House of Representatives
12 October 1921

8^th Parliament · 1^st Session

QUESTION
- AUSTRALIAN NAVY
QUESTION
- WASHINGTON CONFERENCE
QUESTION
- TAXATION COMMISSION’S REPORT
QUESTION
- WAR BONDS
QUESTION
- BORROWING PROM AMERICA
QUESTION
- OLD-AGE PENSIONS
QUESTION
- KALGOORLIE TO PORT AUGUSTA RAILWAY
QUESTION
- ALLOWANCE TO MR. HENRY LAWSON
QUESTION
- TAXATION : ALLEGED EVASIONS BY IMPORTING FIRMS
QUESTION
- TUBERCULAR AND PHTHISIS CASES
QUESTION
- DESTROYERS PLACED OUT OF COMMISSION
QUESTION
- COMMONWEALTH REPRESENTATION IN ENGLAND
PAPERS
IMPERIAL CONFERENCE. DEBATES
- Pointof Order
SUPPLY BILL (No. 3) 1921-22
WAR PENSIONS APPROPRIATION BILL
ADJOURNMENT

– At the moment, the intention is not to print the evidence; but the matter will be one for the House to consider. I regret that the report has not yet been received. As soon as it comes to hand, I shall be glad to make it available to honorable members.

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QUESTION

WAR BONDS

Western Australian Inquiry

Mr FOWLER:
PERTH, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

– I understand that a Select Committee of the Legislative Assembly of Western Australia is taking action to compel the attendance of an official of the Commonwealth Treasury to give evidence at an inquiry into the traffic in soldiers’ war bonds. Can the Treasurer say why his Department opposes the giving of evidence by this official ? Is the objection based on procedure or on principle?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– A Select Committee has been appointed by the Legislative Assembly of Western Australia to conduct an inquiry which will undoubtedly involve a review of the exercise of Federal functions. The State Legislature is, of course, perfectly entitled to do what it thinks fit in investigating the conduct of land agents and other operators within the State ; but, before it inquires into the operations of the Federal Government, there is a proper course to be taken, and that course has not been taken. What should have been done is this : The Premier of Western Australia should have communicated with the Prime Minister of. the Commonwealth asking that the attendance of Commonwealth officers at the inquiry might be permitted, and the production ofnecessary papers sanctioned. That course was not taken. The only communication we have had from the Premier of Western Australia is a telegram intimating that the Legislative Assembly of the State had ordered our officer to produce certain papers. Honorable members will see that that is not the way to proceed. But I say, firmly and decisively, that it is the desire of this Government to render every assistance in its power for the elucidation of matters such as that into which the Committee is inquiring; and I have, therefore, intimated to the chairman of the Committee, and to the Premier ofWestern Australia, through the Prime Minister, that I propose to despatch an officer from Melbourne on Friday next to assist our officer in Perth in making a full presentation of the case. We have no desire to refuse useful information; but we cannot be ordered by a State Government to produce information.

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QUESTION

BORROWING PROM AMERICA

Mr FENTON:
MARIBYRNONG, VICTORIA

– I ask the Treasurer if it is true that the Government intend to follow the example of the Government of Queensland by floating a loan on the American money market?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Unless I am careful in answering the question, I may get another avalanche of Fihelly on my head. He already resents what he terms my impertinence in this matter.

Mr Gabb:

– You have no right to interfere.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Quite so; and I have not interfered. I have merely expressed regret that it has been found necessary for a State to go outside the Empire for financial accommodation.

Mr West:

– Who brought it about? Who was the cause?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I have not touched on the cause, and I have not criticised what has been done. I have merely expressed regret that Queensland has gone outside the Empire for financial accommodation, and that she has had to pay such an extraordinarily high price for it.

Mr Fenton:

– You must be careful about that.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I am being careful. I am sorry that Queensland has had to submit to the most extraordinary conditions that have ever surrounded the floating of an Australian loan. I do not intend to go beyond that remark. As to the intentions of this Government, we propose to go to the London market when we borrow. My reply to the question, “Shall we go on the American market?” is “ No.”

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QUESTION

OLD-AGE PENSIONS

Mr CONSIDINE:
BARRIER, NEW SOUTH WALES

– Is the Treasurer aware that a considerable number of oldage pensioners have had their pensions suspended by the Pensions Department on the ground that they are in receipt of relief from the Government of New South Wales, and that that Government is refusing relief to them because they are Commonwealth pensioners? Will the honorable gentleman see that their pension rights are restored to them forthwith?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I know nothing of the matter ; but if the honorable member will furnish particulars, I shall be glad to have an inquiry into them.

page 11865

QUESTION

KALGOORLIE TO PORT AUGUSTA RAILWAY

Traffic

Mr BURCHELL:
FREMANTLE, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

asked the Minister for Works and Railways, upon notice -

Whether he will submit a statement showing (a) the number of passengers carried on the East-West Railway for the six months ending 30th September, 1921, showing eastbound and westbound separately; (b) the total revenue earned during the same period?

Mr GROOM:
Minister for Works and Railways · DARLING DOWNS, QUEENSLAND · NAT

– The answer to the honorable member’s question is as follows: -

Number of “through” passengers on the East-West Railway for six months ended 30th September, 1921, was -

Eastbound - 5,736.

Westbound - 5,545.

The total earnings of the railway dur ing the same period were £98,43411s.6d.

page 11865

QUESTION

ALLOWANCE TO MR. HENRY LAWSON

Mr MAHONY:
for Mr. Blakeley

asked the Prime Minister, upon notice- ls it a fact that Mr. Henry Lawson has done much by his writing to cultivate an Australian sentiment,- if so, will the Prime Minister increase the present allowance of£1 per week to at least some sum which will allow of Mr. Lawson living in comfort for the rest of his life?

Mr POYNTON:
Minister for Home and Territories · GREY, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

– The merit of Mr. Henry Lawson’s literary work is fully recognised, but, as the maximum amount of assistance authorized to be. granted under the rules for the administration of the Literary Fund is £1 per week, and the amount of the vote, which is small, is almost fully allocated, it is regretted that the increase suggested by the honorable member cannot be granted.

page 11866

QUESTION

TAXATION : ALLEGED EVASIONS BY IMPORTING FIRMS

Mr FLEMING:
ROBERTSON, NEW SOUTH WALES

asked the Treasurer, upon notice -

What sums is it estimated have been lost to the Taxation Department owing to the evasion of taxation by importing firms?
Has legal opinion been obtained’ from outside the Department as to the possibility of receiving payment of these sums?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– So far as is known, all taxesdue by importing firms under the various Taxation Acts have been recovered. If the honorable member has specific cases I shall be glad if he will let us have them.

page 11866

QUESTION

TUBERCULAR AND PHTHISIS CASES

Sanatorium and Clinic at Bendigo.

Mr MAHONY:
for Mr. Blakeley

asked the Prime Minister, upon notice -

Whether it is a fact that the Minister promised to establish a clinic at Bendigo for the purpose of investigating phthisis and tuberculosis, and also a sanatorium for the sufferers from these diseases; if so, when does the Prime Minister intend to honour those promises?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– The Prime Minister is at present in Bendigo, and while there is going into the matter of the establishment of a clinic in that city in connexion with phthisis and tuberculosis. Provision has already been made in the Estimates for the establishment of this clinic.

page 11866

QUESTION

DESTROYERS PLACED OUT OF COMMISSION

Mr MARKS:

asked the Minister for the Navy, upon notice -

Whether it is a fact that the destroyers Tasmania, Tattoo, and Success have been placed out of commission. If so, how will the crews of these destroyers be employed?
Will the Royal Australian Navy be reduced below what might be considered a safe margin by these destroyers being placed out of commission, and will the training of officers and men and their rights to promotion be in any way jeopardized by such action?

Mr LAIRD SMITH:
NAT

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow: -

Tasmania, Tattoo, and Success have been paid off and placed in reserve with care and maintenance parties only. The vessels are being kept in all readiness for being put into commission again should circumstances permit or require it. The majority of the officers and men from these destroyershave been posted tothe light cruisers to complete their crews to full complement, thus rendering the Light Cruiser Force a more efficient and useful unit. Officers and men lent from the Royal Navy will revert to the Royal Navy on expiration of their engagements.
This involves no reduction in the number of vessels in the Royal Australian Navy, but will render the ships remaining in activecommission more efficient. As regards training, it is always preferable that ships be kept in active commission rather than in reserve, but, with this exception, it is notanticipated that the training will suffer. The rights of officers and men to promotion should not be jeopardized by the vessels referred to being placed in reserve.

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QUESTION

COMMONWEALTH REPRESENTATION IN ENGLAND

Dr EARLE PAGE:
COWPER, NEW SOUTH WALES · FSU; CP from 1920

asked the PrimeMinister, upon notice -

Whether he will afford the House an opportunity of discussing the question of the alteration of our system of representation in England before making any appointment to the vacant office of High Commissioner?

SirJOSEPH COOK. - I should beglad if the honorable member would postpone this question until the return of the Prime Minister to his place in the House - probably to-morrow.

page 11866

PAPERS

The following papers werepresented: -

Public Service Act - Sixteenth Report on the Public Service, by the Acting Commissioner.

Railways - Uniform Railway Gauge - Report of the Royal Commission on the matter of.

Commonwealth Bank Act. - Regulations Amended - Statutory Rules 1921, No. 193.

Norfolk Island - Ordinance of 1921 - No. 2 - Executive Council (No. 2).

Ordered to beprinted.

page 11866

IMPERIAL CONFERENCE. DEBATES

Pointof Order

Mr FOWLER:

– I wish to take a point of order in regard to procedure. My point is that there has disappeared from the notice-paper an Order of the Day, which should still properly be before the-

House, in regard to the Imperial Conference and other matters discussed by the Prime Minister (Mr. Hughes). I may Bay at the outset that my point of order is not at all captious, but that I understand that many honorable members, in addition to myself, have been surprised at the sudden cessation of the debate on the Imperial Conference, and the way in which it petered out on Friday last. Having looked into the matter, I suggest to you, Mr. Speaker, that there is at least one motion still before the House having reference to the speeches made by the right honorable gentleman regarding the Imperial. Conference and kindred subjects. The Prime Minister made three separate speeches, and concluded each with a motion. “ That the paper be printed.” The third pf these motions has undoubtedly been disposed of, but I contend that the other two have nqt been disposed of in accordance with the Standing Orders. The motion as put on Friday was as follows : -

Thatthe Ministerial statement re Imperial Conference (made on the 30th September) and certain resolutions (submitted on the oth October) bo printed.

By resolution of the House it was agreed that the debate on the three statements made by the Prime Minister should be taken together, but there was nothing in that resolution to indicate that the motions were to be dealt with in the form in which they were put to the House on Friday afternoon. I respectfully suggest, therefore, that the matter of the Imperial Conference is still before the House.

Mr SPEAKER (Hon Sir Elliot Johnson:
LANG, NEW SOUTH WALES

– The only motions relating to Ministerial statements which appeared on the business-paper as Orders of the Day to be dealt with on Friday last were, “No. 1, Ministerial statement as to Washington Conference re disarmament,” &c, which, together with certain amendments, was put and disposed of, and Order of the Day No. 2, which was a motion for the printing of a paper and certain resolutions. When I called upon the honorable member who on the previous date had secured the adjournmentof the debate on that motion he rose in his place and said that it was not his intention to continue No other honorable member. Having risen to get the call from the Speaker, as in duty bound, I put the motion to the House, and it was passed. So far as the question of procedure is concerned, I think it well to explain that the only matters that I have before me are those set out on the business-paper, and that it is for the Government to arrange its business as it thinks fit. Speaking, however, from recollection and subject to correction, my impression is that, although the Prime Minister made two separate statements, he desired that they should be covered by the one motion. That is how I and the officers of the House understood the position, and that is ‘how the business was set down on the noticepaper as printed. In any case, it would be too late now to raise a point of order in regard to this matter. The time to raise it was when the matter was before the House.

page 11867

SUPPLY BILL (No. 3) 1921-22

War Pensions - Coal Trade ExportEmbargo - Company Taxation - Reportof Taxation Commission - Balance-sheets of Government Industrial Enterprises - “ Contingencies “ Expenditure - Operation ofNavigation Act - Importation and Local Manufacture of Confectionery Machinery - Dismissal of Post OfficeEmployee - Maintenance of Soldiers in Military Hospitals - Cockatoo Island : Leasing of “ Biloela “ : Case of Sheiles : Victimization- War Gratuity Bonps - Naval and Military Offences - Trade Restrictions - War Service Homes - Telephone Administration - Vocational Training Schools in Country Towns - Cashing of War Gratuity Bonds - Australian State Borrowing in America - Men of Letters Fund: Henry Lawson - Northern Territory : Administration of Justice : Representation.

In Committee of Supply:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I move -

That there be granted to His Majesty for or towards defraying the services of the year 1921- 22 a sum not exceeding £1,997,262.

Honorable members are aware that this is a Supply Bill for one month only. I know of nothing in it that is of a contentious character, but if there be any votes that need explanation I shall be glad to give it. The total sum asked for is £1,997,262. The amount now asked for, together with the amounts granted in the two Supply Bills already passed provides for the expenditure to the end of October. Provision is made for salaries payable on the 14th and 28th October. The position in regard to supply is as follows: - The total of the three Bills aggregates £9,618,065. There are special payments which should be deducted from that sum before one arrives at the ordinary normal expenditure forecast and recognised in the Supply Bill. For instance, there is an. item of £1,319,881 for interest and sinking fund payable to the British Government, and included in the last Supply Bill. Then there is the Treasurer’s Advance of £1,500,000, and arrears of overseas mails payments amounting to £200,000. These amount to £3,019,881, and if we deduct that from the £9,618,065, we have, net, £6,598,184 for the four months of the year. One-third of the annual votes for 1920-21,’ other than the special votes for Treasurer’s Advance, and interest and sinking fund due to the British Government, is £8,024,185. “ Therefore, so far as the ordinary services are concerned, this Supply Bill gives a total which is less by £1,426,101 than for the similar period in last year’s votes. The interest and sinking fund payments referred to were included in the Supply Bill No. 2, and were payable on the 30th September under the funding arrangement, which has already been presented to Parliament. The £200,000 for overseas mails was included in the first Supply Bill, and represents arrears due to the British Government in respect of mail services during the year. The present Supply Bill includes provision for four months’ expenditure on a number of relatively small items. The expenditure to date under these heads has been temporarily charged to the Treasurer’s Advance, but is now included, in Supply in order that the Treasurer’s Advance may be recouped. Apart from these items, the Supply covers the usual month’s requirements, except in a few cases where the expenditure under the vote is not payable in regular amounts each month. Sometimes we have amounts that cannot be divided into twelve monthly parts, and then the rule is to take, sa)’, & quarter or a half year as the payment has to be made. That is the case, for instance, with the pay- ment of £53,115 which is included in this Bill as payment to the South Australian Government to make good the loss on working the Port Augusta-Oodnadatta Railway. This amount is payable on the 15th October, and if it is not paid then interest will be charged until ‘the. date of payment. This arrangement is in accordance with the agreement with South Australia, which provides for the payment of the loss within one month from the date of the presentation of the balance-sheet. That is why this item is included in this Bill, under the arrangement we have with the South Australian Government. Whether the arrangement is satisfactory or not does not very much matter now; we have to pay our debt in this respect.

The Supply Bill includes several amounts under the heading of war services for the settlement of old war accounts. When we reach the Estimates honorable members will find that we are still paying war obligations. The other day I saw that a. gentleman had been writing to the newspapers and asking whether the Treasurer had forgotten that the war is over. There is no danger of the Treasurer forgetting any such salient fact. The war is over, but payments on account of the war are not, and will not be for some time to come.

Mr Richard Foster:

– Is the expenditure, under the old war accounts recurring ?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– No, I am glad to say. This Supply Bill has been kept down to purely ‘ ‘ carry -on “ votes, and I commend it “to the Committee in the hope that it will be passed as early as possible.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

Mr CHARLTON:

– I hope the Assistant Minister does not infer that if a man was crippled by rheumatism during active service his incapacity was not due to warlike operations. There are hundreds of such cases, and they should be provided for. Every man who was accepted for active service overseas, and subsequently came back genuinely incapacitated, should receive a pension according to the extent of his incapacity. If he is totally incapacitated he should get the full pension provided by the Act. The present method of administering the War Pensions Act is unsatisfactory. Hundreds of returned soldiers have been denied pensions, or have had them cancelled or reduced from the amounts they were entitled to receive. I do not say that a man who is .not entitled to a pension should be given one, but I claim that we ought to do justice to those who should legitimately receive pensions or sustenance from the Repatriation Department.

– It may be a good tiling if properly worked. I do not wish to reflect on the officer at Newcastle, but men who have spent a life-time there say that he probably had not sufficient experience of the coal trade, and that no one could properly advise the Government unless well acquainted with the trade before the war. This officer, I am told, was in business in Townsville before joining the Navy, and after a short time in the Navy was appointed to the Newcastle post. It is a pity that an embargo was placed on the Newcastle coal trade, because it has interfered with the prosperity of the district.

These are real grievances. I wish to see everything done to give justice to the returned soldiers. I pledged my word that they would be properly treated, and I wish to do my part in securing proper treatment for them.

Mr GREGORY:
Dampier

.- I do not intend to discuss the Budget, but there are one or ,two matters to which I wish to direct the attention of the Treasurer. For many years now we have been distinctly and definitely promised by the Government that balance-sheets drawn on commercial lines would be presented to Parliament in each financial year, to show the working of the business’ activities of the Commonwealth”; but so far no such balance-sheets have been submitted to us. Information of the kind to which I refer is specially needed now that the Government has embarked in the shipping business, and is expending such large sums of money in it. Parliament is justified in demanding the fullest information regarding all the business activities of the Government. Personally, I do not wish for Government interference with private industry. Governments can foster and maintain industries by giving subsidies when necessary, but the interference about which I am speaking is not beneficial. I have just returned from a visit to the north-west of “Western Australia. Every member of this Parliament desires that this continent shall be populated. Unless we develop and fill our empty spaces it will be impossible for us to retain our Territory. We cannot hold idle millions of square miles of country. But when population goes into remote districts, both the ‘Commonwealth and the State Governments should endeavour to bring it into direct touch with the markets of the world. Yet some time ago the

Government pf Western Australia embarked in the shipping business, with the result that, whereas before the war it cost from 35s. to 37s. per head to send cattle from Derby to Fremantle, it now costs £6 10s. per head on the State steamers, and £5 10s. per head on the private steamers which trade between Singapore and Western Australia. Recently, I was informed by a large pastoralist that two and a half months ago he was £200 out of pocket by sending 500 head of cattle from Derby to Fremantle, the charges he had to meet, including freight, amounting to £S 12s. per head. He lost over 500 head of cattle, and was £200 out of pocket as well. Others have assured me that it has cost them as much as £8 15s. per head to send cattle over this route. That is one instance of the. result of Government interference with private industry. This Government has been asked what it intends to do in regard to Vestey Brothers, and the question prompts me to draw attention to the Western Australian Government Meat Works at Wyndham. The Government of Western Australia has spent something like £1,200,000, including accumulated interest, on meat works at Wyndham, and further expenditure will be needed before there is sufficient storage capacity to provide a full load for any steamer that may go to Wyndham. The working losses there during last year were no less than £63.000.

Mr Richard Foster:

– Without interest ?

Mr GREGORY:

– Yes. A case like that should make us thoughtful. Then we have the report on the operations at the Cockatoo Island Dock. The loss suffered by the public through the want of. proper supervision there was very large: but things must be much worse when Government money is being expended in remote districts. I hope that the Treasurer will tell us that the most complete information will be available as to the working of the Commonwealth Line of Steamers, and other Commonwealth Government enterprises.

Questions have been asked concerning the taxation of certain companies. In 1915 it became apparent to the Government that a special examination should be made of the transactions of certain companies, and an amendment of the law was made. The Vacuum Oil Company and the British Imperial Oil Company do most of the oil business of Australia. I understand that the former have about one-third of that business, and has paid a large sum in income taxation, whereas the latter, which has two-thirds of the business, has shown a loss on its Australian transactions. We know that it is a pup of a big combination, that it is a member of a huge Combine, of the ramifications of which I have a statement. The Income Tax Assessment Act of 1914 empowered the Commissioner, if he were not satisfied with the returns submitted to him on behalf of a company, to charge 5 per cent, on the company’s business. That provision was repealed; I do not know why. These matters have been brought before the Department of the AttorneyGeneral, and especially before Sir Robert Garran some years ago. His attention has been directed to a method of doing business which seems intended to evade income taxation. .1 hope that die Treasurer will be able to tell us later what attitude the Government intend to adopt on this matter.

I agree with the Deputy Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Charlton) in what, hesaid about repatriation and pensions. I have had brought before me recently one of the worst pension cases that has comeunder my notice. I? knew the man concerned years ago, on the gold-fields of.’ Western Australia, when he was a prospector. In the early days he applied, for a reward for the discovery of a goldfield. When war broke out he enlisted,, although a married man with five children. I do not think he got into the fighting line, but he was sent away from: Australia, and returned practically demented. When I saw him he was almost, in convulsions, and a pitiable case. He was granted a pension, and, later, application was made for a permanent pension at the highest rate. The doctors were sure that they could cure him, and it was advised that he should enter a hospital for medical treatment. But, being almost insane, he was fearful of the doctors, and’ declined to go into a hospital. When I was in Perth a medical man told me that the Department were considering the advisability of stopping his pension to compel him to do so, though the Department says to-day that that is not correct. Thecorrespondence that I have seen proves. that it waa the intention of the Government to force the man into a hospital. I have here a letter from the Assistant Minister for Repatriation (Mr. Rodgers), in which, writing under date 1st November, 1920, in regard to the claim for a special rate of pension for this man, he said -

I have to advise that the Chairman of the Commission, whilst in Western Australia, arranged for a special medical examination of this applicant. Though to a layman it would appear that Mr.- is severely incapacitated, the medical officers state that he is not totally and permanently incapacitated, but are certain that he can be cured. The medical officers recommend that he be admitted to the Fremantle Hospital to undergo the necessary treatment to this end.

This man was obsessed with the idea that the doctors would only do him injury, and he declined at the time to undergo the desired treatment. On 10th November last the Assistant Minister for Repatriation wrote a further letter, in which he said -

The examination to which I referred in my previous letter was carried out by an expert physician on such cases, and I may add the Chairman of the Commission, Colonel Semmens, was present- at the examination. The medical officer in question is most emphatic in his. statement that Mr.- can be cured, and will undertake his treatment.

It is clear that up to that point the medical officers of the Department were satisfied that this was a war risk. The man had been receiving a pension for two years. The evidence shows that he- was accepted for service and sent to the Front, and that from the date of his return up to this time the departmental authorities were perfectly satisfied, as the result of medical examinations, that he was entitled to a pension. When I was in Western Australia last year, I was told that the Department was considering the advisableness of stopping the pension, so as to compel the man to submit himself to treatment in hospital. That action was taken contrary to the advice of the local branch of the Repatriation Department, and contrary to the opinion of the State Board. I am advised that they were opposed to the stoppage of the pension. Dr. Kenny recommended in his report that the patient should be left quietly at homo foi: the next twelve months, and said that he did not recommend further efforts- to induce him to submit him- self for treatment, which he now thinks “would be useless.” He was of opinion that the pension should be continued. Dr. McWhae concurred in the departmental . officers’ report, “except that ^stoppage of pension might in the course of months induce him to accept treatment. I therefore recommend stoppage of pension.” Dr. Stawell, the expert physician referred to in the Minister’s letter, stated that, in his opinion, the anti-typhoid inoculation, could not be regarded as having in any way induced or aggravated the man’s symptoms, “ for the disease must be regarded as having shown itself five years previously, and then remained latent.” This man’s wife assures me that throughout their married life he had not a day’s sickness, save that on one occasion he had an attack of influenza, and that at no time before he went away did he display any symptoms of paralysis. But because Dr. Stawell says that the disease must have been latent and that in any circumstances it would have developed in the course of a few years, this unfortunate man’s pension has been stopped.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– We could’ not have a higher authority than Dr. Stawell.

Mr GREGORY:

– But I object to any medical man theorizing on such a subject. What proof -is- there that the disease was latent in the man?

Mr Richard Foster:

– That is not the point. The point is that this man was accepted as fit for active service, and, that being so, the Department must accept responsibility for his maintenance to-day.

Mr GREGORY:

– Quite so. The Ugly Men’s Association has been helping this man and his wife, who are now living, on charity. The man is in a pitiable condition. His nervous system seems to have absolutely gone, and one could not see him without being greatly moved. Where men who were accepted as fit for service develop a disease before their final discharge, . the responsibility for providing for them, must rest with the Department. There can be no escape from that position, provided that the applicant for assistance in such circumstances has not been guilty of any SUP.pression of material facts-. I had intended to move the adjournment of the House in order to endeavour to obtain from the

Mr WATKINS:

– But, in addition, the Government imposed an embargo on one class of coal, and that interfered with the overseas trade at once. Later they imposed an embargo on the export of any coal, and so much harm has been done that the Government should seek to right it at the earliest possible moment.

In regard to the cancellation or reduction of war “pensions, I support those honorable members who have contended that the Government should accept responsibility for those men whom the military doctors certified to be medically fit when they enlisted. I make no claim -for those men who shirked their duty, but in respect of others the Government should be liable for any ailments contracted by them on account of their war services. The cases of many dissatisfied pensioners have come under my notice. I know of one man who was in perfect health and weighed 13 or 14 stone when he was accepted as fit for military service, but who returned to Australia physically affected to such an extent that he can walk only with the aid of a stick. He has three children and is living in a War Service Home. He cannot get a pension, although five independent doctors, including the one who passed him originally as fit for military -service, have certified that he is incapacitated. Of course, the reply of the Department in this case was that the man in question was not suffering from incapacity as the result of warlike operations. Another phase of the question is that of the man who, possibly through arduous training or heavy marching during the war, finds that an old injury long healed up prior to his enlistment, and not affecting him in the slightest in his pre-war occupation, has begun to cause him trouble. He was passed by the medical men as fit for service ; but in all cases where any semblance of a prior injury can be found claims for pensions have been turned down.

Mr RODGERS:
WANNON, VICTORIA · LP; NAT from 1917

– There are cases in which hardship has been inflicted, but not deliberately. The honorable member’s charge is a sweeping indictment against medical men, administrators, and every one eke. The Government do not look for a way out of paying pensions, but are guided by the medical testimony in each case.

Mr WATKINS:

– We can only speak of the cases that come before us. I do not say that the Government turn down these claims deliberately ; but all men are not as scrupulous as we would like th«m to be, and it is quite possible that even medical men who examined volunteers for enlistment, and passed them as fit for service abroad, would not say the right thing in the interests of these men, who, now that the war is over, are seeking their just dues from the Repatriation Department. Many cases of hardship and unjust treatment have come under my notice through the operation of the provision dealing with incapacity as the result of warlike operations. It is time that some new system was adopted by which justice could be done to claimants for pensions.

Mr PROWSE:
Swan

– I do not propose to discuss the Supply Bill at any length. It does not give sufficient information to enable any honorable member to do so, but the feature about it which strikes me at a casual glance is the enormous amount provided for contingencies. I estimate that 25 per cent, of the amount authorized to be expended by the Bill is represented by contingency items, and in view of the clamour throughout the Commonwealth for economy, it occurs to me that here is a very fruitful cornucopia, or means by which departmental officers can exercise extravagance. It would be interesting to know if Ministers have gone closely into these items. For instance, although we are asked to vote not more than £700 for salaries in the office of the High Commissioner, the estimated expenditure on contingencies is £3,000. Again, in the Taxation Department, although the salaries do not amount to more than £30,000, we are asked to vote the same amount for contingencies. In quite a number of cases the vote for contingencies exceeds the amount estimated to be spent on salaries. For instance, in the Invalid and Old-age Pensions Office, the expenditure upon salaries is £2,630, while the amount set down for “contingencies is £3,370. Honorable members who have been longer in the House may have a better knowledge than I have of the meaning of the word “ contingencies,” but in ordinary business life I have been accustomed to look very closely -into contingency expenditure. It is manifest that under this heading very great extravagance could occur without any person not in the particular Department spending the money being any the wiser.

This occasion affords me the opportunity of calling attention to the disability imposed by the Navigation Act upon certain portions of Australia. I had intended to move the adjournment of the House in order to bring this matter under the attention of honorable members. I wish to call special attention to the effect of the Act upon Albany and the important district of which it is the port. Albany was first settled ninety-five years ago by Captain Lockyer. It was the first portion of Western Australia occupied by white people. King George’s Sound, its harbor, is one of the finest in Australia, and for many years was the chief port of call for the mail boats running from the United Kingdom to Australia. It has always been a regular port of call for the boats of the White Star Line. Albany has no direct communication with the eastern States except by water or by a roundabout railway journey by way of Perth, but the White Star steamers made the port one of its ports of call and gave great convenience in passenger service and cargo trade with the eastern States and the United Kingdom. I could tell honorable members of the quantity of fruit, wheat, wool, and timber exported in this way, but I refrain from doing so, although I should imagine that the Committee would be interested in the progress and development of the large district which Albany serves, one nearly as extensive as the State of Victoria. I am not here to discuss the pros and cons, virtues, or otherwise, of the Navigation Act, but I want to point, out the disabilities it imposes upon Albany by taking away from it the facilities it has hitherto enjoyed. If, in order to give to our own shipping a trade which previously went to overseas vessels, this House passes legislation which deprives any part of Australia of certain facilities, it ought to see that the locality in question does not suffer. But Albany is suffering the loss of advantages it enjoyed in the past, and I am taking this opportunity of appealing to the Government to see that the port is fairly treated. It is the task of this Parliament to give every portion of Australia a chance of making progress in the industries it is endeavouring to develop. It’ is certainly not to the interest of Australia that the development of any district should suffer by reason of the operation of the Navigation Act. In the same connexion I want to allude to the centralization tendency existing in Australia to-day. Although during the last ten years the population «of Western Australia has increased by 48,000, the population of the city of Perth, the capital of the State, has increased by 51,000 in the same period. Thus Perth has not only taken the whole of the increase, but has also robbed the country districts of 3,000 persons. Can any one regard these figures with equanimity? It is a retrograde movement. Facilities should be given to other portions- of Western Australia than the central port of Fremantle. It is true that the effects of the Navigation Act on the north-western ports of Western Australia have been temporarily suspended, but for six months only. It is altogether too short a period. On such a tenure no shipping company would undertake to maintain a service to any port. ‘

Mr Burchell:

– The Navigation Act cannot be brought into operation in regard to that portion of Australia unless six months’ notice is given. That is the position.

Mr PROWSE:

– I am glad to be corrected on the point, but if is rather a slender thread >f encouragement. I hope the Government will not regard my remarks as merely hot air. The town clerk of Albany writes to me as follows: -

I have been instructed by my Council to bring under your notice the unsatisfactory steam-ship service which Albany is receiving from the Inter-State shipping companies. A boat is supposed to call at Albany once every month, inwards and outwards; but, as a matter of fact, most of . the boats anchor in King George’s Sound, and passengers have to board and bc put off by means of tender.

Why should such an old settled and industrious people be subjected to such cavalier treatment when there is a beautiful wharf at Albany at which passengers could be landed -

This state of affairs is most unsatisfactory and inconvenient to passengers, and emphasizes once more the disability which Albany is suffering through the regulations under the Navigation Act.

The member for Albany (Mr. A. Thomson) in the Western Australian Legislative Assembly has also written to- me as follows : -

I consider that, unless the Inter-Colonial steam-ship companies are prepared to give the port of Albany and this district better attention than they are doing at the present time, the Customs Department should give overseas boats the opportunity of carrying passengers and cargoes to and from that port. Aa a case in point, we are having a special stud sale, which is held every year, and which we. consider of sufficient importance justifying South Australian breeders to specially send over stud ewes and rams for that sale. Mr. Collins, a sheep breeder of South Australia, sent on the Katoomba 140 breeding ewes and rams for this stud stock sale. The Katoomba called in at Albany to drop passengers, but would not unload the stock, and the owner of these had the mortification of seeing his valuable stock carried past to Fremantle, and it meant that they were three more days and nights travelling by sea and by the train. If this is the way that the Commonwealth propose to open up and develop this State of Australia, then it is time that they considered the effect that the Navigation Act would have upon the development “of this State.

That statement seemed to me so preposterous that I telegraphed to the member for Katanning, asking if the carrying on of these stud stock was not due to some quarantine legislation of Western Australia; but I have not received a reply from him. The letter continues -

I urge you to use your influence to see that this port of Albany has better treatment than it has obtained from the steam-ship companies. I am sure that I could get a petition signed by hundreds of people in this district protesting against the effect of the Navigation Act, if the inter-colonial boats will not give us better facilities than they have done up to the present.

Mr. Cockram, of “ Fairfield,” who has imported from the eastern States valuable cattle, horses, and sheep, has been in the same unfortunate position of having to travel his stock to Fremantle and to turn back again to Broom Hill.

This is centralization with a vengeance. It occurred to me that matters might be. improved if the new Bay steamers of the

Commonwealth Line would make Albany a port of call, and I wrote to the Government on the subject, getting the following reply :-

With reference to’ the copy of letter addressed to the Minister for Trade and Customs, which you forwarded to me, with a request that arrangements be made for vessels of the Commonwealth Line to call at Albany on their voyages to and from the United Kingdom, I regret to inform you that it will not be possible for the new Bay steamers, which will shortly inaugurate a regular monthly service- between the United Kingdom and Australia, to call at this port, as these vessels will be running to a strict time-table.

To me that is not a satisfactory answer. The White Star steamers called regularly at Albany, and they were running to a strict time-table. There is a fair amount of trade to be done at that port, and the Government would reduce the national debt more quickly than by conjuring with figures and transferring money from one pocket to another if they give more consideration to matters of this kind.

The honorable member for Dampier (Mr. Gregory) has spoken of the delay in the bringing up of the report of the Taxation Commission. The Commission’s inquiry resembles Nero’s fiddling while Rome was burning. I know of primary producers who pay in income taxation ?3 to every ?1 paid by otherindividuals whose average income is the same, and I am glad to think that retrospective legislation is . contemplated to remedy the grievance of those who suffer under the present arrangement. I am satisfied that the combined intelligence of Australia is capable of evolving a fairer and more British adjustment of citizen responsibilities in the matter of taxation than has hitherto prevailed.

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:
Wakefield

– Honorable members know that I would hot dream of putting; my knowledge of coal matters in comparison with those of the honorable member for Hunter (Mr. Charlton), who for a lifetime has been connected with the coal business, ‘and knows it from A to Z; but some of his statements this afternoon seem to me not quite fair. I do not speak now as an apologist for the Government ; but I refer to this matter because what was said was to some extent a reflection on a Committee on which, in company with the honorable member for Newcastle (Mr. Watkins) I acted for about nine months.

That Committee spent many days in the taking of the evidence of ‘ experts in the coal trade, concerning both the operation of the mines and the shipping of’ coal. There has never been a total prohibition of exportation. While serving on the Committee, I was as active as any one in trying to provide that the export trade in coal should be considered, as far as that could be done, consistently with the supplying of Australia’s demand for coal. A restriction on exportation was imposed originally at the instance of the Committee, and the restrictions developed as the Committee’s inquiry proceeded. Honorable members will recollect that at the, time every part of Australia was demanding that the Commonwealth Government should do something to increase the supply of coal for local consumption. Some of the State railways had not sufficient coal for more than three weeks’ working, and all of them, except the New South Wales system, were exceedingly short, and in mortal dread of trouble.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Important industries in Melbourne were within a week of stopping.

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:
WAKEFIELD, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · ANTI-SOC; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917; LP from 1922; NAT from 1925

– I was going to add that industries, particularly in Victoria - because the shortage of coal was felt industrially more heavily in this State than in any other - were being crippled, and that ordinary domestic consumers of electric light, gas, and coal fuel were having to submit to irritating and hurtful restrictions. This condition of things obtained everywhere except in New South Wales, and it. was the business of the Committee to make recommendations for the improvement of the situation. So far as my knowledge goes, the Government did what was asked of it, and no more. I admit that the exportation of coal from a part of the Newcastle coalfield was absolutely prohibited. That was because the coal from that area was needed for the railways. A good deal is to be said for the forbearance of the coalowners, while the export trade was being limited, because orders were crowding in on them from abroad at prices double what they were getting in Australia, and the New Zealand price was not much higher than the Australian price.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Some of the coalowners in the Maitland field had their coal commandeered by the Government at 21s. per ton, and were buying Bore Hole coal at 30s. per ton to maintain their connexions oversea.

Mr Charlton:

– There is no justification for the killing of the trade.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– The trade was not killed.

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:

– The Go.vernment did no more than was demanded of it by the condition of the State railways, of private industries, and of domestic users of coal. ‘I do not know of any unjustifiable restriction that was imposed.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I have entirely removed the restrictions; but it has been attempted to make it appear that a restriction on export which lasted about three weeks did all the damage about which there has been complaint. That is pure nonsense.

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:

– I regret exceedingly any damage to the export trade by the loss of customers, but I do not think that the Government is to blame for it.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Export trade is being lost to Newcastle because coal can be obtained much more cheaply elsewhere.

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:

Mr Bamford:

– Can the Minister say where MacRobertson obtains the machinery which is installed in his factory at Fitzroy ? ‘

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

– I cannot say whether that machinery was imported or made by MacRobertson, but when we are satisfied that a machine can be made in this country we never allow any remission of duty. If, on the contrary, we are satisfied that the machinery cannot be made locally, and a definite request is made to us for its admission free of duty, we make full inquiry, and then put item 174 in operation as Parliament intended and empowered us to do. The honorable member for Melbourne Ports (Mr. Mathews) represented that in some circumstances the operation of item 174 might appear to give a preference to one person over another. To some extent that is inevitable in the operation of the Tariff. One manufacturer might have established his works in 1914 when there was no duty on the- machinery he imported. Today another manufacturer, establishing the same class of factory, and importing the same machinery, may have to pay a heavy duty. Either by the imposition of duties or removal’ of them . it must frequently happen in the course of years that one party has to pay duty whilst a competitor has not. v

Mr Hector Lamond:

– Where the Customs officials have to decide upon an application they should certainly take into account the fact that the applicant’s competitors have paid the duty.

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

– That depends. If it is shown definitely that this particular class of machinery is not made in Australia, and the Minister decides that under those circumstances it should be admitted free of duty, I do not think he should take into consideration the fact that in days gone by some other person may have paid duty. If he were to enter into considerations of that kind the duty could never be lifted from a particular article. The operation of item 174 is very complex, and I have asked Parliament to relieve me from the responsibility of its administration by the creation of an Advisory Board; but we have tried to do what is right, and ~I am satisfied that it will be found on a full investigation of the whole of the circumstances, that in this instance the Department has not erred.

Mr PROWSE:
Swan

.- When I was speaking this afternoon, I referred . to the disability suffered by Albany owing to the operation of the Navigation Act. I read correspondence to show that, whilst the Katoomba landed passengers at Albany, stud stock that was being imported for the adjacent district was not landed, but was carried on to Fremantle, and thence railed over 200 miles to its destination. I further said that this action was too preposterous to be allowed by any Government to continue ; so I wired to the honorable member for Katanning in the State Parliament, who had reported the circumstances to me, and asked him if it was not through some State quarantine legislation that the stock were not allowed to land ‘before examination. I have received this reply ‘

Understand Katoomba only accepts passengers for Albany. Quarantine nothing to do with position. Writing.

That means that the shipping firm will only undertake to land passengers by tender, and will not go alongside the jetty to land stock, but prefers to carry them on to Fremantle, and delay their arrival at their destination by three or four days. That is the way our rural industries are developed. I bring this matter under the notice of the Government in the hope that if they are giving any preference to local shipping firms under the Navigation Act they will see that those firms provide the facilities which are necessary for the development of Australia.

Mr WEST:
East Sydney

.- The Victorian confectionery manufacturer to whom the honorable member for Melbourne Ports (Mr. Mathews) referred was unable during the war to obtain machinery models from abroad, and started his own workshop at considerable expense. He made his own models, and purchased lathes and other machinery at high prices in order to supply Australia’s requirements of confectionery. It has been stated that the other firm which is now importing machinery made inquiries in Australia, and discovered that the class of machinery required was not manufactured in the” Commonwealth. Machinery makers, who were able to make these machines have denied that any such inquiry was made of them. It might not be thought that confectionery business requires a large engineering establishment, and honorable members may be surprised to learn that the pattern makers, turners, fitters, and others employed in the production of machinery by the Fitzroy firm number fifty-two. It is a serious thing for the Department to give one firm advantages over its competitors. MacRobertson is not the only confectioner who is affected by the concession that has been given to Cadbury. It seems that an error has occurred through mismanagement. If a person required a, sewing machine he should not be entitled to import one under item 174 simply because the machine made in Australia was not the brand which he preferred. It is the height of stupidity to say that there is anything so complicated that it cannot be made’ in Australia. Such a statement is an insult to the industrial and professional sections of the community. Of course, departmental officers, like all other human beings, are likely to err, but I hope that in the future nothing of the kind will happen and that thorough inquiry will be made by officials as to whether the machinery required can be made in Australia before they permit it to be imported free of duty.

I desire to refer to a matter in regard to which I have been able to obtain no satisfaction. About eighteen months ago a man was appointed to the postal service as a temporary employee, and after serving, apparently to the satisfaction of the Department, he was . dismissed without rhyme or reason. It was discovered that he was the father of six children and that under the basic wage award he was entitled to an increased payment on that account. The Government sacked him on the day following that discovery, and a returned soldier was appointed to the vacancy. I know, a good deal of the spirit that animates returned soldiers, “and I do not Relieve that any of them desire to put out of work a man who has six children to support. I hope that the Postmaster-General will see that no other cases of a similar character occur in his Department. I tin der stand that any person who wishes to export metalliferous ores or concentrates must do so through the Metal Producers Association, and make a sworn declaration as to the consignees overseas.. This information is supposed to be secret, but, nevertheless, the purchasers abroad frequently .find that certain people in London are fully informed of the fact that they have bought this material, and they are told that if they attempt to make any f further purchases from Australia they will be prevented from doing so. I want to know how this information, which is supposed to be kept a close secret here, can get abroad in this way, where it can be made use of to the disadvantage of purchasers of pur ores? The Broken Hill Proprietary are the principal members of the association here, in fact, they practically control it. Evidently their monopoly of the metal products of Australia is not sufficient to satisfy their gluttonous wants, and they are seeking to extend their control to the other side of the world. At any rate, if the Government compel these sworn declarations to be made, they ought at least to see that the information supplied is kept a close secret. I shall not occupy any time now in commenting upon the stupid blundering of the Treasurer (Sir Joseph Cook) in his conduct of the issue of the recent Diggers’ loan. The cost of the flotation was tremendous. However, I shall deal with that matter upon the Budget.

Mr HECTOR LAMOND:
Illawarra

– I want to emphasize some remarks I made on the adjournment of the House the other day in reference to the cases of soldiers who have been refused the maintenance given to soldiers in military hospitals, because military medical men have sent them to military wards in civilian hospitals. For a long time I have tried to get a hearing for these men’s claims, but the responsible Ministers tell me that the matter has been made one for Cabinet decision, and that the decision is adverse to the men. I fail utterly to understand how Cabinet could have arrived at such a decision. No. 4 Military Hospital at Randwick having become filled, provision had to be made elsewhere for patients. Accordingly an arrangement was made with the Prince Alfred Hospital, a public institution’ in Sydney, so that a ward could be set aside for military patients. The men selected to be sent to that hospital were the very worst cases at Randwick at the time. They were the men who had come back from the war unfitted to fight the battle of life. It was quite natural that these men who had suffered most by their devotion to the cause of their country should expect to bs treated in exactly the same way as they would have been treated had they remained at Randwick, but they found themselves deprived of privileges enjoyed by patients in military hospitals who went later to the war, and came back with less injuries. I cannot understand how patriotic men, looking at a case of this kind, could take up the attitude Cabinet has taken in regard to it. These men have every claim to the treatment meted out to those in military hospitals. There is nothing to differentiate- between them and the patients in the Randwick Military Hospital, except the fact that they were sent to a military ward in a hospital a few thousand yards away. It is pathetic to have these men approaching one in the condition of these sufferers. They are deprived of the opportunity of earning the livelihood they had before they enlisted. They have suffered the highest degree of penalty in the service of their country. Their claims upon us are greater than are many we have recognised since the war, and I appeal again to Cabinet to reconsider their position, and at least do justice to those who, by direction of the military doctors, have been compelled to leave military hospitals and go to military wards in civilian hospitals.

Mr LAZZARINI:
Werriwa

.- I am sorry I cannot agree with the statement of the honorable member for Kalgoorlie (Mr. Foley) that the Government are out to do justice to returned soldiers. My experience has been that very often the Government have done everything but , justice to many soldiers whose cases have come under my notice. I could give many specific instances which have led me to come to that conclusion, but to-day I shall refer only to one with which I have been dealing for the last twelve months. It is the case of Private McDougall, of Hilltop, near Mittagong. I am not sure whether he was married before or after his period of service, but he has now a wife and a baby twelve months old. Immediately he came back from France he was granted a pension, and it was paid to him for a while. However, he was taken ill, in fact, his life was despaired of, and just at that time, when the wife was agitated and disturbed about whether the life of the husband would be saved, an edict went forth from the Repatriation Department to the effect that the pension had been cancelled. The Department knew the circumstances of the case, and surely common humanity would have dictated a better time for letting the axe fall. The man eventually recovered a little, but he is to-day a helpless invalid. The only means of sustenance he and his family have are the possible earnings of the wife, who has also to nurse a sick husband back to health and look after her baby. If this is the way in which the Government propose to treat returned soldiers, they are not only false to the promises they made to the men prior to enlistment, but are also failing to act according to the dictates of common humanity. I went to the Department in connexion with this case. I wrote numerous letters. I was told that Private McDougall had received every consideration. I then wrote to the Minister, and finally I was told that it was of no use my proceeding any further in the matter, because the medical testimony was that the man had not contracted his illness from war-like operations, but had the germs of the complaint from which he is suffering in his. system prior to enlistment. I ascribe the action of the Department to the attempt on the part of some one to cheese-pare. Some one is endeavouring to economize in repatriation expenditure so that the money thus saved may be spent in another direction. While the Government is cheese-paring and depriving men of their rights, it proposes to spend immense sums on armaments and military preparations. It proposes to spend nearly £1,000,000 more on the preparation for the killing and maiming of men, and yet allows other men who fought in defence of their country to remain helpless in sickness, and will not put forth a hand to help them. I have brought before the Department the case of a hopeless invalid whose wife has to nurse him while trying to earn a living for him and for their child. This man received a pension for a time, when he could do a little work, but it was stopped when he was stricken with illness and almost at death’s door. His is a case which carries absolute condemnation of the Government’s treatment of returned soldiers. Obviously the direction has gone to the Repatriation Department to cut down useless expenditure wherever it can.

Mr MAHONY:
Dalley

.- The first matter about which I shall speak is the need for doing something for Mr. Henry Lawson, the greatest writer whom Australia has yet produced. I think that we might well stretch a point to help this man now that he is sick and in trouble. I need not speak of Henry Lawson’s work. His writings are familiar in every household throughout Australia, and well known to the world at large, but he himself lies in poverty and sickness in a public hospital near Sydney. Mr. Lawson draws £1 a week from the Australian Men of Latters Fund, but the Minister in charge of that fund, in answer to a question asked to-day by the honorable member for Darling (Mr. Blakeley), said that the allowance could not be increased because the fund was practically all allotted. I do not question the truth of the reply, but in view of the services that Henry Lawson has rendered to Australia in literature and art, the least we can do is to provide him with the necessaries of life now that he is practically down and out. I think that the Commonwealth should see that he is given an income sufficient to maintain him in decency.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Has he no income from his books?

Mr MAHONY:

– No ; he, has nothing but the allowance that I have just mentioned. Lawson has given of his best to Australia, and has done much to place Australian sentiment on a high level. His writings have advertised this country throughout the world. I am not mentioning this matter by way of finding fault with Ministers; but I urge the Government to do something for this unhappy genius.

Mr FOLEY:

– Does he get anything’ from the New. South Wales Government?

Mr MAHONY:

– No. We should not dispute as to the obligation of this or some other Government towards him. What we have to remember is that a brilliant Australian litterateur is in trouble, and the Commonwealth should stretch out its hand to help him.

Mr Poynton:

– Do you suggest any amount ?

Mr MAHONY:

– No. It is not a case for bargaining. I feel sure that my suggestion will be received sympathetically by the honorable gentleman and by the Treasurer. I hope that Australia, at least, will see that her literary men when sick and in trouble are not left uncared for, as the geniuses of many countries have been in the past. Not a few of those whose works and names the world now holds in the highest honour were allowed by their fellow countrymen almost to die in the gutter.

– For the information of the honorable member (Mr. Mahony), and of honorable members who have heard him, I propose to read section 6 of the War Gratuities Act, which sets forth that a war gratuity shall not be payable in respect of the services of any of the following persons: -

A war gratuity shall not be payable in respect of the service of any of the following persons: -
1. A person absent without leave who has not, prior to the commencement of this Act, surrendered or been apprehended ;
2. a person who is proved to the satisfaction of a prescribed authority to have suffered from wounds intentionally self-inflicted;
3. a person who is serving, or has served, a sentence of penal servitude, imprisonment or detention, at the expiration of which he has been, or is to be, discharged from the Forces with ignominy, or for misconduct;
4. a person who, by reason of a sentence of penal servitude, imprisonment, or detention imposed while on the voyage or in a training camp or dep6t, was unable to join his unit in the field;
5. a person who has, upon conviction by court martial or by a civil Court, received a ‘sentence of imprisonment with hard labour for not less than one year, or any greater sentence, unless the sentence expired or was remitted before the 11th day of November, 1918, or has been suspended and the suspension has” not been revoked;
6. ) a person who has been discharged from the Forces with ignominy or for misconduct; and
7. a person who has been cashiered, dismissed, or discharged’ from the Forces, or whose services have been dispensed with, for any disciplinary reason or misconduct which, in the opinion of the prescribed authority, renders him undeserving of a war gratuity.

– Yes; that is because the railways are better managed in America than in Australia. The fact is, however, that despite the Government’s interference, Australia can put coal on the boat for export as cheaply ‘as can any country in the world t quality for quality, and if the Government will leave the industry alone we can defy competition. The only reason why I speak on this subject to-day is that I wish to remove the idea that there are only two points of view in regard to Coal, and those two points of view must depend on the class to which the speaker belongs. The coal question is a wide and broad one, and our minds should no more represent the men than the owners. The two interests are, in their broad issue, one. The influences that tend to the increased production of coal make for the benefit of both -owners and miners. ‘I deprecate the cross firing which took place this afternoon, one member speaking only for the men - a position into which he was driven - and another member speaking only on behalf of the owners, thus antagonizing the two interests, which, if they work together, will make Australia one of the greatest coal producing countries in the world. But while the Government interfere and antagonisms between miners and owners are fostered in this House and throughout the country, we shall have little chance of exploiting the enormous wealth of coal which, is awaiting development.

In this Chamber I have often mentioned various complaints concerning returned soldiers, and when I have spoken on general principles I have been told that there are so many individuals to deal with that there must be individual complaints, and that merely general complaints lead nowhere. I shall to-night deal with individual complaints by quoting two letters that are fair samples of those I receive every mail. These cases are not isolated; there are scores, hundreds, and almost thousands of them. The first letter relates to an application for a War Service Home, and is as follows : -

Dear Sir, - I would like to know if you could give a little assistance in the matter of my application for a War Service home. I will just state my case, and if you think it a genuine grievance I would esteem it a favour if you could give me a help along with my application. Last October, I sent in an application for a War Service home. I filled in my application under the mortgage system. Under that system one has to guarantee 10 per cent, of the* £800 made available under the Act. - I explained in my application that I would give to the War Service Homes Commissioner my £50 15s. gratuity bond and a £50 war bond as my 10 per cent, deposit. I also sent in a memorandum of transfer, plan, and a certificate granted, by the Scone Shire of the block of land I have bought. I was in Sydney a month after I sent in my application, and called at the War Service Homes Office. I was taken to a gentleman there, and we both went over the application. He told me that my gratuity bond and the price of the land, which is £50, would stand for my de- posit, and that my f 50 war bond was not required. He also informed me that my application was marked urgent, and that I was to go back home and everything would be along in due course. Later on, a gentleman came along to see my block of land, for which I had to pay£1 ls. I did not hear any more for a long time, and I wrote the Department again, but was told that my application would not come forward again until after 27th July. My father was in Sydney, so I told him to call and see what they were doing in the matter. They informed him that I was first on the list after 27th July. About two months ago, the Department sent me along the memorandum of mortgage forms to get signed, and I was to send on my gratuity bond, which I did. I also paid another bill for £4 63. Altogether, the War Service Homes Commissioner has received from me £5 7s., plus my bond for £51 15s., and up till the present I have received nothing. I have paid rates amounting to 3s.9d. to the Scone Shire. At present, I am living in Aberdeen, paying 10s. a week for a house, and as I am working with my father on Blairmore Limited it is not very handy to my work. By the month of DecemberI will have paid in rent £26, and am no nearer to getting my application dealt with.

That letter is typical. I receive similar letters in dozens, and sometimes scores. The second letter refers to a war pension, and it reads : -

Dear Sir. - I have been instructed to write you concerning the case of a returned soldier, J. E. Gleeson. Considerable correspondence through the Eeturned Sailors and Soldiers’ Imperial League of Australia has taken place. He has been examined again, and the net result - his pension raised 6d., and his wife’s reduced the same amount. Local people who know this man well, and the local Eeturned Soldiers’ League, are of opinion that this man should be in receipt of half-pension rates. In conversation with the local Government doctor, he informed me that the trouble with this man is a form of sciatica and rheumatism caused through the action of malaria on the sciatic nerve. He is a bushman by trade, sleeper cutter, anything in the timber line, and a genuine worker when able, as his fellow workers have told me. He is able to work at intervals at present, but a little while’ back done nothing but lie on his back three months out of six, and I understand he is classed as entitled to one-tenth pension. I guess the man who was entitled to a full pension in comparison would be dead about three times over. This man has bought a piece of land at Warnervale, about 3 miles further on. Tradespeople and other local people held a couple of socials to raise funds to keep his payments going. He has had no assistance from the Repatriation Department. He has a wife and child.

That letter is also typical of cases which so excite the sympathy of the local people that they go to the trouble of raising funds by concerts and other means. Yet these men, who undoubtedly suffer war disabilities, are being refused a reasonable rate of pension. I ask the Minister to make a note of these cases, but I draw attention to the fact that these things are happening every day and all over Australia. The cause of the trouble is beyond our ability to determine. One is constantly battling for these cases and, in respect of the majority, is ultimately successful. But it takes a long time to get justice, and meanwhile the soldiers, and often their wives and children, are in dire distress.

Mr Marr:

– We should not have to take action.

Mr FLEMING:

– We should not. The whole process should be automatic These men should be receiving at least something of what they were promised before they went to the front. What hurts me most is that not only are the men suffering, but their unfortunate wives and children are in distressing circumstances. In the different cities of the Commonwealth women have come to me with tears running down their faces to tell me of the trouble they have been experiencing. Some of them are women who have been well reared and desire to rear their children well and give them a proper start in life, in recognition of the circumstances in which they were born and the traditions of their fathers. Some of these women, with their children, are living on money that was left them by deceased soldier relatives and parents. Others are almost starving, and their circumstances are such as to make a man feel ashamed of his country. I have put before the Treasurer a suggestion which has found favour with the Soldiers’ Leagues throughout the Commonwealth, that something should be done to help women who are unable to earn a living. Nobody wants the total spent in pensions te be increased, but we desire it to be allocated in a proper manner. There are some people drawing a pension who, though they have a right to it, have no need for it. The pensions voted by Parliament are sufficient, but the allocation of them is all wrong. The only way to meet the situation - and this suggestion has the approval of soldiers generally - is that the widow should be given a pension, in much the same way as disabled soldiers are, according to their disability to earn a living. It does not matter -whether the woman be the widow of an officer or a private, if her upbringing has been such that she is unable to earn a living, or if she is prevented by the care of small children from doing so, that fact should be considered a disability. Many of these women are working themselves to death in trying to earn a living for themselves and their children. They are going through commercial schools in an endeavour to equip themselves to fight the battle of life, in many cases having to neglect their children to do so. In other cases they have widowed mothers, sick brothers and sisters to care for. All these things come. under our notice every day. The only way in which the Government can adequately meet the situation is by recognising inability to earn a living. I admit that it is difficult to draft a perfect scheme, but surely it is easy enough to formulate one which would be an improvement upon the present system.

Mr Maxwell:

– By giving larger discretionary powers?

Mr FLEMING:

– The discretionary powers of the Deputy Commissioners are already fairly adequate, but the trouble is that there is a screw loose somewhere, and an overseeing eye is required to see that matters are put right. It is a difficult task, no doubt, to exercise proper care over a, matter which has so many ramifications, but we are sent to this Parliament to ‘do big work. If there is a job to be done, there ought to be some one to do it. This trouble can be overcome; but, unless Ministers and honorable members generally rise to the occasion and remove this disability from these women and children, and meet their crying wants, Australia will be everlastingly disgraced through failing to honour the obligations cast upon her by the war.

Mr MARR:
Parkes

.- This afternoon the Deputy Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Charlton) was absolutely correct when he said that when appeals were lodged by returned soldiers against the. decisions of medical men, it was simply a question of appealing from Caesar to Caesar. I have had many cases in proof of his contention ‘brought, under my notice, and one I propose to place before honorable members. A tram driver returned from the war suffering from neurasthenia. On his discharge he returned to his pre-war occupation ; but the officials of the Tramways Department in Sydney, considering that it was not in the best interests of the safety of the public that a man suffering from his ailment should act as the driver of a. tram, found him a minor position of cleaner. However, later on his health broke down, and he was sent to a nerve hospital at Five Dock. ‘ I have had this man’s case ‘ before the Department for a long while, without getting any satisfaction, and I propose to read portions of one communication I received from it.

Sir Granville Ryrie:

– The question is whether he was discharged as fit. If a man is discharged as fit, it is very hard to say that any subsequent sickness is due to war disabilities. There are many such cases.

Mr MARR:

The man is suffering from tuberculosis. He brought to his war service a most robust constitution. There has been no other case of tuberculosis ih his family; the family history being a good one. When he became a soldier, he was a strong young man in the prime of life. The statement continues -

In the latter part’ of 1915 I was transferred to Rabaul, and was regularly treated for cough. This continued until well into 1916, when definite symptomatic chest pains manifested^ themselves. I saw Major, or Captain, Mahaffey, medical officer, who examined me, stating that I was in a very low state of health, suffering from influenza and malaria. He prescribed for me. I was a bed patient for about ten days. In November, 1916, I was sent to Australia on furlough. A few days out from Sydney I took bad again. Had a recurrence ‘of malaria. Wired BrigadierGeneral Pethebridge that my health was no better, and he wired back my discharge on 5th January, 1917.

During 1917 I hod several- attacks of malaria, and the cough never left me. I was engaged with Messrs. Goldsbrough, Mort, & Co. Ltd., Bourke-street,’ and was many times absent from duty through illness. The head of my deportment (Mr. .Quinlan) asked me why I ‘did not get a pension. I said to him, as to many others, that while I was able to work I could not conscientiously take a pension. I thought T would leave that tq the blind and -maimed.

I have no doubt that he could then have established his claim to a pension with much greater ease than he could subsequently, but merely because of- a spirit of sportsmanship and generosity he withheld his claim at the time -

About February, J918, I was examined by Dr. Brown, of Windsor, whose certificate is said to be on the file with my papers; and I. now furnish another certificate by the same doctor.

Early in 1919 I was seriously ill with cold and chest trouble, which continued- more or less till Juno, 1919, when I was laid aside definitely with pneumonic influenza, attended by Dr. Brown.

In June of the present year I was taken to the Caulfield Hospital suffering from the old trouble.

While getting convalescent I applied for sustenance allowance, and, as I told Dr. (Major) Irving, I was refused on the ground that my state of health was not due to war service. Major Irving expressed surprise, and said, in the presence of Sister- , “ That is all nonsense,” or words to that effect, and - ‘he added, “ I will see Colonel Fetherston.- -.Put - ‘s name. down,” which Sister.-!- . - did.

A month later Major Irving expressed the opinion to me that no medical authority could say that my lungs were not affected while I was away on active service. I am informed that my fileshows, and it is a fact, that Dr. Derham, of Preston, gave a certificate to the Repatriation Department to the effect that my complaint was due to, or aggravated by, war service.

While being examined early this year by (I believe) theChairman of the Gratuity Board, this gentleman remarked to me, “ The truth is that your medical history has been lost or mislaid.”

With regard to the letter which Senator Millen wrote to Mr. Brennan, M.P., dated 28th July, 1921, it is true that Dr. Brown’s certificate referred particularly to the illness in’ 1919, but, as will be seen from his later certificate, he does not suggest that the condition had not an earlier origin. There is no doubt that it had an earlier origin, having regard to the fact that there is no history of tuberculosis in our family on cither side, and that I brought into war operations a strong constitution, and that of -my own knowledge I contracted severe colds,- with consequential pains, under conditions of extraordinary hardship in Rabaul

Dear Sir, - You are probably aware that this school has for the past three years been training returned soldiers–

I may say that both these schools are under the Victorian Education Department, but that the Repatriation Department makes provision for them to be carried on as vocational training schools for returned soldiers -

At the present time there are ten soldiers attending the woodwork class, four of whom are married men, and they have all received notification of transfer to the training school at Wirth’s Park.

I may say that tho Maryborough men have received orders to be transferred to some school at Collingwood, which, I have no doubt, is an exceedingly good ono. The letter continues -

The men approached the council of this school yesterday, and complained that this would entail great hardship, for the following reasons: -

The single men state that on £2 2s. per week they would find it impossible to live in Melbourne, and tbo married men, although they receive 25s. extra, find themselves in the mme predicament.

Four of these men are married -

They state that, being able to live at home in Daylesford, just enables them to make ends meet.

The council of the school has gone into this matter to see whether the country would be running into any more expense by continuing to train the men here till work is found for them.

One of the most frivolous excuses put forward by the Department is that the transfer will lead to a saving of expenditure.

– Then the Treasurer should not close vocational schools in the country, and drag the students into the city. However, the letter goes on to say -

The expense of running the class is made up as follows: - Instructor’s salary, £6 a week, and cost of raw material. To offset against this, the Department would incur an extra expenditure of £5 a week to reimburse the married’ men,’ and they would have the same outlay approximately for raw material. As a matter of fact, the material costs the Department very little here, as we do so many outside jobs that sometimes no expense iB incurred for the month. We have on hand sufficient outside work to keep the men employed, with, no expenses to the Department, for another month.

That is. the position at Daylesford and at Maryborough. These men received notice about two days before tho end’ of September that they were to abandon their homes - and report themselves at Wirth’s Park and in Collingwood on 10th October. With great difficulty I succeeded in persuading the Department .to - postpone the removal until Monday next. I have just been in the constituency, and - 1 am .sorry to say that, in consequence of the action of the Department, taken without consulting either myself, as the local member, of. . anybody thoroughly familiar with the local conditions, these vocational schools have been closed. I should like to read an extract from, a letter, dated the 10th inst., which I received today from Mr.. La Gerche, the Principal of the Maryborough Technical School, in which he says -

Since I saw you :in St. Arnaud matters have become more complicated. The Education Department, having received notice from the Repatriation officials that the wood-work classes were about to be closed, terminated the period: of employment of the instructor as from the 15th inst. That gentleman has accepted this notice as final, and refuses to change his mind on the subject.

That is from Maryborough. When I arrived at the House this afternoon, I received the following telegram from Daylesford -

Instructor leaving school this month. Deputation abandoned.

I cannot understand the Treasurer’s objection to one of the Australian States going to America to borrow money. I well remember that financial genius, Mr. King O’Malley, the father of the Commonwealth Bank, drawing my attention to the fact thirteen years ago, that money was being borrowed by the City of New York at 2 per cent. when the Bank of England rate was3½ per cent. Why should objection be raised to Australia borrowing in New York when the Motherland itself and France resorted there for money in their hour of need ? It is a matter for regret that Sir Robert Philp, Sir Alfred Cowley, and Mr. Walsh should have gone to England to form a cabal there with the purpose of preventing their State, which has perhaps morepotentialities than has any other State of the Commonwealth, from raising money in the Old Country. However, New York offered it, and it is but another instance of the bond of affection between the two great English-speaking nations of the world. There are more English-speaking people living under the Stars and Stripes than live under the Union Jack.However, I want to know why the citizens of Australia, who put their savings in the State Savings Banks or in the Commonwealth Bank, cannot draw interest equal to that which we pay the foreign moneylenders. The honorable member for Capricornia (Mr. Higgs) will never forget an interesting interview I had with Sir Denison Miller some years ago. If the Governor of the Commonwealth Bank carries out what he has indicated he has in his mind, his name will be handed down to posterity as that of one of the greatest men the world has produced. The Daily Echo contains a very interesting account of an interview with Mr. Scott, the publisher of the Circulating Sovereign, showing that Sir Denison Miller informed a deputation that he was prepared to finance the settlement of Australia to the extent of £350,000,000. This is the interview-

Our representative called on Mr. Scott and asked him was he willing to give particulars of his interview with Sir Denison Miller, and any other details which should be made public.

Mr. Scott said “He was only too willing, and he had been wondering which newspapers would be enterprising and truly patriotic enough to want to give publicity to that upon which certain papers had apparently decided to bc silent. We seem to live in an age when deliberate misleading of the people, or deliberate suppression of the truth, is the practice of our powerful newspapers,” said Mr. Scott, “but the truth will out, and I often wonder what would happen if the people realized only half of what goes on. However, to get back to the object of your interview. I suppose the matter really dates back to 1903, the year the little book The Circulating Sovereign was published, and it all seems wonderful, when one looks back and thinks of one occurrence after another in connexion with that book and its history. But to come to ‘things now.’ Let us start in March of this year. Two of us, both members of the Australian Labour- Party, and both good citizens,” he said, “in spite of that fact, arranged with the Lord .Mayor to call a public meeting in the Sydney Town Hall, and invited the heads of banks and industries to give advice on the unemployed problem, A committee was formed at that meeting, which included Sir Joseph Carruthers, the late T. J. Ryan, M.H.K., J. H. Catts, M.H.B., myself, and others. At” the first committee meeting I spoke on the advisability of calling on Sir Denison Miller, as he, having full control of the money power of Australia, had the power to solve the unemployed problem if the people really wished it.”

I am sure that the honorable member for Capricornia will agree that Sir Denison Miller has almost unlimited powers - “ Sir Joseph Carruthers suggested that a call on our own bank would be a slight on members of Parliament, so out of deference to Sir Joseph’s high rank the matter was dropped at that meeting.” “ Why did Sir Joseph not want the call made, and why should members of Parliament be considered’!1” interjected our representative. “ I don’t know why,” said Mr. Scott, “ but I am inclined to be of the opinion that if the public (never mind about Sir Joseph and others) were really in earnest over the unemployed question, that no barrier would be placed against anything being done that should be done. The whole question lies in the honesty and earnestness of public thought, and now to produce that public thought is a question.” . . “ An important suggestion like the call on our Commonwealth Bank could not be allowed to be dropped even if Sir Joseph , Carruthers and others holding high positions in the land were afraid of the idea. Several were spoken to, but the answers they gave ran: * Sir’ Denison would not see us,’ or ‘What’s the use?’ or ‘He would only turn us down,’ or ‘He hasn’t any power, he has to do what Sir Joseph Cook says he must,’ or some other equally useless reply.”

Honorable members may recall the reply given to me in this House when the Trea surer stated that Sir Denison Miller had full control of the Commonwealth Bank -

In July, a public meeting was held in Martin-place, and on Thursday, 7th July, at 3.30 p.m., myself and Messrs. J. K. Powell, Geo. Waite, H. S. Cohen, H. Pritchard, W. C. Atkinson, S. J. Humphries, and A. G. Huie waited on Sir Denison Miller at our Commonwealth Bank. How many of the deputation were Australian Labour Party members ? “ our representative asked. Mr. Scott said, ‘ “Five; and I hope all good Australian citizens. I am one, and the others are G. Waite H. S. Cohen, H. Prichard, and S. J. Humphries, but what has that to do with it? . . . Sir Denison Miller received us just as a good Australian might be expected to receive a deputation of citizens. Two lady shorthand writers from the Bank staff were present, and recorded what happened. Each deputationist spoke to Sir Denison the thoughts that each had. I was not interested in academic problems. We had certain machinery in existence, and I wanted an acknowledgment from Sir Denison of the power of that financial machinery, and an expression also from him of his willingness or otherwise to use the power already existing. I asked, ‘ What is the power of the Commonwealth Bank to finance Australia? ‘ He said, ‘ This Bank is just as powerful as the Australian Commonwealth is.’ I said, ‘Sir Denison, you did finance Australia for £350,000,000 for war purposes, and had the war continued you could have financed it to another £350,000,000 for war. Is that not so?’ Sir Denison replied, That was the case.’ ‘Then Sir Denison,’ I said, ‘are you prepared to finance Australia for £350,000.000 for productive purposes’ He replied, ‘Yes, I will do my best.’ I said, Thank you, Sir Denison, that is the point.’ I wrote down what had occurred, and read it back to Sir Denison, stating at the time that I only wanted what- he would indorse, as the matter would be made public, and he replied, I will indorse that.’” “A pretty big deal that,” risked our representative. “Yes,” Mr. Scott remarked, ‘this is the biggest deal ever made by Australians in money. No American millionaire even ever did a single deal for an amount like that; but something of more importance than the amount is the new principle created. I remarked at the time that the interview was the most important that had ever occurred in Australia. We had opened the door into a now realm of thought that has no ending. A number of citizens had gone straight into the Governor of their own Bank, setting aside members of Parliament, and arranged for what might be looked upon as the impossible. It is really opening up the possibility of a new form of government.” “What does it all mean?” asked our representative. The reply came, “ It simply means this - that the Commonwealth Bank is powerful enough to take Australia right through the unemployed problem and every other money problem, and Sir Denison Miller is willing to use all his ability and his power to the very utmost if the people who own the Bank, that is ourselves, can only grasp- in some degree its significance, and will . give their earnest and loyal support.”

Mr Higgs:

– The Governor of the Commonwealth Bank could not lend £350,000,000 without security.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– I am aware of that, hut what better security could be provided than by the people of Australia through the Government?

Mr Poynton:

– But the Governor of the Commonwealth Bank did not lend £350,000,000 for war purposes.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– “Who said he did? The Minister had better confine himself to the Northern Territory affairs, and I should advise him not to rob any more Australians of their votes.

Mr Lazzarini:

– What security have the Commonwealth Government given the bond-holders for over £400,000,000?

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– The honorable member’s interjection is very pertinent to the debate.

I come now to another deputation to the Treasurer of the Commonwealth, at which Sir Joseph Cook admitted that Sir Denison Miller had absolute power to finance Australia just as the citizens desired -

Our representative said ho certainly would like an explanation of the remark that our Bank is just as strong as the Australian Commonwealth. “ See,” said Mr. Scott, “ this Australia of ours has been financing a third of the civilization of the world since 1851. The gold-fields have done that. The treachery to our Australia: should bo made public. If this subject is of interest caJ] again, and if the North Shore public are curious perhaps addresses might be arranged.” “Have you seen Sir Denison Miller since the deputation, Mr. Scott?” our representative asked. “Yes,”’ was the reply, “I was with Sir Denison Miller in the Bank just lately, on Thursday, 1st of this month. We discussed matters for some considerable time, and the fix I am in mentally is how to tell the people that which they should know.”

That is the most important statement that has been made: Even greater than the statement made by the French financier, Necker. who, if he had been given full authority, might have been able to avert some of the terrors of the Revolution. I protest against any criticism of the United States of America in regard to this matter. In financial transactions no country has shown greater generosity. Even in the Age of yesterday there appeared this statement, which I thoroughly indorse -

President Roosevelt returned to China America’s share of the Boxer indemnities, to be used for the education, of Chinese youth in the colleges of the United States. These and other acts of friendship have helped to give America the same status as Britain as a generous friend and protector of China.

Are honorable members aware of the action taken by the United States Government with reference to the death of a man named Richardson in Japan ? The British Consul summoned the Consuls for Holland, France, and the United States of America to consider the position, and they demanded an indemnity from the Japanese Government. Unfortunately, one Japanese noble fired upon one of the European vessels, and by way of reprisal the gunboats shelled two Japanese villages. Japan paid the indemnity, but an investigation made subsequently showed that Richardson richly deserved his fate, and so incensed were the United States Government at the injustice meted out to Japan that they returned the whole of the indemnity, just as they had returned to - China the indemnity received in connexion with the Boxer rising. A monument erected in Yokohama records this act of generosity on the part of the United States of America. In that little brochure which I published a few. years ago there appears a statement by the Japanese Commander-in-Chief of the army in the war against China to the effect that in the middle of this century Japan would probably be fighting in Europe for the domination of the world, and he hoped that she would be able to play her part with honour to herself and credit to the other nations. I am grateful to Japan for the help she rendered us in making it possible for our men to cross the seas in safety during the recent great conflict. She played the game then. No one can censure Japan for any act of hers during the war. Our White Australia policy offers no offence to Japan. We are merely following her own example, based upon Herbert Spencer’s advice to J apan.

I strongly resent the attitude of those pseudo Australians, Sir Robert Philp, Sir Alfred Cowley, and Mr. Walsh, in regard to recent attempts by Queensland to obtain money in London. I am glad to know that the United States is prepared to help us monetarily, just as she helped the Motherland and France in their recent great difficulties.

I desire now to speak upon another matter. We have among us one who has made the name of Australia known wherever the British tongue is spoken. He is ailing in a hospital, and has only£1 a week to live on ; I allude to Henry Lawson, the great Australian writer. His present position resembles that of Robert Burns, who ended his days in Scotland in need and misery. Surely we do not wish this man, whose poemsand stories have given pleasure to thousands of Australians, to end in that wav. Could not the Men of LettersFund be increased a little? The honorable member for Balaclava (Mr. Watt), when leading the Government, introduced a Bill to provide for Sir Samuel Griffith an old-age pension of £5 a day, although that gentleman had received from Queensland and from the Commonwealth some £86,000 for his services. Having given him so much, could we not give Henry Lawson a little more than a paltry 20s. a week? I offered to contribute to Sir Samuel Griffith’s support, had he lost his money by injudicious experiments in finance, what I was then paying in income tax. Sir Samuel Griffith translated into the English vernacular part of the works of that great Italian poet Dante Alighieri. That book is in the Library, but I know of no member who has read it. Certainly for every person in the community who has read it there are thousands who have read Lawson’s works. Lawson has written words that live and burn, and will be read in years to come. If a collection was started among members, I think that each would be glad to give something to assist the man whose greatness is shown in his splendid poetry, which pictures so well the beauties of the Australian bush. How many Scotchmen have I heard regretting the last days of Robert Burns? Do not let us have similar regrets regarding Lawson. To Lady Bridges Parliament voted £4,500 because she had lost her man at the front, who perished with 60,000 other Australians. No doubt he was a good fellow, but he had had more chance to save money than the ordinary private had had.

I am tired of the travesties of justice that occur in the Northern Territory. There a lawyer, a keen Englishman, who does not like my politics, although he may like me personally, a gentleman whom, I think, the Minister (Mr. Poynton) has met, applied for leave to appeal to the High Court; but the Judge to whom the application was made said that he could not hear it, because he had tried the case, and it was from his decision that it was desired to appeal. One newspaper has spoken of the procedure as an appeal from Caesar to Caesar. A person desirous of appealing is denied the opportunity of going to the High Court. No one would have complained more bitterly about the present state of affairs in the Northern Territory than would Mr. Poynton were the Territory still in the constituency of Grey.

Mr Poynton:

– Will you tell me why the Labour party, of which you have been a member for years, has not given representation to the Northern Territory?

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– Because men like you have been in control of it. As a Minister, you can move in the matter now.

The CHAIRMAN:

– The honorable member’s time has expired.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

.- As no one else has risen to speak, I have the right, under the Standing Orders, to make a second speech. Does not the Minister agree with me that the case to which I have alluded is an absurdity ? A magistrate goes out at one door and comes in at another as a Judge.

Mr Poynton:

– No. There is both a magistrate and a Judge at Darwin.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– At any rate, leave to appeal has been refused, on the ground that the Judge cannot hear an appeal against his own judgment. Thus a person is prevented from appealing to the High Court of Australia, to whom all citizens should be allowed to appeal who desire to do so. We do not wish to cause more irritation by red-tape measures than can be avoided.

Mr Bell:

– In Victoria there is no appeal to the High Court after conviction on a criminal charge.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– Was this a criminal case?

Mr Bell:

– I take it that it was.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– Solomon was a fool to the honorable member. I do not know if the Minister is aware of the position in South Africa, and for his information I shall quote an extract from the Age of the 19th August last, which reads-

Natives Object to Pay it.

Johannesburg, 18th August.

The native-coloured population is strongly protesting against the new Transvaal poll tax, which was passed by the Provincial Council. A meeting of coloured people passed a resolution pledging themselves not to pay poll tax till the legality of taxation without representation is tested. It was decided to ask: the Government to prosecute one of their number as a test case.

Cannot the Government see their way to cease irritating men who, at all events, are standing upon the principle accepted in every British community, that taxation without representation is an infamy and a fraud? It is quite a small matter, and concerns only a few hundred men and women who were allowed to vote on the conscription issue, and when attached to South Australia to vote also for the Legislative Council and House of Assembly, as well as for the Senate and House, of Representatives. I would willingly attach them to my constituency if that could be done, and I am sure the Minister for Home and Territories would not object if they were included among his constituents. The Minister is not one who believes in robbing electors of the franchise, and if such action were taken in his electorate he would strongly oppose it.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended; report adopted.

Resolution of Ways and Means, covering resolution of Supply, reported and adopted.

Ordered -

That Sir Joseph Cook and Mr. Greene do prepare and bring in a Bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

Bill presented by Sir Joseph Cook, and passed through all its stages without amendment or debate.

page 11910

WAR PENSIONS APPROPRIATION BILL

Message recommending appropriation reported.

Ordered -

That the message be taken into consideration in Committee forthwith.

In Committee (Consideration of GovernorGeneral’s message) :

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I move -

That it is expedient that an appropriation of revenue be made for the purposes of a Bill for an Act to grant and apply out of the Consolidated Revenue Fund a sum for war pensions.

This is really a formal matter. In connexion with all these large obligatory payments we create in the Department a

TrustFund into which we sweep moneys from time to time as a convenient way of getting funds together for meeting these payments. As our funds are nearly exhausted, I am asking the Committee to replenish the fund to the extent of £10,000,000. It really does not mean an appropriation of any money whatever, and I only require the authority of the Committee to continue what we have been doing in regard to war pensions.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Resolution reported.

Standing Orders suspended; report adopted.

Ordered -

That Sir Joseph Cook and Mr. Greene do prepare and bring in a Bill to carry out the foregoing resolution.

Bill presented by Sir Joseph Cook, and passed through all its stages without amendment or debate.

page 11910

ADJOURNMENT

Order of Business - Sir Denison miller and the commonwealth Bank.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– In moving -

That the House do now adjourn,

I wish only to say that to-morrow I understand is grievance day, and that in view of the fact that honorable members have had a full opportunity to-day to discuss grievances, I hope they will consent to my moving the adjournment of the debate on the formal motion, which permits of the ventilation of grievances, so that we may get on with the Tariff.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

.- During the temporary absence of the Treasurer (Sir Joseph Cook) I made an allusion to him which I desire to repeat in his presence, so that he may correct me if my statement is wrong. I spoke of a deputation consisting of Sir Joseph Carruthers, Mr. Scott, and others which waited on him and asked whether Sir Denison Miller was supreme so far as the finances of the Commonwealth Bank were concerned. I mentioned that the right honorable gentleman was reported to have said that Sir Denison Miller had full control. I think that is right.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Yes.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

House adjourned at 10.47 p.m.

Cite as: Australia, House of Representatives, Debates, 12 October 1921, viewed 22 October 2017, <http://historichansard.net/hofreps/1921/19211012_reps_8_97/>.

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House of Representatives12 October 1921

QUESTION

AUSTRALIAN NAVY

Mr MARKS:WENTWORTH, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr LAIRD SMITH:Minister for the Navy · DENISON, TASMANIA · NAT

QUESTION

WASHINGTON CONFERENCE

Mr CHARLTON:HUNTER, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

TAXATION COMMISSION’S REPORT

Mr GREGORY:DAMPIER, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

WAR BONDS

Mr FOWLER:PERTH, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

BORROWING PROM AMERICA

Mr FENTON:MARIBYRNONG, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr Gabb:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr West:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr Fenton:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

OLD-AGE PENSIONS

Mr CONSIDINE:BARRIER, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

KALGOORLIE TO PORT AUGUSTA RAILWAY

Mr BURCHELL:FREMANTLE, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Mr GROOM:Minister for Works and Railways · DARLING DOWNS, QUEENSLAND · NAT

QUESTION

ALLOWANCE TO MR. HENRY LAWSON

Mr MAHONY:for Mr. Blakeley

Mr POYNTON:Minister for Home and Territories · GREY, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

QUESTION

TAXATION : ALLEGED EVASIONS BY IMPORTING FIRMS

Mr FLEMING:ROBERTSON, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

TUBERCULAR AND PHTHISIS CASES

Mr MAHONY:for Mr. Blakeley

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

DESTROYERS PLACED OUT OF COMMISSION

Mr MARKS:

Mr LAIRD SMITH:NAT

QUESTION

COMMONWEALTH REPRESENTATION IN ENGLAND

Dr EARLE PAGE:COWPER, NEW SOUTH WALES · FSU; CP from 1920

PAPERS

IMPERIAL CONFERENCE. DEBATES

Pointof Order

Mr FOWLER:

Mr SPEAKER (Hon Sir Elliot Johnson:LANG, NEW SOUTH WALES

SUPPLY BILL (No. 3) 1921-22

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr Richard Foster:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr CHARLTON:Hunter

Mr Gregory:

Mr Maxwell:

Mr CHARLTON:

Mr Gregory:

Mr CHARLTON:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr CHARLTON:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr CHARLTON:

Mr Gregory:

Mr CHARLTON:

Sir Granville Ryrie:

Mr CHARLTON:

Sir Granville Ryrie:

Mr CHARLTON:

Sir Granville Ryrie:

House of Representatives
12 October 1921

Mr MARKS:
WENTWORTH, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr LAIRD SMITH:
Minister for the Navy · DENISON, TASMANIA · NAT

Mr CHARLTON:
HUNTER, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr GREGORY:
DAMPIER, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr FOWLER:
PERTH, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr FENTON:
MARIBYRNONG, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr CONSIDINE:
BARRIER, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr BURCHELL:
FREMANTLE, WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Mr GROOM:
Minister for Works and Railways · DARLING DOWNS, QUEENSLAND · NAT

Mr MAHONY:
for Mr. Blakeley

Mr POYNTON:
Minister for Home and Territories · GREY, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

Mr FLEMING:
ROBERTSON, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr MAHONY:
for Mr. Blakeley

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr LAIRD SMITH:
NAT

Dr EARLE PAGE:
COWPER, NEW SOUTH WALES · FSU; CP from 1920

Mr SPEAKER (Hon Sir Elliot Johnson:
LANG, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr GREGORY:
Dampier

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr FOLEY:
Kalgoorlie

Mr WATKINS:
Newcastle