amount paid to pensioners who are inmates of hospitals should be increased to a sum approaching that mentioned in the amendment. On the contrary, I have received numbers of letters thanking the Government for the action taken two years ago, and expressing the satisfaction of the writers with the present proposal.

Mr Charlton:

– I have received many such, requests.

Dr EARLE PAGE:

– I am satisfied that it would not be a kindness to grant this class of old-age pensioner more than 4s. a week. I am quite prepared to discuss with the authorities controlling those institutions which are financed or subsidized by the States the question of increasing the payment to them on behalf of pensioner inmates. Whatever honorable members may think regarding subsequent amendments, I hope that they will not press this one, as it applies to those pensioners whom the magistrates regard as being unfit to be entrusted with a pension. There is also the fact that the amendment is out of order, because it would mean an increase of the appropriation.

Mr WATKINS:
NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP; FLP from 1931

– I have listened attentively to the explanation of the Treasurer, and, while I admit that the officers of the department are generally sympathetic in their administration of the act, I want honorable members to understand that the reduction of the pension applies in the case of every pensioner who goes into a hospital for treatment, even temporarily.

Dr Earle Page:

– The honorable member is referring to another clause.

Mr WATKINS:
NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES

– I now see that that is so. The rate of pension was first fixed at 10s. a week. That amount has been increased from time to time, until to-day it is 17s. 6d. a week. Notwithstanding the amount paid, I have always held that it was wrong that, when a pensioner became so infirm as to require treatment in an institution, he should suffer by having his pension reduced, the Commonwealth benefiting because of his misfortune. Some of these old-age pensioners have been miners and bushmen, who. although not confined to their beds, are inmates of institutions. The amount granted to them is scarcely sufficient to supply them with tobacco. Either the pensioner or the institution should receive the difference.

Mr Prowse:

– Get rid of the money under any circumstances !

Mr WATKINS:

– I am sorry to hear that remark from the honorable member for Forrest. The Government spends money freely in other directions, but when it is a question of studying the needs of the old-aged, we who advocate it are told that we favour getting rid of money under any circumstances. We consider that this will add to the comfort of the old people. The expenditure on this proposal will, of necessity, vary, and unless the Treasurer can state definitely that the acceptance of the amendment will have the effect of increasing the appropriation it should be agreed to.

Dr Earle Page:

– I have already said that it will.

Mr WATKINS:

– The honorable gentleman has not explained how that will be brought about.

Dr Earle Page:

– That does not need explanation. If the rate is increased the total sum involved must also be increased.

Mr WATKINS:

– The Commonwealth Government should not withhold any portion of the pension.

The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN:

– As the Chair has had an assurance from the Treasurer that under the amendment the appropriation would be increased, it cannot be accepted.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

.- With all due deference to the statement of the Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page) and your consequent ruling, Mr. Bayley, T. submit that the committee has not been given any estimate of the amount that is to be appropriated under the bill. The

Treasurer in his budget speech estimated - that approximately £700,000 would need to be appropriated.

Dr Earle Page:

– Eight hundred thousand pounds.

Mr CHARLTON:

– The honorable gentleman does not deny that the payment of the additional amount at an earlier date than was at first anticipated will increase the appropriation. There is no provision in the bill to cover the expenditure. Although I dp not intend to appeal against your ruling, sir, I doubt very much whether the Treasurer’s assurance is well founded. Did the honorable gentleman say that he will get in touch with those who are inmates of institutions, to ascertain their wishes?

Dr Earle Page:

– I said that I am prepared to discuss with those who control the institutions the question of the amount that ought to be paid for the maintenance of pensioners.

Mr CHARLTON:

– Many of those authorities will ask that they, and not the pensioner, be given an additional amount.

Mr PROWSE:
Forrest

.- I support the clause as it stands. The Government proposes to increase the rate to old-age pensioners by 25 per cent. Those who are unfortunate enough to be in. institutions will really receive an increase of 33per cent. Under this clause it is the duty of a magistrate to determine whether a pensioner is a fit subject to receive a pension or whether he should enter an institution. It must be manifest to honorable members that the comforts provided by an institution which is maintained largely by State and Commonwealth funds are greater than a pensioner could provide for himself out of £1 a week. This 4s. is really pocket money to enable pensioner inmates of hospitals to purchase tobacco and other comforts that are not provided by the institution. I interjected whilst the honorable member for Newcastle (Mr. Watkins) was speaking, that there seemed to be a desire to have the expenditure incurred in any circumstances. The Commonwealth pension is on a fairly liberal scale compared with what other countries are paying. We are a mere handful of people, but we are able to provide reasonable comforts for our aged people. Every one has it in his heart to do as much as possible. The institutions have-not complained unduly of the adequacy of thepayment that is made to them. Many old people are unfortunately addicted to drink, and it would be a mistake to give them greater opportunities to satisfy their craving.

Mr SCULLIN:
Yarra

.- I agree to a certain extent with the statement of the Treasurer that some old people are better off in an institution. I point out, however, that every inmate is not, as has been suggested, incarcerated by order of a magistrate. That suggestion should be scotched at once.

Dr Earle Page:

– Ninety-nine per cent. are voluntary inmates of those institutions. This clause, however, relates only to those who are ordered by a magistrate to be sent to an institution.

Mr SCULLIN:

– That is quite true. “We are endeavouring to impress upon the Minister the desirability of considering the claims of every pensioner who is an inmate of an institution, whether he is there voluntarily or compulsorily.

The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN:

– I point out to the honorable member for Yarra that this clause deals only with those persons who are sent to an institution on the order of a magistrate.

Mr SCULLIN:

– The honorable member for Forrest (Mr. Prowse) suggested that all such inmates have been sent there by order of a magistrate.I admit that those to whom it is necessary to apply compulsion are better off in a home, where they are under control. The question that we now have to consider, however, is whether the amount that it is proposed to provide for them is sufficient. The Pensions Department is administered very sympathetically, and I cannot do other than praise every officer in it.

Mr Coleman:

– They set an example to every one.

Mr SCULLIN:

– The pension is given as a right, not as a charity. If pensioners were in receipt of an annuity from some estate, the manner in which they spent it would not be inquired into. We propose to interfere with an equally strong right when we say that they shall not receive a pension unless they enter an institution. I am not quarrelling with that interference, although I regret that it is necessary to exercise it. What I do say is that, having interfered, we should, either directly or indirectly, pro vide the pensioners with as many comforts as they would receive if they spent the pension in their own homes. I do not think the Government has gone far enough. There may be every justification for declining to give the whole amount to either the individual or the institution. It might be possible to show that the cost of maintaining a pensioner in an institution is not as great as it would be in his own home, and that the authorities should receive only the actual cost of maintenance.

Mr Coleman:

– That cost exceeds 10s.

Mr SCULLIN:

– I believe that it does. It is a matter for adjustment.

Mr Lister:

– The cost varies according to the institution.

Mr SCULLIN:
YARRA, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– I do not suggest that the Commonwealth should pay more than the cost of maintenance, or give the pensioner the. difference if that cost is greater than it would cost him to live in his own home. I do, however, suggest that 4s. is a very small sum for a pensioner to receive.

Mr Maxwell:

– Does the honorable member think that a pensioner outside an institution who receives £1 a week can, after purchasing necessaries, still have 4s. in hand?

Mr SCULLIN:

– In some cases, yes.

Mr Gabb:

– He could if he purchased the same class of food that is provided in these homes.

Mr SCULLIN:

– Many pensioners are maintained in the homes of relatives for the mere cost of maintenance, on better fare than they would get in an institution.

Mr Maxwell:

– The difficulty is attendance and care.

Mr SCULLIN:

– That is given gratuitously in their own homes, . or in the homes of relatives. We should not place the inmates of these institutions on the level of those outside who are worse off; rather should we endeavour to strike a mean. I do not think that we should introduce percentages into this matter, and refer to a “ 331/3 per cent, increase” when it represents only an additional1s. a week. I hope the Treasurer will reconsider his decision concerning the allowance to be made to pensioners in institutions.

Mr FOSTER:
Wakefield

.- The honorable member for Yarra (Mr. Scullin) has stated that the allowance made to, institutions in which invalid and old-age pensioners are accommodated represents the full cost of the services rendered’. That is hardly true of the Home for Incurables, and “Minda,” two institutions in Adelaide. The Home for Incurables is one of the finest institutions of its kind in Australia. It’ has been established for very many years and is admirably controlled by a committee of devoted men and women. There are about 150 patients, all of whom are very well cared for. The allowance for each patient is 10s. 6d., but I believe the cost per patient to the institution is quite £1.

Mr Scullin:

– That is very high.

Mr FOSTER:

– But it is an excellent home. The inmates are supplied with all sorts of luxuries not provided in other institutions. I know of no place where patients receive better treatment. “ Minda,” a home for weak-minded children was, I believe, established at the instance of Sir Josiah Symon. It is doing a wonderful work. Both institutions feel that they should receive the full amount of the pensions paid by the Commonwealth under the Invalid and Old-age Pensions Act.

Mr Yates:

– Are they allowed anything?

Mr.FOSTER. - Yes, but the amount ought to be larger. When the Treasurer was in Adelaide not long ago I introduced a deputation to him on the subject, and he stated that the provision asked for could probably better be made by the legislation which’ might be recommended by the Health Committee than under the pensions scheme.

Dr Earle Page:

– I also said last night that I am prepared to discuss the subject with the people interested.

Mr FOSTER:

– Nevertheless, I thought it my duty to bring this matter before the committee, and I hope that, before long, arrangements will be made to give both institutions further assistance.

Dr Earle Page:

– They get 10s. 6d. a week for each patient.

Mr.FOSTER. - The inmates of the Home for Incurables do not ask for an increase of pension, because they get every comfort that can possibly be obtained in a home.

Mr Scullin:

– Then the honorable member thinks’ that what the inmates do not get ought to be given to the institution.

Mr FOSTER:

– The institution should get every penny of it.

Mr. E. RILEY (South Sydney), [12.37). - I direct the attention of the Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page) to the powers given under section 31 to magistrates. Frequently, when a blind person makes application for a pension, a magistrate exerts undue influence upon the applicant to cause him to enter a blind institution. Many prefer to remain in their own homes, but if they decline to go to an institution the pension may be withheld from them. If they attempt to supplement their income by selling articles in the streets they are denied pension rights, and, consequently, there is a good deal of discontent. They should have the right to supplement their income without being penalized. No one likes to see them vending articles in the streets of our cities, but magistratesshould be restrained from putting pressure on them to become inmates of blind institutions. As many blind men have family obligations it is essential that they should have the right to earn money without interference with their pension rights.

Mr A GREEN:
KALGOORLIE, WESTERN AUSTRALIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– Do not they get the pension irrespective of their earnings?’

Mr E RILEY:
SOUTH SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– No ; that is their grievance. I trust that the Treasurer will take some action to prevent magistratesfrom unnecessarily interfering with the liberty of blind persons who apply for a pension by urging them to enter institutions for the blind. Persons so afflicted, are entitled to every consideration. They should be allowed to earn as much as, they can.

Mr PATERSON:
Gippsland

– It has been suggested by some honorable members that because persons who are inmates of an institution will be paid 4s. a week pocket money and the institution will get 10s. 6d. for their maintenance, the pensioners will be defrauded of the difference between £1, the amount of the full pension, and the sum total of the two payments. It seems to me that the question is whether the Commonwealth is to accept complete responsibility for invalid pensioners, or whether the State in which they live is expected to accept its share of this obligation. In the case of many institutions it would not be too much to say that the pensioner receives at least 16s. worth of service in the terms of food, accommodation, and attention for the 10s. 6d. paid by the Commonwealth, and that the State Governments, by maintaining such institutions, are bearing the cost of the difference between the10s. 6d. paid by the Commonwealth and. the value of services rendered to the inmate. I think there is a good deal in the interjection made by the honorable member for Fawkner (Mr. Maxwell), that it is highly improbable that many of our invalid pensioners would have 4s. a week pocket-money if they had to maintain themselves in their own homes on the£l a week to be paid by the Commonwealth Government.

Mr COLEMAN:
Reid

.- I move -

That the word “four” be left out, with a view to insert in lieu thereof the word “ five.”

The effect of this amendment will be to increase the allowance to 5s. a week. I am aware, of course!, that it will be ruled out of order, but I submit it as a protest against the action of the Government. If alt institutions were conducted on lines similar to those of the South Australian institutions just referred to, possibly everything would be right. But, unfortunately, some of them are of a very rough character. The Lidcombe institution, in my electorate,is controlled by the State, and there the accommodation is not of the best, and the food, although good, is rough. I claim, therefore, that a larger allowance should be paid to the inmates to enable them to procure more personal comforts. At Newington, also, the position is far from satisfactory. Hundreds of poor old women, many of whom are in an advanced stage of senility, and others- who have been turned out of their own homes by their children, are accommodated there. A visit to that institution is very depressing. I have been there several times, and I do not like going… I only visit it in the course of my duty as a representative of those people. The inmates are clad in cheap print dresses very suggestive of prison garb. Certainly they should have a larger margin for the purchase of ordinary comforts.. It has been said by some honorable members opposite that in most cases persons are committed to the care of such institutions because of inebriety. That is not true. Very many are obliged to go to them because they have no homes of their own, and, as I have said, some are in an enfeebled state of health or in an advanced state of senility. They are sent to the homes by magistrates, not because of misconduct, but for their own protection. In the circumstances, the Treasurer should agree to increase the amount they receive to 5s., so that they may procure ordinary comforts for themselves.

The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN:

– The Chair has no option but to rule the amendment out of order.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– The Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page) has stated why it is not proposed to give more than 4s. a week to the unfortunate people who have to seek accommodation in institutions or asylums. I should like him to consider for a moment the purpose of the original act, and to observe the difference between the procedure thenlaid down and that now contemplated. Under the original act 3s. was set aside as the personal- property of every old-age pensioner in an. institution..

Dr Earle Page:

– That is not so. The provision with which the committee is now dealing was inserted in the act in 1916, and the amount then allowed to the pensioner was 2s. The increase to 3s. was made two years ago.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– That payment was looked upon as a meagre allowance, intended to provide the old-age pensioners with a few of the comforts of life. The payment to the pensioners was restricted so as to leave more for the institutions.

Dr Earle Page:

– The payment to the institutions has never been enough

Mr W M Hughes:

– What was the total amount of the pension when the grant to the old people was 2s. ?

Dr Earle Page:

– It was 12s. 6d. to the pensioners, and7s. 6d. to the institutions.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– If the Government paid 12s. 6d. to the pensioners, and only 7s. 6d. to the institutions, it saved money by the scheme.

Dr Earle Page:

– The Government is not saving anything. We have to consider what is the wisest way to give the money.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– It seems to me that the Government is trying to find a way to avoid expenditure.

Dr Earle Page:

– It is ridiculous for the honorable member to talk like that, when the’ Government is proposing to inincrease the pensions expenditure by £1,600,000 a year.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– The spirit of the proposal is that every old-age pensioner shall have £1 a week expended on him by the Government. The people in institutions are doubly unfortunate, but that is not a valid reason for saving money at their expense. If the Government pays 10s. 6d. to the institutions and 4s. to the old-age pensioners, there will be a clear saving of 5s. 6d. a week on the full pension. Under the act the pensioners are entitled to this increase.

Dr Earle Page:

– They are not entitled to it under the act. There are specific provisions relating to it.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

– If we can increase the payments to the old-age pensioners, we ought to do it.

Mr W M HUGHES:
North Sydney

.- I should like to ask the Treasurer whether the States have intimated to the Government that the amount now received by them is insufficient for the support of old-age pensioners in institutions.

Dr Earle Page:

– Some of the States have made representations; but not, as a rule, through the State institutions.

Mr W M HUGHES:

– Honorable members ought to be told which of the States did so, and what they say each old-age pensioner in their institutions costs in excess of the amount paid by the Commonwealth. I would urge that the old-age pensioners should get. the full benefit of the increase, and I should like the Treasurer to explain why the proposal to pay 5s. instead of 4s., is not acceptable. Honorable members opposite appear to me to have stated a prima facie case in support of the payment of 5s.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I regret that when I was dealing with this matter the right honorable member for North Sydney (Mr. Hughes) was not present. I then pointed out that the disparity to which attention has been drawn has existed since payments were first made in respect of pensioners in institutions. In the first place, 5s. was paid to the States, and nothing to the old-age pensioners. In 1916, the Government of which the right honorable member was the Leader de cided to make a payment of 2s. a week to pensioners who became inmates of State institutions; but payment was not made to those who had been in institutions before they became old-age pensioners. In 1923, when the present Government increased the rate of pension, it considered how much should be given to the pensioners as pocket money. The general opinion of the authorities concerned was that 3s. would be a proper amount, and accordingly the previous payment of 2s. was increased to 3s., and was extended to those who entered institutions before they became eligible for an old-age pension. It is now proposed to increase the amount to 4s., which, we’ are assured, will provide the extra comforts required by the old people. If we desired to spend the remaining 16s., we should consider whether we should give it to the States rather than to the pensioners. There were two courses the Government could take. It could give £1 a week to the pensioners, and allow them to make their own arrangements with the institutions, in which case the institutions might not allow them even 4s. a week; or it could give a certain amount to the pensioners and discuss with the States the amount to be paid to the institutions. I have had representations made to me on behalf of the Home for Incurables, in South Australia, and the honorable member forWakefield (Mr. Foster) introduced a deputation to me on the subject a fortnight ago. Members of the deputation pointed out to. me that towards a total expenditure by the institution of £12,000, the State contributed only £2,000. The institution receives from the Commonwealth Government 10s. 6d. a week for each old-age pensioner, but it costs 25s. a week to keep an inmate of the institution. I told the deputation that I was prepared to discuss the matter with the representatives of that institution when the national insurance proposals were brought forward. The honorable member for Wakefield said that the condition of the inmates of that institution was so good that they scarcely needed any pocket money. There has never been any suggestion by this Government that the payments to the institutions and the pensioners should agree. Mr. Speaker was Treasurer of the State of Victoria when old-age pensions were first paid by the Commonwealth, and it was then considered fair that the State should bear half the cost of the maintenance of pensioners in institutions. The payments made by the Commonwealth to. the States, and to institutions subsidized by the States for pension inmates, is essentially an act of grace. The Government is prepared to discuss the matter with the State Governments and the institutions concerned and to deal with it at its discretion.

Mr YATES:
Adelaide

– I hardly think that there ought to be so much debate about the payment of an extra 2s. 6d. a week to old-age pensioners increasing the appropriation. The honorable member for Yarra (Mr. Scullin) suggested that the 2s. 6d. a week should be paid to all persons who are entitled to it. If the total amount paid for inmates of institutions is less than £1 a week, the appropriation is, to that extent, reduced. If it is intended that the appropriation shall provide for increasing all pensions to £1 a week, I cannot see that it will be increased by making all the pensions £1 a week. I frequently visit the Home for Incurables at Fullarton. When I was there three weeks ago, I purchased two tickets that were being sold to provide comforts for the inmates. It is. therefore, not correct to assume that the inmates have all the comforts they require. The institution is an admirable one, and the patients are very comfortable in comparison with those in other institu-. tions, but they require many things in addition to those supplied to them. I am also closely in touch with the consumptive home atNorth Terrace, Adelaide. There is a different story to tell there. The place was at one time a mental hospital, and the conditions in it are far from what one would like to submit the members of one’s family to. Many of the relatives of inmates refrain from visiting the institution for fear of infection, and personally I do not blame them. The inmates, many of whom are in early middle life, have for a long time had a comforts fund, and are dependent on racing clubs and charitably minded people for such succour as they obtain outside their keep in the institution. With the proceeds of this fund they are able to buy fruit, biscuits, underclothing, paper, books, tobacco, dental requisites, and other things that they need. An extra 2s. 6d. a week would be invaluable to them. I believe that similar conditions apply in the Old Folks’ Home in the electorate of the honorable member for Angas (Mr. Gabb). In that institution, there are many old pioneers of this country, who have been reduced to their present circumstances, not by their own fault, but by ill-luck. We ought not to be debating this question from the standpoint of cost. The speeches on this bill have been in striking contrast with those that we hear from honorable members opposite when taxation measures are being discussed - measures which affect not those who are short of the necessaries of life, but those who are concerned only with getting more than they already enjoy of the good things of life. Many of the old men, if they thought that the money was given in the spirit indicated by the remarks of some honorable members, would say, “ Go to the devil ! Keep your 2s. 6d.” I hope that the Treasurer will take an Australian view of this matter. I believe that generosity is an outstanding trait of the Australian character. Pensioners who are inmates of institutions need this payment more than those who are succoured by their own families.

Clause agreed to.

Sitting suspended from 1 to 2.15 p.m.

Clause 5 agreed to.

Clause 6 -

Section 47 of the principal act is amended by omitting therefrom the word “ three “ and inserting in its stead the word “ four.”

Mr GABB:
Angas

.- I do not intend to move an amendment upon this clause, not because I think it should not be moved, but because I know from the rulings given on previous amendments submitted that it would not be accepted. If I were to propose, as I should like to do, that the allowance to pensioner inmates of benevolent institutions should be increased to 5s. 6d. instead of 4s., as proposed by the clause, the amendment would be regarded as increasing the appropriation, and so would meet the fate of amendments which have already been submitted. One or two statements have been made in connexion with this subject to which I should like to reply. The inmates of these benevolent homes may be divided into three classes. The first class includes those committed to the homes under the order of a magistrate because of their habits, their increasing senility, or other reasons of the kind. Their number is comparatively small; I think the Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page) has said that they do not represent more than 1 per cent, of the total pensioner inmates of these institutions. The second class includes those old folk -who have no homes of their :own, are “without friends, and of their own volition have entered these asylums. When the allowance to pensioner inmates of these homes “was increased to 3s. per week, I visited the Old Polks Home in my district, and put in some time in filling in forms for the inmates. I then gained a very good idea of the class of men and women who are to be found in these homes. I found that many of the men were single men. They had borne the heat and burden of the day, and done pioneering “work in out-back parts of the country, -and in their declining years Came or were brought from the Stations out back to enter one of these homes. When I heard the Treasurer say that the increase of the. allowance would be no kindness to men of this type-

Dr Earle Page:

– No ;’ I did not refer to such pensioners. I specially quoted section 31 of the principal act to make my meaning clear.

Mr GABB:

– I am glad to have the correction, because, under the impression that the honorable gentleman was referring to pensioners of this type, I was disposed to say something to him which would not be parliamentary. If the honorable gentleman has ever visited one of these homes, he must have been struck by the row of bald heads to be seen in the dormitories. Many of these poor old fellows are absolutely infirm, and are confined to their beds. If an allowance of 5s. 6d. per week were given to such people it would be expended by the nurses and wardsmen, who have to take charge of them, in the purchase of many items of food which do not find a place in the dietary scale- of these institutions. The money would not be wasted, because it would provide the pensioners with a variety of diet which they could not otherwise enjoy. Many of ‘the pensioners are, of course, able to walk about. I was present on one occasion when a fruit cart came into the grounds of the institution to which I have referred, and it was a pleasure to see the old people spending their allowance in the purchase of the fruit they needed. Whilst I am willing to admit that some waste their allowance, the great majority spend it wisely. It is a common thing in the winter time for the authorities of institutions of this kind to make appeals to people who have old overcoats which they can spare for the benefit of these old men. Some of them save up their allowance to enable them to purchase warm clothing for the winter. The third class of pensioner inmates of these benevolent institutions are those who have friends and relatives who are not in a financial position to take care of them in their own homes, and give them the oversight they require. It has to be borne in mind also that old people become irritated by children, and where there are young children in a family dependent old people are better in these institutions. In the case of pensioners oi this class, the increased allowance would be very acceptable. The honorable member for Forrest (Mr.. Prowse) has said that some of these old people are addicted to drink. I have to admit that some of them do drink more than they ought, but I remind the honorable member that when one of these old men goes out of an institution, gets drunk, and comes in after hours, he may be disqualified from receiving even the present allowance of 3s. per week for a period of three months. I know that that ‘ is the case, because I have tried on behalf of some of these old people to secure a restoration of the- allowance before the three months has expired. ‘The next statement which I challenge is that made by the honorable member for Gippsland (Mr. Paterson). He said that the pensioner inmates of these benevolent institutions receive in the form of keep the equivalent of 16s. per week, and if they are also given an allowance of 4s. per week in cash they -will be placed on an equal footing with pensioners outside such institutions. I absolutely deny that. If the honorable member made that statement to an old man in one of these homes, who can get out only for half a day in each week, and must put up with the fare provided day after day, it would ‘be received with scorn.

Mr Paterson:

– What I said was that this would be true of the pensioner inmates of many institutions.

Mr GABB:

– I am speaking of the institution I know . If the honorable member were referring to some private institution the position might be different.

Mr Watson:

– If the statement does not apply to the institution to which the honorable member refers that may be the fault of the management.

Mr GABB:

– No, it is not. The management is all right. I am thankful that there are such asylums as the State Benevolent institution at Magill, in which these old people can be received, but to argue in view of the environment of inmates of these institutions, and the restrictions imposed upon their liberties, that with the payment of the allowance of 4s. per week they would be placed on an equal footing with pensioners living in their own homes or with their relatives is absolute nonsense. I am hoping that in future greater liberality will be extended to these old people. I would have been ashamed of myself if, having listened to what has been said about some of them, I had not voiced a protest on their behalf.

Mr F MCDONALD:
BARTON, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

.- If there is one class of persons to whom all the people of Australia are prepared to be not only just, but generous to a fault, it is the old-age pensioners, and particularly those who are so unfortunate as to be forced, through circumstances over which they have had no control, to enter one of these benevolent asylums and spend in it the twilight of their lives. As a rule they are persons who during the greater part of their lives were accustomed to the free and open life of Australia whilst they were carrying out the pioneering work from which we benefit so much to-day. It will give them great pleasure to know that the Government is increasing the old-age pension by 2s. 6d. per week, but it will be no pleasure to them to learn that the increase in their allowance is to be only1s. per week. I think the Government might well have proposed to increase their allowance by 2s. 6d. In my opinion it might have gone further, and, departing from the practice of the past might have made the allowance to pensioner inmates of benevolent institutions 9s. 6d. per week. I move -

That the word “four” be omitted with a view to insert in lieu thereof the words “ nine shillings and sixpence.”

I do not know whether this amendment will come under the ban of the Treasurer (Dr. Earle Page). I hope he will not contend that it will involve an increase of the appropriation. The increased allowance which I propose would enable these old people to purchase a few more of the comforts which mean so much to people in their declining years.

The TEMPORARY CHAIRMAN (Mr Bayley:

– I am unable to accept the amendment for the reason stated in refusing to accept similar amendments previously moved.

Clause agreed to.

Title agreed to.

Bill reported without amendment; report adopted.

Bill read a third time.

page 2569

WAR PENSIONS APPROPRIATION BILL

In committee (Consideration of GovernorGeneral’s message) :

Motion (by Dr. Earle Page) agreed to -

That it is expedient that an appropriation of revenue be made for the purposes of a bill for an act to grant and apply out of the Consolidated Revenue Fund a sum for war pensions.

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended; resolution adopted.

Ordered -

That. Dr. Earle Page and Sir Littleton Groom do prepare and bring in a bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

Bill presented by Dr. Earle Page, and read a first time.

Second Reading

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the bill be now read a second time.

This measure is to provide a further £10,000,000 for the payment of war pensions. It deals in no way with the rates and conditions of pensions, but merely makes provision for the money with which to pay the pensions which have been or will be granted in accordance with the conditions set out in the war pensions section of the Australian Soldiers’ Repatriation Act.

Mr Charlton:

– Will it be sufficient to meet requirements in regard to pensions for the whole financial year?

Dr EARLE PAGE:

– Yes. It is some years since the war ended, but the pensions bill of the Commonwealth is still well over £7,000,000 per annum. The amount remains practically stationary, or is slightly increasing, by reason of the fact that a certain number of new dependants of soldiers keep coming on the pension list. Included in the amount required is a small sum for the payment of pensions granted by the Mother Country and for dominions, which will be subsequently recovered. The total number of pensions being paid on the 11th inst. was 246,152, and the annual liability was, roughly, £7,100,000. A considerable number of new claims are still being received, the majority of which are in respect of new dependants, such as newly-born children and recently-married wives- of ex-soldiers who are pensioners. Up to the close of the last financial year the total expenditure on war pensions was £50.S10,959. The last “War PensionsAppropriation Act was passed in August,- 1924, the amount of the appropriation then being £10,000,000. The balance of that appropriation which remained unexpended on the 30th June last was £3,689,765. This will barely suffice for the first six months of the current financial year, and, therefore, the present appropriation is required to meet the needs of the year. This will enable the department to set aside for future payments ‘ any surplus revenue which may become available as a result of the year’s transactions. The procedure now being adopted is that usually followed in this matter. The money will be paid into a’ trust fund.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time, and passed through its remaining stages without amendment or debate.

page 2570

NAVAL CONSTRUCTION BILL

In committee (Consideration of GovernorGeneral’s message) :

Motion (by Sir Neville Howse) agreed to -

That it is expedient that an appropriation of revenue he made for the purposes of a bill for an act to .grant and apply out of the Consolidated Revenue Fund a sum for naval construction.

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended; resolution adopted.

Ordered -

That Sir Neville Howse and Dr. Earle Page do prepare and bring in a bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

Bil] presented by Sir Neville Howse, and read a first time.

Second Reading

Sir NEVILLE HOWSE:
Minister for Defence · Calare · NAT

– I move -

That the bill be now read a second time.

The appropriation of £1,500,000 provided for under this bill for naval construction purposes is required to meet the obligations that have been entered into in connexion with the construction of cruisers and submarines, and also to commence at an early date the construction of a seaplane carrier at Cockatoo Island. The order for a large quantity of material for the construction of the seaplane carrier has already been placed, and it is hoped that the building of this very necessary adjunct to the Naval Service will be commenced at Cockatoo Island at an early date, and completed within two years.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

.- I have no desire to delay the business brought forward, because I understand that the session will close shortly. I wish to facilitate the transaction of business so that honorable members may go to the electors. But, while I am not opposed to the expenditure on a seaplane carrier, I wish to enter an emphatic protest for the last time against orders being sent overseas for cruisers which could be built in Australia. We have shipbuilding yards suitable for the construction of war vessels, and Australian workmen have proved their capacity to build them. In the circumstances, I shall content myself at this juncture by simply placing on record my party’s protest against spending money overseas which should be used in providing employment for Australians.

Mr C RILEY:
COOK, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP; FLP from 1931

– I wish to enter a protest against the policy of the Cockatoo Island Dockyard authorities of importing rivets for the construction of the seaplane carrier. A wellequipped bolt and rivet shop exists at the present time at this dockyard, and it proved during the war years that it was capable of turning out splendid rivets. This plant produced all the rivets required in the construction of the cruiser Brisbane, as well as the steamers Fordsdale and Ferndale. A large number of the men employed at the dockyard have given many years of service there, but I am informed that on the 14th of this month four or five employees received seven days’ notice that their services would be dispensed with. This is entirely due to the policy of the department in using imported rivets. Since the dockyard has been fortunate enough to secure the order for the seaplane carrier, every effort should be made to complete the work with Australian materials. By utilizing the riveting plant available at Cockatoo Island employment would be given to Australian workmen.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time, and passed through its remaining stages without amendment or debate.

page 2571

INCOME TAX ASSESSMENT BILL

In committee (Consideration resumed from 17th September, vide page 2530) :

Clause 1 agreed to.

Clause 2 (Income arising from sale of trading stock).

Mr FENTON:
Maribyrnong

– Like my Leader (Mr. Charlton), I have no desire to delay matters. Nor am I anxious to use my voice in this chamber. At this juncture I prefer to reserve my vocal powers for outside use. Treasurers have always found themselves up against the fact that regulations and even acts of this Parliament have been declared invalid by the High Court. Section 88 of the Judiciary Act 1910 reads as follows : -

Whenever the Governor-General refers to the High Court for hearing and determination any question of law as to the validity of any act or enactment of the Parliament the High Court shall have jurisdiction to hear and determine the matter.

I do not know that any Government has yet requested the Governor-General to ask the High Court to determine the validity of any act of this Parliament. If use were made of this provision in the Judiciary Act I am sure considerable litigation, expense, and time of Parliament would be saved. Furthermore, we should not have so much amending legis lation before us to validate other legislation declared by the High Court to be invalid.

Clause agreed to.

Clause 3 -

Section 20 of the principal act is amended . by inserting therein, before sub-section (2), the following sub-sections: - (1a) For the purposes of the last preceding sub-section’ co-operative company ‘ means a company, the rules of which limit the number of shares which may be held by, or by and on behalf of, any one member to a number not exceeding ten of a total paid-up value not exceeding £10, and prohibit the quotation of the shares for saleor purchase at any stock exchange or in any other public manner whatever, and which is established for the purpose of carrying on any industry, trade, or business having as its primary object or objects one or both of the following: -

The acquisition of commodities or animals from its members for disposal or distribution in the ordinary course of the industry, trade, or business :

Provided that if, in any financial year, the value of the commodities or animals acquired from, or disposed of among, the members of a company (as the case may be) does not represent at least 90 per centum of the total value of the commodities or animals acquired or disposed of (as the case may be) by that company during that year, that company shall not, in respect of that year, be deemed to be a cooperative company.”

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

.- I move -

That the words “ to a number not exceeding ten of a total paid-up value not exceeding £10,” proposed new sub-section 1a, be omitted.

On the second reading I pointed out the necessity for this amendment, the object of which is to put co-operative societies in the position they were supposed to occupy after the passing of the last act. The shares of co-operative societies are not quoted on any stock exchange, because there is no dealing in them. Taxation should not be imposed on the amount that is received as interest on capital invested in these concerns. When the previous assessment bill was under consideration I was informed that the liability to pay companies’ taxation would not fall upon these co-operative concerns, but, subsequently, the Commission of Taxation found that the act, as it then stood, compelled him to impose taxation upon them. What I propose now is merely to bring about what Parliament intended should be done:

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

. -I remember the discussion between the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Charlton) and the present Prime Minister (Mr. Bruce), when this matter was previously considered, and it was entirely owing to misadventure that the position which was sought to be arrived at was not attained. In the circumstances, therefore, the Government is prepared to accept the amendment in the form suggested by the honorable member, which form will also,. I understand, suit the desire of the honorable member for Maranoa (Mr. Hunter) to exempt co-operative butter factories. No honorable member wants to see factories or companies of this description unduly penalized. The other amendments to this clause, standing in my name, are designed to include among the co-operative companies specified those that provide for the storage of commodities of their members, and those pools and co-operative concerns which will probably spring into greater activity now thatthe Rural Credits Department has been added to the Commonwealth Bank.

Amendment agreed to.

Amendments (by Dr. Earle Page) agreed to -

That the word “ ‘both “, proposed new subsection (1a), be omitted, with a view to insert in lieu thereof the word “ more “.

That after paragraph (b), proposed new subsection (1a), the following paragraph be inserted: -

The storage of commodities of its members.

That the proviso to proposed new sub-section (1a) be omitted, and the following: inserted in lieu thereof : - “ Provided that if in any financial year, the amount represented by the value of commodities and animals acquired from, the value of commodities and animals disposed of among, and the receipts in respect

Of the storage of commodities of. the members of a company is not at least 90 per centum of the amount represented by the total value of commodities and animals acquired, the total value of commodities and animals disposed of, and the total receipts in respect of storage, by that company during that year, that company shall not. in respect of that year be deemed to be a co-operative company.”

Clause, as amended, agreed to.

Clause 4 agreed to.

Cl ause 5 -

Section 23 of the principal act is amended by omitting sub-section (3) thereof.

Section proposed to be amended - (lA.)….. any person who : . . . proves to the satisfaction of the Commissioner -

that he lias expended money for, or entered into a contract or undertaking”with the Government, or an authority, of a State, for the purchase ofwire netting for use in the construction of a wire-netting fence to prevent animal pests entering upon the land used by him in the production of assessable income, shall be entitled to a deduction - (c)in the assessment of the income derived by him in the year in which he places the wire netting in position on the fence, of such sum as the Commissioner is satisfied has been expended by the person in the purchase of the wire netting so placed and in placing it in position on the fence; or

inthe case of a person who purchased the wire netting under a contract or undertaking with the Government, or an authority, of a State - of the amount paid by him, in respect of that wire netting, in the year in which theincome is derived, as purchase money or interest thereon, and the amount (if any) expended by Mm in that year in placing the wire netting in position on the fence.

Mr PROWSE:
Forrest

– I move - .

That after the word “ amended “ the following be inserted: - “ (a) by inserting in paragraph (b) of subsection (1a) thereof, after the words purchase of ‘, the words ‘ wire or ‘ ;

  1. by inserting in that paragraph, after the word construction ‘, the words or alteration ‘ ;
  2. by omitting from that paragraph the words ‘wire netting’ (second occurring) ;
  3. by inserting in paragraph (c) of that sub-section, after the words ‘ places the ‘, the words ‘ wire or ‘ ;
  4. by inserting in that paragraph, after the words ‘ purchase of the ‘, the words ‘ wire or ‘ ;
  5. by inserting in paragraph (d) of that sub-section, after the words ‘ purchased the’, the words ‘wire or’;
  6. by inserting, in that paragraph, after the words ‘ of that ‘, the words ‘ wire or’;
  7. by inserting in that paragraph, after the words ‘ placing the ‘, the words wire or’; and (i)”.

When the last Income Tax Assessment Bill was before this Chamber, an amendment submitted by the honorable member for Calare (Sir Neville Howse) to provide that the cost of vermin-proof fencing could be deducted from taxable incomein the year in which the expenditure was incurred, “was agreed to, but unfortunately only the words “ wire netting “ were used. More than wire netting is necessary to make a vermin-proof fence. If dingoes are to be kept out, barbed wire is frequently used, in addition to the ordinary fence, even if it be rabbit-proof. I think the Treasurer understands the position, and 1 shall be glad if he will accept my amendment.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– The amendment proposed by the honorable member for Forrest (Mr. Prowse) should really have been included in that which was submitted last year by the honorable member for Calare (Sir Neville Howse), whose intention was to cover the whole cost of the construction of vermin-proof fencing. Unfortunately, the drafting of the amendment did not carry out the honorable member’s intention in that respect.

Amendment agreed to.

Clause, as amended, agreed to.

Clauses 6 to 14 agreed to.

Clause 15 -

Where the Commissioner, purporting to act under the Income Tax Assessment Act 1922, the Income Tax Assessment Act 1922-23, or the principal act,has referred to a Board of Appeal any assessment, determination, or decision of the Commissioner, or wherr any objection against a. decision of the Commissioner has been treated as an appeal and forwarded to a Board of Appeal, the decision of a body of persons, purporting to act as a Board of Appeal, upon any such reference or objection shall be dee med tobe, and at all times to have been, a decision upon review and as valid and effectual as if it had been given by a board of review in pursuance of the provisions of the principal act, as amended by this act, and in any case in which the Commissioner or the taxpayer has instituted, or purported to institute, an appeal to the High Court from the decision of that body of persons, the Commissioner or the taxpayer may appeal to the High Court from that decision (as if it were a decision of a board of review) if, in the opinion of the High Court, the decision involves a question of law.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the words “ a decision “, line 7, be left out, with a view to insert in lieu thereof the words “ an assessment.”

This amendment is necessary so that the wording of the clause shall conform to section 50 of the principal act, which relates to an objection against an assessment.

Amendment agreed to.

Clause, as amended, agreed to.

Clause 16 -

  1. 1 ) Where the Commissioner, purporting to act under any act repealed by the principal act, has referred to a Board of Appeal any assessment, determination or decision of the Commissioner, or where any objection against a decision of the Commissioner has been treated as an appeal and forwarded to a Board of Appeal, the decision of a body of persons, purporting to act as a Board of Appeal, upon any such reference or objection, shall be deemed to be, and at all times to have been, a decision of a Board of Review upon review, and as valid and effectual as if the Board of Appeal under the act so repealed had been a Board of Review constituted in the same manner, and having the same powers and functions, as a Board of Review has under the, principal act as amended by this act.

Amendments (by Dr. Earle Page) agreed to -

That the words “ Where the Commissioner, purporting to act under any act repealed by the principal act, has referred to a Board of Appeal any assessment, determination or decision of the Commissioner, or where any objection against a decision “, be left out with a view to insert in lieu thereof the words, “ Where, under any act repealed by the principal act, any objection against an assessment “.

That the words “ reference or “, line 10, be left out.

That the word “ has “, line 17, be left out.

Clause, as amended, agreed to.

Clause 17 agreed to.

Clause 18 -

  1. Where a person purporting to act under andin accordance with the Income Tax Assessment Act 1922, the Income Tax Assessment Act 1922-1923, or the principal act, and the regulations under any of those acts, or. under and in accordance with any act repealed by the principal act, and the regulations under the act so repealed, has requested the Commissioner to treat his objection against his assessment as an appeal to the High Court or the Supreme Court of a State, and the hearing of the appeal has not commenced, that person may within thirty days after the commencement of this section, by notice in writing, request the Commissioner to refer his assessment to a Board of Review for review in respect of the matters stated in the objection and the Commissioner shall refer the assessment accordingly.

Amendment (by Dr. Earle Page) agreed to -

That the word “ thirty “, line 13, be left out, with a view to insert in lieu thereof the word “ ninety “.

Clause, as amended, agreed to.

Clause 19 agreed to.

Clause 20-

Sections two. four, five, and six of this act shall be deemed to have commenced upon the date of the commencement of the Income Tax Assessment Act 1922.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the words “ four, five, and six “ be left out with a view to insert in lieu thereof the words “and four paragraph (i) of section five and section six.”.

This amendment is necessary on account of the acceptance of the amendment moved by the honorable member for Forrest (Mr. Prowse).

Amendment agreed to.

Clause, as amended, agreed to.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the following new clause be inserted: - 1a. Section 2 of the principal act is amended by adding at the end thereof the following further proviso: - “Provided further that no alteration or addition shall be made in or to any assessment made under any such act after the expiration of three years from the date when the tax payable on the assessment was originally due and payable, unless the Commissioner has reason to believe that there has been an avoidance of tax owing to fraud or attempted evasion.”

Last year the powers of the Commissioner under the acts of 1915-21 were revived, but, unfortunately, a provision that neither the Commissioner nor the taxpayer could re-open an assessment after the expiration of three years was not inserted at that time, and although the Commissioner has in practice observed that limitation, this new clause will put the matter beyond doubt.

Proposed new clause agreed to.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the following new clause be inserted : - 6a. Section thirty-seven of the principal act is amended by inserting at the end thereof the following sub-section : - “(3) Notwithstanding anything contained in this section, where an assessment for any financial year includes the estimated amount of income derived by the taxpayer, during the preceding financial year, from an operation or series of operations the profit or loss on which was not ascertainable at the end of that preceding year owing to the fact that the operation or series of operations was carried on during a period which extends over more than one, or parts of more than one, financial year, the Commissioner, upon ascertaining the total profit or loss actually derived or arising from the operation or series of operations, may, at any time, alter that assessment so as to ensure its completeness and accuracy on the basis of the profit or loss so ascertained.”

This new clause is inserted to provide for a type of case that is becoming increasingly frequent, as illustrated by the seven years’ contract for the Sydney Harbour bridge. The Taxation Act as it stands only permits the review of assessments for three preceding years, but it is obvious that under that provision gross injustice may be done a taxpayer owing to the inability of the Commissioner in such cases to go back further and take into account previous losses.

Proposed new clause agreed to.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the following new clause be inserted : - “ 14a. Every assessment of the Commissioner, Assistant Commissioner, or Deputy Commissioner, made under any act repealed by the principal act, shall be as valid and effectual as if any board of appeal under the act so repealed had been a board of review constituted . in the same manner, and having the same powers and functions, as a board of review under the principal act as amended by this act.”

That new clause simply applies to the acts of 1915-21, the same rules as apply to the whole bill.

Proposed new clause agreed to.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the following new clause be inserted : - “ 18a. Where the Commissioner, purporting to act under section twenty-one of the Income Tax Assessment Act 1922, or of the Income Tax Assessment Act 1922-1923, or of the principal act, has, within the time prescribed for making a determination under that section, indicated (whether expressly or impliedly) in writing to a company that he is of opinion that it could reasonably have distributed a sum or further sum to its members or shareholders, that indication shall be deemed to be, and at all times to have been, a determination within the meaning of that section.”

A proper schedule is now in common use for sending out notices, and this new clause provides that all notices which have previously been sent out by the Commissioner in varying forms shall be valid.

Proposed new clause agreed to.

Title agreed to.

Bill reported with amendments; report adopted.

Bill read a third time.

page 2575

INCOME TAX BILL

In Committee of Waysand Means:

Motion (by Dr. Earle Page) agreed to -

That a tax be imposed on income derived from sources in Australia at the following amounts and rates, namely: -

Rate of Tax upon Income Derived from Personal Exertion.

For so much of the whole taxable income as does not exceed £7,600 the average rate of tax per pound sterling shall be Threepence and three eight-hundredths of one penny where the taxable income is One pound sterling, and shall increase uniformly with each increase of One pound sterling of the taxable income by three eight-hundredths of one penny.

The average rate of tax per pound sterling for so much of the taxable income as does not exceed £7,600 may be calculated from the following formula: -

For every pound sterling of taxable income in excess of £7,600 the rate of tax shall be Sixty pence.

In addition to the tax payable under the preceding provisions, there shall be payable, in the case of incomes in respect of which the tax is calculated under Subdivision A, B, or C, an additional tax equal to twenty per centum of the amount of the tax so calculated.

Notwithstanding anything contained in the preceding provisions, where a person would, apart from this provision, be liable to pay income tax’ of an amount less than One pound, the tax payable by that person shall be One pound.

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended; resolution adopted.

Ordered -

That Dr. Earle Page and Sir Littleton Groom do prepare and bring in a bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

Bill presented by Dr. Earle Page, and read a first time.

Second Beading.

Dr EARLE PAGE:
Treasurer · Cowper · CP

– I move -

That the bill be now read a second time.

This bill is framed in strict accordance with the terms of my announcement in the budget speech, namely, that the Government intends to reduce the rates of tax which apply in the assessment for the financial year 1924-25 by approximately. 12½ per cent., so that the new rates will represent an increase of 20 per cent. over the rates imposed when the income tax was first levied in 1915-16. It is not pproposed to make any alteration in the at rate of1s. which is charged upon the profits of companies.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time, and passed through its remaining stages without amendment or debate.

page 2576

CUSTOMS TARIFF

Residual Oil and Crude Petroleum

In Committee of W ays and Means :

Mr PRATTEN:
Minister for Trade and Customs · Martin · NAT

– I move -

That in lieu of the duties of Customs imposed by paragraph (b) (2) of item 229 of the Tariff Resolution proposed in the House of Representatives on 2nd day of September, 1925, duties of Customs be collected as follows as from and after the third day of September, 1925, at 9 o’clock in the forenoon, Victorian time: -

The reason for the motion is that, owing to some omission by the Tariff Board its recommendation regarding residual oil and crude petroleum for fuel purpose’s was not forwarded to me until to-day. I find that the recommendation is that a duty of½d. per gallon shall be inserted in each of the three columns of the tariff. Obviously, neither I nor the Government has had an opportunity to consider the recommendation. Meanwhile, unless something is done, a duty of 3½d. per gallon must be collected. That was not intended by the Government, nor do I think it would be approved by this Parliament. This motion will restore the item to the position it occupied under the existing tariff before it was amended. It will not commit either me, or the Government, or the House to admitting residual oil and crude petroleum free of duty if, after further consideration and investigation, some amendment is found to be necessary.

Progress reported.

page 2576

ADJOURNMENT

Dissolution - Construction of Cruisers - Power Alcohol Bill - Northern Territory Court Case - Timber Industry - Income Tax Assessment Bill - Private Members’ Motions - Western Australia Disabilities Commission

Mr BRUCE:
Prime Minister and Minister for External Affairs · Flinders · NAT

– I move -

That the House do now adjourn.

I have to inform honorable members that I have tendered to His Excellency the Governor-General certain advice which His Excellency has accepted. I am authorized to say that His Excellency proposes to dissolve Parliament as soon as the necessary Supply has been granted to carry on the services of government over the period of the election, and a measure has been passed to validate the tariff schedule which was laid upon the table of the House recently, so as to authorize the collection of Customs and excise duties thereunder.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

.- I am sure that the people will be gratified by the announcement made by the Prime Minister. The right honorable gentleman took some time to pluck up sufficient courage to resolve to go to the people, but I think there was no alternative open to him. The farcical proceedings before the Deportation Board, and the legislation recently passed by this Parliament, justified the Opposition in assenting to the speedy passage of certain Government measures this afternoon in order that we might facilitate an appeal to the country. The House will meet next week, I assume, to grant Supply; if the bill were ready now I should consent to its immediate passage. We shall offer no opposition to the granting of Supply next week, so that we may at once go to the electors and ask them whether they endorse the legislation that has been enacted by this Parliament during the last few weeks.

Mr MAHONY:
Dalley

.- I rise to direct attention to the manner in which this Government loaded the dice against Australian tenderers in connexion with the contract for the construction of two 10,000-ton cruisers. When I first opposed the Government’s proposal to let the contract overseas, I stated that the dice had been loaded against Australian builders. I am now in possession of definite proof of that allegation, and I propose to make it public in order to reveal the manner in which this Government has, in pursuance of its antiAustralian policy, deprived local people of the opportunity of obtaining work so that money might be sent overseas to give work to people in another land. This morning I asked the Minister for Defence (Sir Neville Howse) if he was prepared to lay upon the Library table the communications which had passed between the Navy Office and the firm of John Brown and Company, which was the successful tenderer for the two cruisers. Of course, the Minister was very cautious ; he knew that the Government had been in communication with John Brown and Company months before tenders were invited in Australia for the construction of the cruisers. That is proved by the following cablegram, sent from the manager of John Brown and Company, of Clydebank, to the Navy Office, early in July, 1924 : -

Reply yourwire approximate average percentage cost in Great Britain for labour, material, and overhead would be 41, 51, and 8 per cent. respectively. From this you will see that only half charges are being included in present-day prices, and no profits at all.

That message was sent months before an opportunity was given to Australian builders to tender for the construction of the cruisers. The dice were loaded against them.

Mr BAYLEY:
OXLEY, QUEENSLAND · NAT

– What nonsense!

Mr MAHONY:

– The people will not say that when they understand the circumstances in which £5,000,000 was sent out of the country in order to give work to people 12,000 miles across the seas. The wording of that cable indicates clearly that it was sent in reply to a communication from the Navy Office, giving John Brown and Company a hint as to how they should tender in order to be sure of getting the contract, and John Brown and Company pointed out that the contract price included only half overhead charges, and no profits at all. When Australians were asked to tender they were compelled to include the whole of the overhead charges, plus profits and also interest upon the debentures held by the Government from the Commonwealth Shipping Board. I leave this message to carry its own tale to the people of Australia of the scandalous manner in which this Government loaded the dice against Australian firms, and I feel sure that the electors will welcome an early opportunity of applying the axe to the parties now in power.

Mr FORDE:
Capricornia

.- Will the Minister for Trade and Customs announce what is to be the fate of the Power Alcohol Bill? Does he intend to allow it to lapse, or is it to be passed before the Parliament is dissolved? 1 am confident that honorable members on. this side will offer no opposition to it; but will only ask that its scope be widened.

Mr Manning:

– The honorable member asked that the consideration of the bill should be postponed.

Mr FORDE:

– I asked that the bounty should be made applicable to power alcohol manufactured from molasses, inferior sugars, and syrups in order to assist the sugar producers of Queensland to solve the problem of over-production, and help to keep in the Commonwealth the £7,000,000 that is annually sent abroad for the purchase of liquid fuel. I ask the Minister not to tinker with this problem.

Mr SPEAKER (Rt Hon W A Watt:

– Order! I remind the honorable member for Capricornia (Mr. Forde) that the measure to which he is referring is on the notice-paper, and he is not in order in anticipating the discussion of it.

Mr FORDE:

– I have received a hint to the effect that the Government intend to drop the bill; and, after all we have heard, it would appear that its introduction was purely an electioneering dodge.

They will sayto the people, “ If you return us to power we will pass this bill.”

Mr SPEAKER (Rt Hon W A Watt:

– I know nothing concerning the dropping of the bill. The House has had no such intimation.

Mr FORDE:

– I received a hint that the Government intend to drop the measure; and, on behalf of the people whom I represent, I urge the Government to pass the bill. We will give it every support, and between now and next week the Government will have an opportuuity to extend its scope to enable bonuses to be paid on power-alcohol produced from molasses, inferior sugars and syrups, and thus help the great sugar industry of Queensland to meet the position which has arisen in consequence of over production.

Mr NELSON:
Northern Territory

– I desire to bring under the notice of the Attorney-General (Sir Littleton Groom) the following newspaper paragraph, which appeared this morning : -

page 2578

QUESTION

NORTHERN TERRITORY SETTLER GAOLED FOR TWO YEARS FOR STEALING BAG OF FLOUR

Darwin, Thursday. - In the Supreme Court to-day, before Judge Roberts, James Wilkinson, an elderly man, was charged with breaking and entering, and the larceny of a bag of flour, valued at 13s.

Wilkinson said that the nearest store from his place was at Brock’s Creek, 75 miles away. Under assistance given by the Primary Producers’ Board, he was allowed one bag of flour a month.

This man, who is a Daly River settler, has been committed to prison for two years for taking a bag of flour.

Mr NELSON:

– I cannot say. He is a settler in an isolated portion of the north of Australia, and in a place which the Government guaranteed to provide with shipping facilities if settlers took up the land. These settlers have never been provided with shipping facilities, neither have they been given an opportunity to make good on the land they have taken up. So far as I can gather, this man, who was short of flour, went to the Government institution on the river and asked to be supplied with a few pounds to tide him over, and as his request was refused, he went into the Go vernment store and took a bag. For that he has been sentenced to two years’ imprisonment. I should like the Attorney-

General (Sir Littleton Groom) to look into the matter, because it appears to be a case of exceptionally harsh treatment.

I have also received the following communication from another settler on the Daly River, which was written long before the incident I have just mentioned occurred.

Mr J FRANCIS:
MORETON, QUEENSLAND · NAT; UAP from 1931; LP from 1944

– Is the honorable member sure of the facts of the case he has just mentioned?

Mr NELSON:

– I am quoting only the newspaper report. That is all the information I have. In regard to the second case. I wish to illustrate the conditions under which the people on the Daly River are living. The letter reads -

Something worse than a Citrus Canker Ordinance has happened now.

That was an ordinance tinder which an unqualified officer in the department destroyed the whole of the citrus trees in the Northern Territory, and also the peanut crop which the settlers had produced. The letter continues -

You know that the Administrator, Mr. Urquhart, promised us that he would recommend the Minister to compensate us for being at the time prevented by the ordinance from shipping peanuts south. We got a letter from Mr. McLaren, of the Home and Territories, that our request for compensation would not be entertained, on the advice of the Administrator. Consequently, we are not troubling Mr. Urquhart this time.

In June, we shipped a mixed lot of peanuts to Dalgety’s. The nuts in the shell brought 7d. per lb. ; the shelled nuts brought 8½d. a lb. We set to work to get the remainder of the nuts on hand shelled. We finished the job, and booked 45 bags of 70 lb. each to the landing here. They had to remain there forabout seven weeks awaiting shipment, the boat being just seven weeks behind time. Owing to this long wait, the peanuts were totally destroyed by weevils. We got the policeman to come and have a look at them, and he was of the same opinion as us - that it would be useless to ship them.

The letter states that Dalgety and Company offered to purchase the peanuts at 8½d. per lb. This is merely a repetition of treatment that has been meted out to these settlers since they have been on the Daly River. I know of many instances where produce has been waiting on the banks for Government boats for a considerable time, and in the absence of any shelter, the whole of the crop has been destroyed. In view of these conditions, is it any wonder that a settler’s mentality becomes abnormal, and that men in need of the common necessities of life, such as flour, feel compelled to take what they require from a Government store? I appeal to the Attorney-General to look into this case, and, as an act of grace, to arrange that this man is immediately released on parole.

Sir LITTLETON GROOM:
Attorney-General · Darling Downs · NAT

– It is quite impossible for me to express an opinion in the absence of the full facts of the case. Now that the matter has been brought under my notice, I shall certainly obtain a report on the case, as requested by the honorable member.

Mr O’KEEFE:
Denison.

.- As the Minister for Trade and Customs (Mr. Pratten) has announced to the House that a bill to validate the tariff schedule which has been tabled will be brought down some time next week, I ask if he cannot include an item under which increased protection will be given to the Australian timber industry? I do so because the Minister twelve months ago promised that increased protection, which is so necessary to preserve the industry and to prevent it from being entirely wiped out, would be given this year, as soon as he was in possession of all the necessary information to enable him to say what additional protection was required. So far as I have been able to learn, the recommendation of the Tariff Board is not against increased protection; but I have not as yet had an opportunity of perusing the report. It was hoped that the report would have been available earlier, and, although a motion was carried this morning authorizing the printing of it, honorable members have not yet had time to peruse it. The Minister will have ample time to give the matter further attention before we meet next week. The timber industry is one in which thousands of men should be employed; but, owing to the inadequate protection, and the vastimportations of timber from cheap-labour countries, many are now out of work. I should also like to know if it is not possible to include paper pulp in the tariff schedule, the production of which is of vital importance to Tasmania. Perhaps the Minister will be able to give consideration to these two questions, and make some definite announcement next week concerning the intentions of the Government.

Mr YATES:
Adelaide

– I have only one request to make before we seek the suffrages of our constituents, and that is to ask the Prime Minister (Mr. Bruce) if he can inform the House as to the intention of the Government in. regard to the north-south railway? We were definitely assured by the right honorable gentleman that he would be faithful to the South Australian people, and would introduce a bill providing for the construction of the north-south line. An agreement has been entered into between the Commonwealth Government and the South Australian Government, and we look to the Prime Minister to honour his promise. The only point in dispute appears to be whether the line shall be constructed from Kingoonyah to Oodnadatta or from Oodnadatta to Alice Springs. Personally, I do not care which route is selected; but, after all that has been said and written and promised concerning the development of this vast tract of country by. a railway to the north, it is to be hoped that the proposal is a little nearer fruition. If the Prime Minister has” to his credit the passing of such a bill when he goes to the electors, his party may be able to obtain a seat or two more in South Australia.

Mr PRATTEN:
Minister for Trade and Customs · Martin · NAT

– In reply to the request of the honorable member for Denison (Mr. O’Keefe), I desire to say that, in consequence of the announcement of the Prime Minister, it is obvious that no further legislation can be introduced. I have spent considerable time this week with those interested in the timber industry, and as further inquiries will be conducted by the Tariff Board, the matter will be dealt with at some future date.

I was rather interested in the remarks of the honorable member for Capricornia (Mr.Forde) concerning the Power Alcohol Bill, which was introduced some time ago. The Government was ready and eager to pass the bill in order to establish the power-alcohol industry; but, owing to the numerous impossible propositions put forward by the honorable member for Capricornia (Mr. Forde), and others who supported him, the passage of the bill was delayed until the report of the Public Accounts Committee had been received. I now understand that that committee’s report confirms the action taken by the Government and by the Minister, and the . responsibility for the delay is upon the honorable member for Capricornia.

Mr FORDE:
Capricornia

. - Mr. Speaker-

Mr SPEAKER (Rt Hon W A Watt:

-The honorable member for Capricornia (Mr. Forde) has already spoken.

Mr FORDE:

– I desire to make a personal explanation.

Mr SPEAKER:

– The honorable member will be in order if he confines himself to a personal explanation.

Mr FORDE:

– In regard to the very unfair statement of the Minister for. Trade and Customs (Mr. Pratten), I desire to repeat what I have already stated, that I was not opposed to the Power Alcohol Bill in its present form. I would have voted for it as it was presented; but I desired the Government to widen its scope so that bounties would be paid on power alcohol manufactured from molasses, inferior sugars, and syrups obtained from sugar, and thus solve the problem of the over-production of sugar in Queensland. The Government had the support of a majority of honorable members of this House, and it . could have passed the bill if it desired to do so. The Opposition was not of sufficient strength to defeat the Government’s proposals, even if it intended to do so, as was shown by the way in which the measure providing for the deportation of certain individuals was passed through Parliament. The whole responsibility for the failure to pass the bill rests upon the Government.

Mr SPEAKER:

– Order !

Mr FORDE:

– The proposals of honorable members on this side were submitted with the intention of extending the scope of the bill.

Mr SPEAKER:

– Order ! I am somer what loth to interrupt the honorable member for Capricornia (Mr. Forde). In consequence of the announcement made by the right honorable the Prime Minister. I think the Chair is justified in allowing a certain amount of additional latitude, and that the honorable member has been given twice this afternoon. He has gone beyond the limits of a personal explanation. If he confines his remarks to a personal explanation, I shall be glad to bear him.

Mr FORDE:

– When the Minister descends to tactics-

Mr SPEAKER:

– That is not a personal explanation.

Mr FORDE:

– The statement of the Minister for Trade and Customs is grossly unf air. The proposals submitted by ‘honorable members on this side did not prevent the Government from passing the bill. The people were-

Mr SPEAKER:

– The honorable gentleman cannot go over that again.

Mr FORDE:

– The whole responsibility rests upon the Minister, and he must accept it. I challenge him to resign his seat and contest- a constituency in the sugar districts of Queensland.

Mr SPEAKER:

– Order! It is the first time that I have seen the announcement of a dissolution followed by such merriment. I hope the House will conduct itself with due decorum.

Mr LATHAM:
Kooyong

.- I desire to make a personal explanation. It was my intention to move an amendment to the Income Tax Assessment Bill which was agreed to this afternoon. I was in the building, but owing to the unexampled speed with which legislation has been passed to-day, I was prevented from carrying out my intention.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

.- It was my intention to bring before the House the question of the sentence imposed on a person in the Northern Territory for the larceny of a small bag of flour from a government store, but the honorable member for the Northern Territory (Mr. Nelson) has already done so. In this connexion, I desire to repeat some words of Cardinal Manning, which are equal to anything that Shakespeare ever wrote. Cardinal Manning once said: “ Necessity knows no law, and a starving man has a right to his brother’s bread.” I grant that the man was guilty of larceny, but for a judge to sentence a hungry man to two years’ imprisonment for stealing a small bag of flour is monstrous. I hope that he will not get the same treatment when he faces his Maker.

I desire to appeal to the Prime Minister to grant the House an opportunity to come to a decision in regard to certain notices of motion standing in the names of various private members. I, myself, have four important motions on the j notice-paper. I should like the Prime Minister, by. permission of the House, to grant half an hour for a division without! debate, to be taken on each of those questions. I should then be supplied with data to enable me to determine whether or not, in the new Parliament, I should again move those four motions. ‘ Two of them are not party questions, but they are very important to a large body of people outside, especialy the “ diggers.” In their name, I ask the Prime Minister to grant an opportunity for a vote to be taken on these motions.

SirNEVILLE HOWSE (CalareMinister for Defence) [3.50].- The honorable member for Dalley (Mr. Mahony) has used an answer which I gave to a question this morning as the basis ofa very interesting platform speech, but his arguments could not possibly carry any weight with honorable members on either side of the House. The honorable member waved in his hand a telegram which he stated had been received by the Navy Office from John Brown and Company in August of last year. I have not the slightest doubt that such a telegram was sent, as well as hundreds of others. The honorable member implied that the telegram had been sent with a sinister motive. If he continues in the same strain, and displays the same amount of vigour during the seven or eight weeks that remain before the date of the election, I shall fear very gravely for his health. I say that to him as a personal friend.

Mr GREGORY:
Swan

.- As a royal commission has been taking evidence for a long time in connexion with Western Australian disabilities, I suggest to the Prime Minister that the report of the commission, which, I understand, is almost completed, be circulated among honorable members before we meet here again next week. “We shouldlike, before we dispose of the tariff, to have some information as to the effect of the report.

Mr BRUCE:
Prime Minister and Minister for External Affairs · Flinders · NAT

– I desire to inform the honorable member for Swan (Mr. Gregory) that the report of the royal commission on Western Australian disabilities will be available in the very near future. I hope to be able to comply with his request.

I deeply regret that it will be impossible to accede to the request of the honorable member for Melbourne (Dr. Maloney) that an opportunity begiven for a vote to be taken on the several motions on the noticepaper in the names of private members. I remind him that once a dissolution has been announced, no business of any kind, other than the measures indicated in making the announcement, can be taken. I desire now to refer to the statement by the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Charlton). In making my announcement to the House, I said nothing beyond the actual facts, and did not attempt to make any reference of a political nature. I regret that in commenting on my statement, the Leader of the Opposition should have done so. I can only say that I am, indeed, glad, but very much surprised, that he welcomes an election with the enthusiasm which his remarks suggest. The next few weeks will prove whether he is really as enthusiastic as he appears to be to-day. I can assure the honorable gentleman that the course which I have taken has been definitely and clearly before me. It has not been dictated, as he suggested, by any desire to try to gain an advantage for the party which I have the honour to lead in this House. I have taken it only because I have a very deep conviction that it is desirable at this time that the people of Australia shall express their opinion’ whether the Commonwealth is to be governed by its duly elected Parliament or by outside extremists, and whether they wish to see law and order maintained in this country.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Houseadjourned at 3.55 p.m.

Cite as: Australia, House of Representatives, Debates, 18 September 1925, viewed 22 October 2017, <http://historichansard.net/hofreps/1925/19250918_reps_9_111/>.