Senate
29 June 1934

13th Parliament · 1st Session

  1. Senate
  2. 13th Parliament
  3. 1934

The President (Senator the Hon. P. J. Lynch) took the chair at 11 a.m., and read prayers.

page 77

QUESTION

UNITED AUSTRALIA AND COUNTRY PARTIES

Senator DUNN:
NEW SOUTH WALES

– I ask the Leader of the Senate if it is a fact that on the evening of Thursday, 28th June, a conference was held at the residence of the Prime Minister in Canberra, at which the following persons were present: - Mr. Lyons, Prime Minister; Mr. Parkhill, Postmaster-General ; Senator Sir George Pearce, the Leader of the Government in the Senate; Dr. Earle Page, M.H.R.; and Mr. Paterson, M.H.R. ? Can he say further, if, at that conference, the date of the elections was discussed, and if union of the United Australia party with the Country party was considered on the basis of a further reduction of the Australian tariff?

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.There are certain inaccuracies in the honorable senator’s question. I am not aware of any conference having been held at the residence of the Prime Minister, so it is apparent that the honorable gentleman has been slightly misinformed. The Government, and the party with which it has conferred, have nothing to hide. The Government held a conference with the leaders of another party on a matter of major political importance and of great interest to the primary producers, and, indeed, the whole of the people of Australia.

page 77

QUESTION

AUSTRALIAN TARIFF

Senator McLACHLAN:
SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

– Has the

Minister representing the Minister for Trade and Customs noticed a statement made by theFederal Attorney-General (Mr. Latham) that the people of the

Dutch East Indies, because of statements made by irresponsible people in Australia, have the idea that the Commonwealth tariff is the highest in theworld? If so, will the Government take steps to restrain these irresponsible persons, particularly the extreme freetraders who support the Government in theSenate, from creating such misapprehension in the minds of the people of other countries?

Senator Sir George Pearce:

– Mr. President, I take a point of order on that question. I submit that, under cover of a question addressed to Ministers, the honorable senator is not entitled to suggest that other honorable senators arc extreme freetraders. The purpose of asking questions is, I understand, to elicit information, but the honorable senator has taken advantage of a question to place his own interpretation on the votes of other honorable senators.

The PRESIDENT:
Senator the Hon. P.J.Lynch

– The view of the right honorable the Leader of the Senate is correct. An honorable senator when asking questions of Ministers may not comment upon the political views of other honorable senators. Senator MacDonald’s question is, therefore, disallowed.

page 78

QUESTION

INCOME TAXATION

Senator COLLINGS:
QUEENSLAND

– I ask the Minister representing the Treasurer if, when the report of the Royal Commission on Taxation is being considered with a view to appropriate action being taken, the Government will consider the advisability of exempting from the necessity for making returns all persons over 70 years of age whose nett income does not exceed £100 per annum.

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON:
VICTORIA · NAT

– I shall submit the matter for the consideration of the Treasurer. I do not think that persons in the category indicated by the honorable gentleman are obliged to furnish returns for federal taxation purposes.

page 78

QUESTION

CUSTOMS RETURNS

Senator COLLINGS:

– Will the Ministor representing the Minister for Trade and Customs furnish the Senate with information as to the quantity and value of importations into Australia of the following commodities : - Cotton lint, coffee, castor beans, peanuts, jute and kapok?

Senator McLACHLAN:
Minister in charge of Development and Scientific and Industrial Research · SOUTH AUSTRALIA · UAP

– I shall see that the information desired by the honorable senator is supplied to him.

page 78

PAPERS

The following papers were presented : -

Northern Territory - Report by the Administrator on the Administration of the Northern Territory for the year ended 30th June, 1933.

Postmaster-General’s Department - Twentythird Annual Report, 1932-33.

page 78

QUESTION

BOUNTY ON FERTILIZERS

Senator J B HAYES:
TASMANIA

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Commerce, upon notice -

How much of the vote of £250,000 for bounty on fertilizershas been expended to date?

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON.The Minister for Commerce has supplied the following answer: -

The expenditure to date is £239,700. It is anticipated that the total expenditure will be £248,200.

page 78

QUESTION

COTTON INDUSTRY

Senator FOLL:
QUEENSLAND

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Trade and Customs, upon notice -

  1. Has the Government received the report of the Tariff Board on the cotton industry?
  2. Is it a fact that large quantities of cotton are being imported into Australia and that local cotton of a similar nature is being exported ?
  3. Will the Government take such action as will ensure that wherever suitable, Australian cotton will be used in the manufacture of local yarns!
  4. Is it the intention of the Government to restore to the industry all or portion of the bounty that was reduced by 20 per cent. under the Premiers plan, in view of other restorations that have been made?
Senator McLACHLAN:
UAP

– The Minister for Trade and Customs has supplied the following answers: -

  1. Yes.
  2. No.
  3. The Government is considering a scheme whereby both the primary and secondary sides of the industry will be fully protected.
  4. This is a matter for consideration in connexion with the budget.

page 79

QUESTION

UNITED KINGDOM TRADE

Imports of Grain andflour-Ottawa agreement- exports from australia - Quotas.

Senator ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Commerce, upon notice -

  1. Is it a fact that increased importations into the United Kingdom from foreign countries during the first three months of this year as compared with the first three months of last year amount to: -
  1. If so, do these figures not suggest opportunities for closer trading relations with Great Britain?

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON.The Minister for Commerce has supplied the following answers: -

  1. Yes.
  2. The dominions enjoy preferences in the United Kingdom market of 2s. per quarter on wheat, and 10 per cent. ad valorem on the other items. Those preferences afford protection to dominion exporters, but the trade is, of course, affected by other economic factors.
Senator BARNES:
VICTORIA

asked the Minister representing the Prime Minister, upon notice -

  1. Is it a fact, as stated in the Age newspaper of 7th June, 1934, that” while Great Britain’s imports of flour and wheat from Empire countries during the first quarter of this year declined by 36 per cent., her imports of these two commodities from foreign nations increased by leaps and bounds?
  2. If so, and in view of the Prime Minister’s statement that Great Britain has decided to encourage agriculture to the highest possible level, and will not be deflected from her agricultural policy, which contemplates the imposition of restrictions upon imports, will the Government consider the advisability of negotiating with Great Britain for the termination of any portion of the Ottawa agreement conditions which may be jeopardizing the expansion and progress of our secondary industries?
Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE:

– The Prime Minister has supplied the following answers: -

  1. During the first quarter of 1034, imports of wheat, and flour into the United Kingdom from foreign countries increased substantially, compared with the first quarter of 1933. The dominions enjoy preferences in the United Kingdom market in respect of both wheat and flour, which would, in normal circumstances, have diverted the import trade to the dominions. The present extraordinary international conditions affecting the marketing of wheat and flour have, however, caused foreign countries to export increasing quantities of those products to the United Kingdom, despite the existence of the duties imposed under the Ottawa agreement.
  2. No circumstances have arisen which would, in the opinion of the Government, justify the termination of the Ottawa agree- ment.
Senator BARNES:

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Trade and Customs, upon notice -

Will the Minister supply to the Leader of the Opposition in the Senate a statement showing the value and quantity of exports to Great Britain of all goods referred to in Schedules A, B, C and D of the United Kingdom and Australia Trade Agreement Act 1032, for the years 1931, 1932 and. 1933?

Senator McLACHLAN:
SOUTH AUSTRALIA · NAT

– The Minister for Trade and Customs states that the return asked for will be supplied.

Senator BROWN:
through Senator Collings

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Commerce, upon notice -

  1. Has the Government received any information from the Government of Great Britain concerning the imposition of quotas on the imports of primary products from Australia?
  2. If so, will the Government convey the information to the Senate?
Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON:

– The Minister for Commerce has supplied the following answer : -

The Prime Minister has, on several occasions, publicly explained fully the position in regard to this matter. A further statement on the subject will be made at an early date.

page 79

QUESTION

EXPORT OF CHILLED BEEF

Senator BROWN:
through Senator Collings

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Commerce, upon notice -

  1. Will the export of chilled beef from Australia to Great Britain be limited in any way because of any trade agreement entered into between Great Britain and the Argentine?
  2. If so, will the Government give the Senate full details relating to such agreement as it affects Australia?
Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON:

– The Minister for Commerce has supplied the following answers : -

  1. The export of beef, including chilled beef, from Australia to the United Kingdom, is not directly affected by the agreement between the United Kingdom and the Argentine, but is dealt with in the Ottawa agreement.
  2. A statement setting out the provisions of the Ottawa agreement, and the agreement between the United Kingdom and the Argentine regarding meat will be laid on the table of the Senate.

page 80

INCOME TAX ASSESSMENTS

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON.Inquiries are being made and a reply will be furnished as soon as possible to Senator Johnston’s questions relating to federal income tax assessments for the year ending the 30th June, 1933.

page 80

WHEAT INDUSTRY

Royal Commission’s Report

Senator E B JOHNSTON:
WESTERN AUSTRALIA

asked the

Minister representing the Prime Minister, upon notice -

  1. When does the Government expect to receive the report of the Royal Commission on the Wheat Industry?
  2. Can the commission be asked to present an interim report, with the object of enabling legislation for the assistance of wheat-growers and the stabilization of the industry to be placed on the statute-book before the coming election ?

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.The right honorable the Prime Minister has supplied the following answer: - 1 and 2. The Royal Commission on the Wheat Industry will furnish an interim report at an early date so as to enable consideration to be given to it during the present session.

page 80

QUESTION

WILUN A-GERALDTON TELEPHONE

Senator McLACHLAN:
UAP

– Inquiries are being made, and a reply will be furnished as soon as possible to Senator Johnston’s question with regard to a trunk telephone service between Wiluna and Geraldton, Western Australia.

page 80

HENDERSON NAVAL BASE

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.Inquiries are being made, and a reply will be furnished as soon as possible, to Senator Johnston’s question relating to the Henderson Naval Base, near Frem an tle.

page 80

WYNDHAM AIRPORT AND NORTH-WEST AIR SERVICE

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.Inquiries are being made, and replies will be furnished as soon as possible, to Senator Johnston’s questions with regard to the suitability of Wyndham for the establishment of an air port, and the new north-west air service.

page 80

QUESTION

WIRELESS BROADCASTING IN WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Senator McLACHLAN:
UAP

– Senator E. B. Johnston has asked a series of questions concerning the proposed establishment of a national broadcasting station in the southern districts of Western Australia. Inquiries are being made, and a reply will be furnished as soon as possible.

page 80

QUESTION

FELDSPAR

Tariff Board’s Report

Senator E B JOHNSTON:

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Trade and Customs, upon notice -

  1. Has the Minister received the report of the Tariff Board on the production of feldspar in Australia?
  2. If so, when will the report bo available to the Senate?
Senator McLACHLAN:
UAP

– The Minister for Trade and Customs has supplied the following answers : -

  1. Yes.
  2. The Tariff Board’s report has not yet been finally considered by the Government. It is not the practice to release Tariff Board reports until the Government makes a decision in regard to the board’s recommendation.

page 80

QUESTION

CONFERENCE OF COMMONWEALTH AND STATE MINISTERS

Senator BARNES:

asked the Minister representing the Treasurer, upon notice -

Will the Minister supply to the Leader of the Opposition in the Senate a copy of the correspondence that passed between the Commonwealth Bank Board and the Loan Council during the recent meeting of Premiers?

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON.The Treasurer states that, as the correspondence is confidential, he regrets that the request cannot ‘be complied with.

page 81

UNEMPLOYMENT

Senator BARNES asked the Minister representing the Treasurer, upon notice -

Have the census figures relating to unemployment been compiled?

If not, when are they likely to be made available?

The work in connexion with the compilation of census statistics, including those relating to unemployment, is not yet completed.

The work is being expedited and the desired information will be made available as soon as possible.

page 81

MEMBERS OP MILITIA FORCES

Preference in Employment.

page 81

PURCHASE OF CRUISER

Senator Barnes has asked a series of questions regarding the cost of the cruiser purchased by the Commonwealth Government from Great Britain. Inquiries are being made, and a reply will be furnished as early as posssible.

page 81

QUESTION

AUSTRALIAN BROADCASTING. COMMISSION

Resignation of Chairman

Senator McLACHLAN:
UAP

– In regard to the question asked by Senator Collings concerning the control of the Australian Broadcasting Commission, inquiries are being made, and a reply will be furnished as soon as possible.

page 81

QUESTION

APPLE-GROWING INDUSTRY

Senator HERBERT HAYS:
TASMANIA

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Commerce, upon notice -

In view of the importance of the applegrowing industry to the Commonwealth, and the unsatisfactory position of the overseas trade, will the Government cause an investigation to be made to discover in what manner the industry can be assisted, and placed on a more profitable basis?

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON.The Minister for Commerce has supplied the following answer: -

The sum of ?125,000 was granted to the apple industry this financial year, to compensate it for losses incurred on export. The Government is at present considering the measures which may be taken to enable the industry to meet, more satisfactorily, present market conditions.

?12,000,000 COMMONWEALTH LOAN.

Senator BROWN:
through Senator Collings

asked the Minister representing the Treasurer, upon notice -

  1. As a result of the over-subscription of the recent loan, is it apparent that Australia is making progress toward financial stability?
  2. If so, how long will it be, at the present rate of progress, before Australia is out of debt?
  3. If not, how long will it be before Australia is financially bankrupt?

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON.The Treasurer has supplied the following answers : - 1 to 3. The over-subscription of the recent loan is gratifying evidence of confidence in government finance. The future stability of Australian finance is dependent on the continuance of sound government.

page 81

QUESTION

CHILLED BEEF

De Raeve Process

Senator BROWN (through Senator

Collings) asked the Vice-President of the Executive Council, upon notice -

  1. Has the Minister received the report concerning the operation in Western Australia of the De Raeve methodof chilling beef?
  2. If so, would he furnish the Senate with a copy?
Senator McLACHLAN:
UAP

– The answers to the honorable senator’s questions are as follows : - 1 and 2. I have not received any further reports on the DeRaeve method of chilling beef. I undertook in reply to a question asked by the honorable senator on 16th November, 1933, to give consideration to the question of obtaining a further expert opinion on this process, if I were supplied with full details indicating that improvements have been effected since the process was investigated by the Council for Scientific and Industrial Research. No further details have been supplied to me.

page 82

QUESTION

EAST-WEST RAILWAY

Employment of Canberra Residents

Senator HOARE:
through Senator Barnes

asked the Minister representing the Minister for the Interior, upon notice -

  1. Has the Government any intention of sending a number of men from Canberra to work on the east-west railway in South Australia?
  2. If so, who will pay railway fares for the men in question?
  3. What will be the cost of fares and other expenses of conveying the men from Canberra to their destination?
  4. Are the fares Or any other expenses to be repaid by the men in question?
Senator E B JOHNSTON:

asked the Minister representing the Minister for the Interior, upon notice -

  1. Is it intended to send a large number of unemployed men from Canberra to work on the Port Augusta-Kalgoorlie railway?
  2. If so, why is preference for this work being given to residents of Canberra, when Western Australia can supply the whole of the men required for this work, without cost of transport?

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.To both questions the Minister for the Interior has supplied the answer that the matter is still under consideration.

page 82

EVIDENCE BILL 1934

Motion (by Senator McLachlan) agreed to -

That leave be given to introduce a bill for an act to amend the Evidence Act 1905.

Bill brought up and read a first time.

page 82

EXCISE BILL 1934

Motion (by Senator McLachlan) agreed to -

That leave be given to introduce a bill for an act to amend Part XI. of the Excise Act 1901-1923.

page 82

DESIGNS BILL 1934

Motion (by Senator McLachlan) agreed to -

Thatleave be given to introduceabill for an act to amend the Designs Act 1900-1933.

page 82

STATUTE LAW REVISION BILL 1934

Motion (by Senator McLachlan)agreed to -

That leave be given to introduce a bill for an act to revise the Statute Law of the Commonwealth by repealing enactments which have ceased to be in force or hare become unnecessary, to make any amendments in that law which are rendered necessary or desirable by any such repeal, and for other purposes.

page 82

SUPPLY BILL (No. 1) 1934-35

Bill received from the House of Representatives.

Standing and sessional orders suspended.

Bill (on motion by Senator Sir Harry Lawson) read a first time.

Second Reading

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON:
Assistant Minister · Victoria · UAP

[11.27] . - I move -

That the bill be now read a second time.

The bill is to grant Supply in order to carry on the services of the Commonwealth for the first three months of the coming financial year. The amount involved is £6,079,175, which includes the following sums for ordinary services : -

The items making up these sums are based on the appropriations passed by Parliament for the present year, and represent approximately one-quarter of the appropriation. In addition, the usual provisions are made for “ refunds of revenue “ and “ advance to the Treasurer “. The amount set down for “refunds of revenue” is £400,000, and for “ advance to the Treasurer “ £1,500,000. This latter item is required to carry on uncompleted works in progress on the 30th June, 1934, and other urgent works, and to cover unforeseen and miscellaneous expenditure, including special grants to South Australia, Western Australia, and Tasmania. These special grants will be continued on the same basis as during the present: financial year, pending consideration of the report of the royal commission which is at present inquiring into the circumstances of each of these States and the introduction of new bills.

Provision is made in the bill only for the amount which is estimated to be sufficient to carry on essential services on the same basis as that provided for in the appropriation for the current financial year; 1933-34. No provision is made in this measure for any new expenditure or for any departure irons existing policy. It is hoped to introduce the budget early in August, when the full financial proposals of the Government will be submitted to Parliament.

As we have almost reached the end of the present financial year, honorable senators will no doubt be anxious to know what the financial results for the year are likely to be. I am not yet in a position to supply even an approximate statement of the financial position for the full year, as final returns from the various departments and branches in all States will not be received for some days after the 30th June. I may mention, however, that the revenue for the year has been particularly buoyant, especially the customs and excise revenue, which, up to the 31st May, showed an increase of approximately £1,600,000 over the budget estimate for that period. Post office revenue also disclosed a considerable improvement on the budget estimate, the receipts for the eleven months being £270,000 in excess of the pro rata budget estimate. The statement of receipts and expenditure for the eleven months ended the 31st May showed an excess of receipts of £2,625,000. In considering this balance, however, ‘it is necessary to take into account that very heavy expenditure has had to be met during the month of June, including expenditure on new works commenced late in the year. The balance of £1,400,000, in respect of relief to wheat-growers, completes the total of £3,000,000 appropriated under that head. “While it is too early to forecast definitely the financial position fer the full year, it is apparent that when all returns are to hand they will show that the balance of the Consolidated Revenue Fund is on the right side of the .ledger. I hope to be able in about eight or ten days to submit to honorable senators a statement of the Consolidated Revenue Fund under various headings, showing the approximate results for the year. A more detailed statement will, of course, be submitted with the budget for next year. As honorable senators are aware this is one of the annual measures that must be dealt with at this stage of the financial year. We may regard the passing of this bill as practically a formal procedure, for it does. not involve any new financial policy, and. I ask the cooperation of honorable senators in giving the measure a speedy pass-age.* They will have ample opportunity later to discuss financial policy.

Senator BARNES:
Victoria

– I hays’ no intention to ‘discuss the details pf the bill at tins juncture, for as the Minister has ^pointed out, ample opportunity to debate the Government’s financial proposals will be afforded later in the session. According to press reports published during the long recess that we have just experienced, the Government has been well aware of the buoyancy of the revenue. Knowing that the Estimates of receipts were being greatly exceeded, the Government might well have taken action to deal with the grave problem of unemployment, which is wide-spread throughout Australia. It should have used some of its extra revenue to provide employment for the workless. Deputations representing the unemployed and the secretaries of industrial organizations have drawn the attention of the Government to the desperate position of these men; so the Government cannot plead ignorance of the conditions that prevail throughout the land. Ministers are most blameworthy for not having made a determined effort to relieve the situation. The Government is certainly deserving of a vote of censure for the ineptitude displayed by it in this regard.

The announcement has been made in the press recently that the Government intends to propose amendments to the Invalid and Old-age Pensions Act during the present session. Several important amendments are required, and I shall direct attention to one in particular. The last amending bill contained a most atrocious provision, the significance of which none of us realized at the time. It might have slipped through Parliament even if every member had been a King’s Counsel; but the Government, of course, had at its disposal the services of legal experts. As a result of that amendment, on the death of a pensioner the department can claim the proceeds of his life insurance policy in order to recoup itself for the amount paid to him by way of pension. I do not believe that that amendment would have been passed by this Senate without serious opposition, had honorable senators, irrespective of their party views, ‘realized at the time how serious the effects would be. Sub-section 4 of section 476 of the Victorian Companies Act 19,18, provides -

Notwithstanding’ anything contained in his will or any codicil thereto, on the death of any person the property and interest of such person in any policy or policies of assurance on his life not maturing only at his death shall not to the extent of One thousand pounds of the sum assured be assets for the payment of his debts except those (if any) for the payment of which he in such will or codicil declares an intention to make such property and interests assets by words expressly referring to such policy or policies and expressly negativing the provisions of this section.

I do not know whether a similar provision is contained in the company law of other States. Under that sub-section the insurance cannot be claimed by any creditor, but is reserved to the widow or to a member of the deceased’s family; but under the amendment of the Invalid and Old-age Pensions Act made last session, the department can claim even so small a sum as £50 in order to recoup itself for pension payments. I hope that the Government will give early consideration to the need for rectifying this anomaly.

We have been told by the press that the Government intends to send 100 men from Canberra to work on the East- West railway. It is said that they will be selected by the railway authorities and sent 1,000 miles or more to engage in the work of re-sleeper ing that line. I have a telegram from the Australian Workers Union in South Australia expressing strong resentment of this proposal. The work involved is usually carried out by members of that organization and the secretary informs me that there, are 17,000 registered unemployed in South Australia to-day, so there is ample labour available locally. It seems absurd that the Government should incur the heavy expense of transporting 100 men from Canberra to Port Augusta. The cost of their fares alone would be probably £1,000. We are told that Commonwealth money is to be expended on this work, and therefore the Commonwealth Government is entitled to send men from any part of Australia to participate in this relief. That argument might be convincing if no labour were available in the vicinity of the work to be undertaken, but thousands of men are available in South Australia, and as the people of that State are taxpayers of the Commonwealth, they have a prior right to employment in their own neighbourhood. The Federal Capital Territory comprises about 900 square miles, and surely this Government has sufficient ability to find employment in the Territory for the 100 unemployed whom it proposes to send to Port Augusta. The Government has £4,000,000 more revenue than was estimated, and the unemployed in Canberra, who are undoubtedly entitled to work, should be found employment near their homes. .

The PRESIDENT (Senator the Hon. P. J. Lynch). - Can the honorable senator connect his remarks with the bill under, consideration ?

Senator BARNES:

– The money that would be expended in sending Canberra unemployed to the East- West railway would have to be taken from the sum to be appropriated by this ‘bill. The Government recently approached the money market with most satisfactory results. According to newspaper reports, the £12,000,000 asked for could have been subscribed in. about two hours, and £25,000,000 could easily have been obtained. The Government claims that that response to its appeal is evidence of the confidence of the people in the present Administration. One is entitled to complain when a government which finds the borrowing of £12,000,000 as easy as the kissing of a girl, fails to care for those of its citizens who live practically on the doorstep of this Parliament House.

I have, however, no desire to delay the bill, and shall not oppose its passing.

Senator DUNN:
New South Wales

– 1 agree with the, Leader of the Opposition (Senator Barnes) that nothing that we on this side may do can prevent the passing of this bill. Nevertheless, this measure, which seeks to appropriate over £6,000,000 for the service of the next financial year, affords an appropriate opportunity for criticism of the Government’s administration. During the recent long recess, many senators have visited States other than those they represent in order to make themselves conversant with conditions throughout Australia. I visited every State, but not the Northern Territory.

The Leader of the Senate (Senator Pearce) and the Prime Minister (Mr. Lyons), in common with many of their camp followers, boast that conditions in Australia are better to-day than they have been for three or four years. They tell us that prosperity is just around the corner. But the chairman of the Commonwealth Bank Board, Sir Claude Reading, told us recently that conditions in this country are uo better than they were about two and a half years ago, in the middle of the depression. So serious does he consider the position to be that the Commonwealth Bank has stopped all further credit. In their policy of misrepresentation, responsible Ministers have been aided and abetted by the first civil servant of the Commonwealth, the High Commissioner in London. In a congenial atmosphere, with mellow wine and good food on the table, Mr. Bruce spoke into the microphone, and his words were heard by thousands of listeners sitting in comfort in their homes throughout Australia. Unfortunately for the Government, the chairman of the Commonwealth Bank Board has, as it were, thrown a spanner into the works. The Premier of South Australia, Mr. Butler, is another who is out of step with the Com* monwealth Government. A critical situation developed recently when Mr. Butler raised a loan in his own State, and informed the Loan Council that in the future South Australia would arrange its own borrowing. Since then, Mr. Ogilvie, the new Labour Premier of Tasmania, whose recent election has given the

United Australia Party a nasty jolt, has stated that Tasmania is on the dole. He warned the Commonwealth Government that unless Tasmania obtained further relief from the Commonwealth, the people of that State would be given an opportunity to decide whether or not they favoured secession. Ministers continue to say that all is well in relation to the agreement signed at Ottawa; but a consideration of many of the items in this schedule, particularly those connected with the Department of Commerce, forces us to the conclusion that all is not well. When in Western Australia recently, I found that the only industry -in that rich State which showed evidence of prosperity was . gold-mining. Although- - Western Australia is now probably the leading wheat-producing State of the Commonwealth, the wheat-farmers there are in a very bad way indeed. Notwithstanding, bounteous rains and good seasonal prospects, the > high capital value placed on their land imposes a burden too heavy for them to bear. Many of the small farmers of Western Australia are practically dependent on the dole, and those with larger holdings are experiencing great difficulty in meeting their commitments. These conditions exist notwithstanding the optimistic forecast of the effect of the Ottawa Conference on the primary and secondary industries of this country. In New South Wales also, the position of the wheat-growing industry is serious; nearly one million acres of wheat laud has gone out of production in that State in recent years. The Minister for Commerce (Mr. Stewart), from time to time, endeavours to encourage the wheat-farmers of Australia by a variation of the old adage, “ Live, horse, and the grass will grow “. The only industry in New South Wales which shows any evidence of prosperity is the pastoral industry, which has benefited from the increased price of wool. Closer observation reveals a decline in the production of wool in Australia due to the somewhat clearer international atmosphere. Nations which were preparing for war, are, at the moment, not so active in that way, probably because their warehouses are already fully stocked. During recent years, science and invention have made remarkable progress, and have done much to shape the course of nations. We are now told that a German scientist has discovered a process by which synthetic wool can be produced. Such a discovery must inevitably have a serious effect on the Australian wool-growing industry. Further evidence that all is not well is the failure of the attempt to regulate wheat production throughout the world. Thu ink was scarcely dry on the agreement, which the High Commissioner signed on behalf of Australia, when the Argentine and other wheat-producing countries commenced to “ scab “ on the other signatories to, that agreement. One wonders whether trie, action of the Argentine Republic is in any way connected with the fact that British interests J have invested over £700,000,000 in the industries of Argentina. Because of the policy of economic nationalism ‘that is being preached itf all countries,’ even by the present coalition Government in Great Britain, the outlook for the farmers of Australia is very serious, and their plight demands the immediate attention of this Government.

The schedule to the bill contains1 items dealing with certain phases of the Government’s defence policy. It is well known that the Government intends to earmark £4,000,000 of its estimated surplus of £6,000,000 for defence purposes. I and my colleague, Senator Rae, are quite willing to vote supply for the ordinary purposes of the Government, but I tell the Minister plainly that when its defence measures come before us they will have our uncompromising opposition.

Senator Sir Harry Lawson:

– The Government’s defence proposals are not involved in this bill.

Senator DUNN:

– I am aware of that. Nevertheless I am entitled to offer some general criticism of. the policy that was outlined lately by the Minister for Defence, and it is idle for the Minister to split straws with me over the matter at this stage. The Government’s defence proposals are linked up with this Supply Bill because provision is being made for payment of the salaries and wages of employees in that department.

Senator Sir Harry Lawson:

– This Supply Bill is based on the budget of last year, and does not touch the defence policy of the Government.

The PRESIDENT:

– The honorable senator must accept the assurance of the Minister and confine his remarks more closely to the subject before the Chair, .

Senator DUNN:

– I assure the Minister that I have no desire to be discourteous to him. As a matter of fact, I am in agreement with him, except, as j have observed, with regard to the sum of £4,000,000 which the Government proposes to set aside for increased defence without first making adequate provision to deal with the unemployment problem. This Government, through the support which it receives from certain State governments, controls the Loan Council, but is not doing the right thing by the unemployed.

Senator Barnes referred to the proposal to transfer a number of unemployed from Canberra to Port Augusta, in South Australia, for work on the transcontinental railway. The condition of the workers in all States is most unsatisfactory, due to the operation of the Premiers plan, under which wageearners were forced to suffer drastic reductions of wages, as well as loss of employment through the cessation of public works. Actually, many of the leaders of the workers had to “ take it on the chin “, during the regime of the previous Commonwealth Government, following the acceptance of the Premiersplan.

The fact that the recent loan of £12,000,000 at 3£ per cent, was subscribed so eagerly shows that there is something fundamentally wrong with the alleged prosperity of this country under the rule of the present Government. Banking and other financial institutions, insurance companies, merchant princes and manufacturers with money to spare rushed to take up government bonds in preference to investing money in industry and so providing remunerative employment for our people. Their chief concern is to get the best return on their investment regardless of the way in which they exploit the great mass of people employed in both primary and secondary industries, or how much they squeeze the farmers, who have been obliged to pay anything from 6 to 12 per cent, for money advanced to them to carry ou their operations. Some sections of big business, notably the Colonial Sugar Refining Company, enjoy even higher dividends.

The PRESIDENT:

– I shall, not warn the honorable senator again. He must confine his remarks more closely to the subject before the Chair.

Senator DUNN:

– I am endeavouring to do so, and I contend that as this bill makes provision for the payment of the salaries of Treasury officials to the amount of £10,700, 1 am in order. These Treasury officials, I remind honorable senators, were responsible for all tho propaganda in connexion with the recent loan. Flamboyant advertisements appeared in all the principal newspapers .of our capital cities and inland towns. No one will pretend that the Prime Minister (Mr. Lyons) supplied all the detailed information which appeared in those advertisements urging the people to subscribe to the loan. It wa3 the work of responsible officers of the Treasury, whose salaries -are provided for in this Supply Bill. I, therefore, submit that my remarks are relevant. I assure the Senate that I am not endeavouring to stone-wall the bill. After a recess of seven months, during which I travelled all over Australia seeking tangible evidence, of the alleged prosperity, I feel that I am entitled to give the Senate my impressions. “Wherever I went I saw hundreds of men and wemen, sOme of the latter with children, carrying their swags or wheeling perambulators along country roads in search of work. And this is in a land that should bo one of the brightest gems of the British Empire. Because of economic conditions, for which this Government must accept some responsibility, these people were unable to obtain -employment, although on either side of the roads on which they travelled were millions of acres of fertile land, which had gone out of production owing to the calamitous fall of world prices for primary produce. To-day many of our farmers are on the dole. In every State, farmers, manufacturers and others have for a long time been appealing to the Government to do something to ensure a return of prosperity.

I shall vote for the Supply Bill, because I have no wish to delay payments due to thousands of “ wage plugs “. But I warn the Minister in charge of the bill that the time is rapidly approaching when Ministers and their supporters will be obliged to go before the people to give an account of their stewardship, and I feel sure that they will find it very difficult to justify all the misery and degradation which the people of Australia have suffered from the operation of the Premiers plan. Because of the vacillation and the “backing and filling” by this Government, the electors are now in a frame of mind to demand, in no uncertain manner, the immediate introduction of more effective measures to alleviate the sufferings’ of the people. This Government has not dealt justly with Public Service employees. Under the Premiers plan, which was adopted by the Scullin Administration, they suffered reductions of salaries ranging up to 22J pgr cent. Those reductions should be restored. When the measure is in committee I shall have, some further comments to make with respect to the political tripe which has appeared in the newspapers during the last few months concerning the activities of this so-called “ prosperity “ Government.

Senator COLLINGS:
Queensland

– Honorable senators on this side of the chamber intend to adhere to the decision that factious opposition shall not be offered to the passage of the bill. I shall reserve any comments which I wish to make upon financial matters generally until the budget papers are before the Senate. At this stage I shall content myself with making an observation concerning pensions. There is another phase with respect to insurance policies, in addition to the point taken by my leader (Senator Barnes), and I ask the Minister to give attention to it. On the death of a pensioner, not only is his insurance policy treated as an asset from which the Commonwealth Government can retrieve the amount of pension paid, but it is also treated as an asset during his life, which, in my opinion, is even worse. To-day when a deputy commissioner is deciding whether a person is entitled to a pension, and if so of what amount, his assets are taken into consideration. An insurance policy valued at £40 or £50 will not be available to the pensioner or his relatives until after death, but its value is treated as an asset during his life-time, and the sum, however small, is used to bring his assets of all kinds above the statutory limit and the pension is reduced accordingly. I am using moderate terms when I say that such action is deplorable and discreditable. This is a matter which could be adjusted by administrative act, even before the budget is considered. It is cruel to allow the present system to continue for 48 hours longer. I am sure that honorable senators will treat this as a non-party matter, and that they do not favour a continuance of the present, system. As the Minister has assured us that the bill does not provide for any new expenditure, I shall assist in giving it a speedy passage.

Senator DUNCAN-HUGHES:
South Australia

– I wish to say a few words with reference to the Government’s proposal to send unemployed men from Canberra to work on the East-West railout from Port Augusta. As was mentioned by the Leader of the Opposition (Senator Barnes) there is a considerable number of unemployed men in South Australia, and at Port Augusta ‘ itself. The proposal of the Government to send 100 men from Canberra to engage in work on the East-West line has drawn protests, not only from Labour men, but also from the members of other political parties, and I think it would be fair to say that protests have been uttered by representatives of every section of the community. The reason for such protests are these : The unemployed at present at Port Augusta are nearest to the work and their employment would, as a matter of course, obviate the cost which would be involved in sending men from Canberra to Port Augusta. Moreover, it is quite probable that the unemployed at Port Augusta are more accustomed to the local conditions and to the work which is to be made available, than men sent from Canberra could possibly be. There is nothing to show that the men whom it is proposed to send from Canberra are in any way specially qualified for the work. If it were work on which experts should be employed, and such experts were available only in Canberra, there would be something to be said in favour of the Government’s proposition, but those conditions do not obtain. As the Leader of the Opposition said, suitable men can be obtained on the SpOt and it is therefore reasonable to ask that they should be employed. I appreciate the Government’s difficulty. It ils all Commonwealth work, and Commonwealth money is to be expended. Naturally, the Commonwealth Government feelsthat it is under a special obligation to its former employees who are at present out of work, but the unemployed men in Canberra are actually no more the concern of the Commonwealth than are the unemployed men who reside at Port Augusta or in any other part of South Australia. All are Australians, and should receive equal consideration. The men at Port Augusta are closer to the work, and their services could be more readily employed, and at a lower cost to the taxpayers. The intrusion, if one may use the term, of the unemployed of Canberra at Port Augusta is bound to lead to friction with those on the spot who have been deliberately overlooked. The proposed action of the Government also suggests that preferential treatment is being given to those residing in the capital city. A question was asked to-day concerning details of the unemployed as revealed by the latest census figures, and although the reply was that the figures were not available, it would be interesting to know how the proportion of unemployed in the Federal Capital Territory compares with that in the States. Probably it would be found that the percentage of unemployment in Canberra is not so high as it is in some of the States. I do not suggest that there are not difficulties” associated with the problem, or that the Government is not trying to do what it thinks fair; but I do not think that it is prudent or businesslike to do as . the Government suggests. I sincerely trust that the Government will reconsider the matter, and make the work available to those who are experienced, and are already on the spot.

Senator MacDONALD:
Queensland

– I do not intend to make a long speech on the motion for the second reading of this bill, but I take this opportunity- to refer to a few important matters. Yesterday the Minister in charge of development (Senator McLachlan) replied to a question I asked concerning the reported closing down of the Government Experimental Tobacco Farm at Mareeba. The reply by the Minister was to the effect that this farm has been passed over to the control of the State authorities, but I was precluded by the rules of the Senate from making any comment at the time. 1 have before me a paragraph which appeared in the Brisbane Courier-Mail, in which Mr. Bulcock, the. Minister for Agriculture and Stock in Queensland, referred to the closing down of the experimental farm ait Mareeba. The paragraph concluded with this sentence -

Some of the messages he had received indicated the belief that the farm was conducted by the State Government; but it was purely a Commonwealth institution.

That statement conflicts with the reply given to me by the Minister in Charge of Development. I direct the attention of the Minister in charge of the bill to the contradictory nature of the two statements.

I protest against the effect of existing pensions legislation. ‘ I cannot expect the Government to adopt the Labour party’s policy and restore invalid and old-age pensions to the rates and conditions which were in ‘force before a reduction was made - which a. majority of Australians believe to be the undoubted right of pensioners- - but I direct the Minister’s attention to the practice adopted in dealing with the property of pensioners, and also to amounts pensioners may receive under the present system. It is unreasonable to expect every member of a family seeking employment to be equally successful in industrial life, particularly under the present order of society. One member of a family may be comparatively successful and another meet only with failure. I know a family one female member of which was successful - it may not have been due entirely to individual effort - and could live comfortably without the aid of a pension. Her sister, who -had not been so fortunate, needed a pension. The more fortunate, out of kindness of heart, offered to provide a higher standard of comfort for her sister, who undoubtedly deserved it. Because one sister gave the other a home, the department deducted 12s. 6d. from her miserable pension of 17s. 6d. a week. That sort of treatment tends to dry up the springs of private benevolence. I believe that many similar eases have occurred throughout Australia. Immediately a pensioner receives a sum of money, such as a bequest or inheritance, above a small amount, he or she is called upon to submit to a reduction of the pension. The great majority of Australians look upon the old-age pension as a payment to which elderly folk are fully entitled. Under the capitalistic system, all cannot succeed. The success of one man may be due to the failure, through circumstances over which they have no control, of ten others, or, in the case of great financial success, to the failure of a thousand others. I trust that the old system will soon be restored entirely.

Senator RAE:
New South Wales

– A case recently came under my notice in which an aged couple received a pension of 12s. 6d. a week each. Before the days of the depression, they had accumulated a property which they sold for £300; but, unfortunately, they did not receive payment. Occasionally, the purchaser gives them £1 or £2 by way of interest, but they have no immediate prospect of any payment of the principal. The Deputy Commissioner of Taxation informs me that the property is valued at £300, and that there is no proof that it is a hopelessly bad debt. Consequently, these pensioners are compelled to submit to a reduction.

Senator Barnes:

– That is the experience in hundreds of cases.

Senator RAE:

– Yes. The Government has callously deprived a great number of pensioners of money to which they are justly entitled. If the Ministry hopes to survive at the next election it will have to repeal those provisions of the act which allow the property of pensioners to fall into the hands of the department to be used in recouping it for pension payments. Such legislation is disgraceful. It is stated that the provisions relating to contributions by relatives of pensioners are to be repealed, but there are evenworse provisions in the act. 6

The PRESIDENT:

– Does the honorable senator hold the view that the amount of the vote for pensions is insufficient ?

Senator RAE:

– Yes. It is a standing disgrace for the Government to claim credit for having made savings, considering that it has remitted taxation to the wealthy sections by robbing the pensioners. Until the present policy of the Government is reversed, there will be no peace in this country. I am happy to state that the pensioners are organized throughout the Commonwealth, and that the number of members of their organization is rapidly increasing. Any conservative senator who wishes to retain the present unjust provisions in the Pensions Act will meet his “Waterloo at an early date.

The fact that the Treasury made the a arrangements necessary for the raising of the recent £12,000,000 loan affords ample justification for criticizing the loan om this bill. We are told that the ease with which the Government can obtain loan money is proof of returningprosperity based on the confidence of investors ; but I contend that the ease with which the last loan was floated, and the fact that it was considerably oversubscribed show that there is not great opportunity for profitable investment in other directions.

Senator Collings:

– It actually shows a lack :of,.confidence.

Senator RAE:

– Yes. The safety of the Commonwealth loan induced investors to rush in their applications for the stock. When State Ministers receive deputations from the’ unemployed, they account for iiic meagre allowance for relief works h.v saying that they have only the money which the Loan Council allots to them for that purpose; yet the PostmasterGeneral boasted recently,’ when speaking in connexion with the Martin by-election, that the Government had raised £38,000,000 by way of loans in the last ye.ir, and out of that money provision had boon made for relief works in the States. Very few of these works will be nf a reproductive nature, and the fact that they are to be financed out of loan money clearly shows that the so-called prosperity is of an unsubstantial nature, and will lead to a greater collapse thanthat from which Australia is supposed to be emerging. Certainly, the expenditure of. loan money on relief works has led. to a temporary revival in some industries; but, if the mere ability to raise moneyby loan is an index to prosperity, Australia should be one of the most prosperous countries in the world.

Senator Payne:

– So it is.

Senator RAE:

– The honorable senator probably gauges the prosperity of others by his own success. Although the Government has taken great credit to itself for having pulled Australia out of the depression, a country that relies upon wholesale borrowing can enjoy but a transitory prosperity. To say that unemployment is decreasing under the regime of the present Ministry is merely to express one of those half-truths which, in effect, are worse than lies. The number of unemployed is not decreasing, because there is no justification for regarding as employed every person who receives a few days’ work intermittently as the result of the expenditure of loan money. It is useless to attempt to cover up the fact that unemployment is still as bad as it was in the worst days of the depression. Sitting suspended from 1S.U5 to 2.15 p.m.

Senator RAE:

– We have learned from the newspapers that the Government intends, ‘ when introducing its budget, to propose the expenditure of twothirds of its surplus on defence. I take this opportunity to protest against such expenditure at a time when there is noproposal to restore Public Service salariesor the “ cuts “ made in pensions and in other social services. While I remain, a member of this Senate, I shall oppose to the limit of my powers any such expenditure on defence. Hundreds of thousands of people in Australia to-day arestruggling to maintain a bare existence,, and the difficulty experienced by householders in balancing their domesticbudgets has not been lightened by the boasted prosperity which for so long has. been “just round the corner,” and still remains there. The expenditure on, munitions will be a waste of publicmoney: that criticism applies equally to many other items in the defence votes. We shall have an opportunity later to deal with such proposals at length. For the time being, I shall content myself with saying that we must keep a keen eye on this expenditure; indeed, I should be glad to have an opportunity to reduce even the amounts provided in this bill for the service of the Defence Department during the next three months. ‘I consider that most of the expenditure authorized by the Government has been for the purpose of helping those most able to help themselves, and oppressing those who occupy the lowliest positions in the community. Such a policy can only have the unswerving opposition of any man who styles himself a democrat.

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON (Victoria - Assistant Minister) [2.20]. - The Leader of the Opposition (Senator Barnes) said that no provision had been made by the Government for the unemployed, but I remind the honorable senator that the Government included in its last budget a greatly increased provision for unemployment relief as compared with the previous year. In 1932-33, the amount provided for new works from revenue amounted to £874,392. In 1933-34, the provision was £L,624,8S0. In 1932-33, there was no provision for new works from loans, but in 1933-34, £810,000 was provided. Thus the total provision for new works in 1932-33 was £874,390 as against £2,434,SS0 in 1933-34. These figures re.fute the statement that the Government has been blind to its obligation towards the unemployed, and has done nothing to alleviate their position. This bill is merely to provide for essential services, for three months, based on last year’s expenditure.

Several honorable senators have referred to the proposed employment of the workless in Canberra on re-sleepering and regrading and ballasting the EastWest railway line. The Leader of the Senate (Senator Pearce) stated, in reply to a question, that the subject was being further considered. During this debate, honorable senators have stated their objections to the proposal, and Senator Duncan-Hughes reviewed it in a judicial and very fair manner. I assure honorable senators that no finality has yet been reached. The whole matter will be further considered, and when a decision has been reached, a full statement will be made to the Senate. At this stage, I must . ask honorable senators to be satisfied with that promise.

I take this opportunity to correct a statement by Senator .Dunn that the recent £12,000,000 loan would yield to subscribers a return of. 3 per cent. As a matter of fact, the loan was issued at £98 10s., and carried an interest rate of 3$ per cent., the effective yield to investors being £3 7s. 8d. per cent.

Senator Barnes:

– A few days after flotation the market quotation was £100 5s.

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON:

– That may be said to be an indication that the Commonwealth finances are buoyant and healthy. Many observations have been made with regard to the oversubscription of the loan, but I do not propose to deal with them at this stage.

With regard to the criticism of proposed expenditure on defence, I assure honorable senators that full statements of the Government’s policy will be made when the budget is introduced, and the fullest opportunity will be afforded for a free discussion of the whole matter.

Several honorable senators referred to pensions, and, in particular, the Leader of the Opposition mentioned the inclusion of an insurance policy in the assets of a pensioner when assessing the rate of pension he is to receive. The honorable senator cited the Victorian Companies Act, which gives to insurance policies up to the value of £1,000 immunity from liability for debts: I assume that a similar principle is to be found in the statute laws of all the States. The point taken by Senator Barnes is deserving of the fullest consideration, and I promise that it will be referred to the appropriate authority for attention.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time.

In committee:

Clause 1 agreed to.

Clause 2 (Issue and application of £6,079,175).

Senator DUNN:
New South Wales

– I move-

That, the House of Representatives be requested to reduce the amount by £1.

In looking through this bill I find that no provision has been made to relieve the burden placed upon officers of the Commonwealth Public Service. Those employed at Canberra have lost £39 as & result of the cessation of the special allowance, and, with other officers in all parts of the Commonwealth, have during the last three years lost a total of .£42 as a result of cost-of-living, adjustments. These reductions were included in the general reduction of salaries which applied to the whole of the Commonwealth Public Service. There was last year a partial restoration, but it amounted to very little. The Government is content to make remissions to the wealthy taxpayers of Australia, especially those in Sydney, and is doing nothing to help the public servants.

In connexion with the mail services to the Pacific islands, nothing has been done to assist an Australian steamship company and its employees engaged in that trade. In that company millions of pounds of Australian capital are invested, but it is likely to be forced out of business owing to the suspension of the coasting provisions of the Navigation Act. If they are to be swept away by vessels of the Inchcape line - a line built up by Lord Inchcape from a fortune made out of the sweat and blood of the coolies he employed - the outlook for the white employees of the Australian steamship companies which pioneered the trade is black, indeed.

I hope that the Government, which boasts of the bouyancy of its revenues, will realize its duty and give ‘to the public servants of the Commonwealth a greater measure of justice. The Government seems -to ‘be concerned only with conduct? ing hole and corner conferences with the Country party; but, even as windowdressing such conferences are no better than dead lambs in a butcher’s shop on a Friday afternoon. At the dictation of the private banks, the Government has robbed its own servants.

The CHAIRMAN (Senator the Hon Herbert Hays:
TASMANIA

– At this stage the honorable senator is not justified in dealing with the general subject of banking.

Senator DUNN:

– The policy of the Government has resulted in millions of pounds having been taken out of the pockets of the workers in industry, whereas the private banks, and wealthy interests generally, have received a rakeoff in the shape of remissions of taxation. The firm of David Jones Limited benefited to the extent of £20,000 from such remissions.

The CHAIRMAN:

– Order !

Senator RAE:
New South Wales

– I support the amendment. Since the expenditure during the past year is the basis for the expenditure covered by this bill, I take it that I shall be in order if I criticize the expenditure for -the yea-r 1933-34.

The CHAIRMAN:

– The honorable senator will ‘be in order so long as his remarks come within the scope of the schedule under discussion.

Senator RAE:

– In the past, a great deal of money has been expended in wrong directions. The Government has given scanty consideration to the poorer classes of the community, which have ‘been most severely hit by the depression. The Assistant Minister (Senator Lawson) says that an increased amount has been provided for public works, with a view to absorbing some of the unemployed, but I submit that the Government has made no proper attempt to deal with the national ills which are the outcome of the depression. It is content to allow things to drift, and from time to time .to offer some temporary relief, such as a dole to the farmers when the price of wheat is low. It has not done anything to prevent a recurrence of a similar national collapse in the future ; but has ‘been content with a hand-to-mouth, stop-gap policy of voting a little money here and a little money there in order to grant some small measure of relief to suffering people. Either Parliament is capable of dealing with these problems, or it is not. If Parliament is not capable of dealing with them, it should be honest enough to recognize its impotence, and to seek elsewhere for a remedy. If, however, Parliament considers that it is capable of dealing with the situation, it should set to work to do so. The policy of drift which characterizes the present Government may lead us into insolvency earlier than some of us expect.

The CHAIRMAN:

– A general discussion of the Government’s policy would have been in order on the first reading of the bill, but not now.

Senator RAE:

– The public works policy of the Government will lead us nowhere because, with a few exceptions, the works which are undertaken are not reproductive. Moreover, that policy tends to break down permanently the Australian standard of living. Various organizations and semi-governmental institutions, such as water and sewerage boards and municipal councils, are voted portions of these loan funds for the carrying out of work at the least possible cost and with no regard to arbitration awards. In that way, inroads are being made into the normal and settled rates of wages, hours of labour and other working conditions in this country. In order to grant temporary relief to a few unemployed persons recognized standards are being thrown overboard.

Senator Barnes:

– Arbitration Court awards are being stultified.

Senator RAE:

– The Government, which professes to favour arbitration, appears to be doing its best to destroy that system.

The CHAIRMAN:

– Order!

Senator RAE:

– If my criticism of the actions of the Government in the past will lead to an improvement in the future, surely my remarks are justified. Should the Government end the financial year with a surplus it should immediately restore to the public servants the amounts taken from them under the financial emergency legislation. Reductions of salary were made only to meet a financial emergency, and, therefore, with the removal of the cause, no question of 25 per cent. or 50 per cent. restoration should arise; the whole amount taken away should immediately be restored. What confidence can be placed in a government which fails to honour its solemn promise? Apparently the Government does not consider that its promise need be kept merely because no definite date for the restoration was mentioned. It is like a person who, when asked to call at any time, says that he will be round some day, and, merely because no definite date was mentioned, considers that no breach of promise has been committed by his failure to call.

Senator Duncan-Hughes:

– What about the bondholders? Do not they get anything ?

Senator RAE:

– For the most part, they get what is due to them. It is true that certain voluntary loan conversion operations have been undertaken in recent years, and bondholders have made a satisfactory bargain by taking long-term bonds in return for the securities which they surrendered. The fact remains that this Government, which believes in private enterprise, has lived up to its reputation in that respect by affording relief to an enormous extent to large taxpayers while still requiring public servants to suffer salary reductions ranging up to 22½ per cent. It has assisted the most prosperous elements in the community at the expense, largely, of public servants and invalid and old-age pensioners. The fact that this percentage deduction is still levied upon public service salaries gives the lead to private employers to treat employees in a like manner, and I know from personal knowledge that the employers are doing this to such an extent that the arbitration law has become a dead letter. In New South Wales, shopkeepers and persons controlling big businesses are paying less than award rates. They require their employees to sign dockets for the full amount for fear of dismissal. The whole system of arbitration has broken down, largely because of the connivance of this Government and its unjust policy of retaining the emergency deductions made in public service salaries.

Senator Barnes:

– In this matter, the Government is acting against the decision of the Public Service Arbitrator.

Senator RAE:

– That is so. My contention is borne out by a statement made recently by Sir Henry Gullett who attacked the Government on this point. While not claiming to he a financial expert, I affirm with every confidence that the policy that is being pursued by this Government is demoralizing and debasing the Public. Service of this country. By its system of unemployed relief, it is seeking temporarily to camouflage the real position with regard to unemployment. It is not making any serious attempt to tackle the real problem. Unless something is done soon to rectify the position, we shall find ourselves, industrially and otherwise, down to the level of the lowest nation on earth.

The CHAIRMAN:

– The honorable senator has exhausted his time.

Senator MacDONALD:
Queensland

– It is my intention to support Senator Rae’s amendment, but I do not wish to give a silent vote on this matter. I, and I assume other members of my party, would have spoken in a similar strain, but it was understood that the passage of the bill would not be delayed in any way. I agree with what Senator Rae has said. This Government has not made any serious attempts to grapple with the serious problem of unemployment. Instead of taking 100 men from Canberra to Port Augusta, where they are to be provided with work on the EastWest railway, it should consider proposals which I have advocated on other occasions in this chamber, namely, the unification of the railway gauges and the building of - a railway to the Northern Territory, via Western Queensland. Those works would provide employment for tens of thousands of men instead of a paltry hundred or so who will be given work on the transcontinental line. I should like to see the division on the amendment taken without delay, so that we may consider the items in the schedule. All members of the Labour party are fully seised of the need for a well considered plan to relieve unemployment, and, as regards the Public Service, we believe that there should be a full restoration of the salary deductions. I may add that, prior to my election to this chamber, I was a public servant in Queensland and suffered a reduction of £80 a year under the Moore Government, and there were thousands suffering similar losses. Naturally, I felt bitter about the wholebusiness. That was really one of the reasons why I am now a member of the Senate.

Question - That the request (Senator Dunn’s amendment) be agreed to - put. The committee divided. (Chairman - Senator the Hon. Herbert Hays.)

AYES: 5

NOES: 16

Majority 11

AYES

NOES

Question so resolved in the negative.

Request negatived.

Clause agreed to.

Clauses 3 and 4 agreed to.

Schedule.

Senator RAE:
New South Wales

– When speaking to my amendment prior to the division on clause 2, I had exhausted the time allotted to me under the Standing Orders, and was unable to finish what I had intended to say. I propose to do so now. I direct the attention of honorable senators to a cable message which appeared in the newspapers of this country a few months ago. It dealt with remarks made by one of the leaders of a trade union congress in India, which is supposed to be one of the most backward of the industrial countries. This official, at the termination of the conference, exhorted his followers to endeavour to retain whatever rights they possessed, otherwise, he said they would soon find themselves reduced to the coolie level of the Australian workers ! That clearly indicates what other people think of the condition of the working classes in Australia.

Senator DUNN:
New South Wales

– Under the Prime Minister’s Department provision is made for the expenditure of £10,250 in connexion with the shipping and mail service to the Pacific Islands, which amount, I understand, is to cover a portion of the subsidy paid to Burns Philp and Company. The annual payment on this account is approximately £40,000.

Senator Sir Harry Lawson:

– This is for three months based on last year’s expenditure.

Senator DUNN:

– I understand that. With the suspension of the coasting provisions of the Navigation Act. overseas vessels are now engaging in the trade between. Australia and Papua and the Mandated Territory, to the detriment of Burns Philp andCompany, which pioneered the trade with the Pacific Islands and developed it to a remarkable degree. The unfair competition with which that company has to contend is seriously affecting its operations in the Pacific. The steamers under the control of Burns Philp and Company which trade between Australia, Papua, the Mandated Territory, and the Solomon Islands are manned by white crews, whereas the vessels now conducting cruises to the South Sea Islands, and with which they have to compete, are worked by coloured labour. The men employed on the Burns Philp steamers are working under awards of the Federal Arbitration Court, while the owners of the vessels with which they are competing are not subject to the awards of that court. These overseas companies first commenced by conducting a pleasure cruise from Australia to Port Moresby, but they have since extended their opera- tions to Samarai, and according to the latest information available their ships are now to visit Rabaul.

Senator Payne:

– Hear, hear !

Senator DUNN:

– The interjection of the honorable senator shows that he is in favour of the employment of coloured labour. The vessels of the Inchcape group are now operating in direct competition with those under the control of Burns Philp and Company.

Senator Grant:

– Lord Inchcape was for many years a director of Burns Philp and Company.

Senator DUNN:

– That may be so. It isinteresting to note that the Union Steamship Company was compelled to withdraw the Manganui from the Pacific Islands trade, and place it on the AustraliaSan Francisco route owing to the vessels of the Matson Line interfering with its trade. This resulted in 400 Australian seamen being forced to walk the streets of Sydney and Wellington in search of work. If the present competition is not checked, and a larger subsidy granted to Burns Philp and Company, which is now carrying mails and passengers to the Pacific Islands and generally providing a highly satisfactory

Service, it will be forced to withdraw some of its ships, and thus throw additional men on the labour market. I trust that the Government will give greater consideration to this company, which is paying its officers, seamen, cooks and stewards the rates of wages prescribed by the Arbitration. Court.

Senator PAYNE:
Tasmania

.- It is most refreshing to hear the leader of the Lang Labour party in this chamber trying to “grease the fat pig.” I do not know what he has in mind, because every one knows that Burns Philp and Company, which is providing a magnificent service to the Mandated Teritory of New Guinea and elsewhere, is in a sound financial position. One has only to look at the current values of the company’s shares, and to study the dividends paid, to see that it is a prosperous company. It deserves to be prosperous, because of the service which it renders to the community, and because of the attention which it gives to its ships. Not. long ago, I applied for a passage from Australia to New Guinea on one of the Burns Philp boats, and although I tried to book a berth five weeks before I proposed to sail, I was informed that the ship was full. I applied twice subsequently, and each time was told that there was no room, which shows that the other vessels engaged in the trade are not interfering with the operations of Burns Philp and Company. My experience shows that the trade is prosperous, and that is possibly due to the excellent service which Burns Philp and Company is rendering, and to the manner in which it is assisting, in the development of the Mandated Territory and the Pacific Islands generally. I am glad to learn that other vessels are carrying passengers to the Mandated Territory, because I believe that there is room for them all. ‘ I am particularly anxious that New Guinea shall become more popular with tourists. The Australian people cannot have any idea of its potentialities and what it means to Australia, unless they visit it. It is ridiculous to suggest that Burns Philp and Company is being ruined by the advent of other vessels, when their ships are crowded on every trip. I cannot understand the attitude of Senator Dunn, who usually denounces the activities of those engaged in private enterprise.

Senator Dunn:

– What about the crews ?

Senator PAYNE:

– The vessels of the Burns Philp line are manned by white men who enjoy good conditions and who realize that they are working for a good company. They are treated as white men should be treated. I thought it only right that I should place these facts before the committee in refutation of the absurd allegations made by Senator Dunn.

Senator Sir HARRY LAWSON:
Assistant Minister · Victoria · UAP

[3.7]. - Having recently assumed Ministerial control of the territories mentioned on behalf of the Prime Minister, I am glad that attention has been directed to them. I am reminded that from the 9 th November, 1931, Burns Philp and Company agreed to reduce the payment under the contract for providing shipping and mail service to the Pacific Islands, from £55,000 to £44,000 - a reduction of 20 per cent. That reduction was made when the financial crisis was at its peak and when others were making substantial sacrifices in an endeavour to meet the situation which then existed. I have noted what has been said by Senator Dunn and will inform my mind concerning the actual position. I shall, if necessary, confer with the honorable senator on the subject.

Senator MacDONALD:
Queensland

. - Provision is made in the schedule for the expenditure of £29,400 for salaries and general expenses in connexion with the electoral office. I trust that honorable senators will not accuse me of having what is sometimes termed a “ bug “ in regard to this matter. If we can suggest an improvement in the present electoral system we should do so. For over twelve years, J have been studying the working of the preferential system of voting adopted in connexion with federal elections, and I have made suggestions for its improvement in this chamber from time to time. On one occasion Senator Reid agreed with the proposal I made that different political parties should have the right to arrange their candidates within the group as they desired, instead of in alphabetical order as is necessary under the electoral law. If the candidates nominated by a particular party were named, say, Anderson, Jones and Murphy, their names would, under the present law, appear on the ballot paper in that order, notwithstanding that the party might wish Murphy’s name to appear first. If the different political parties were permitted to group their candidates and one party wished to place Murphy at the top of the group it could do so. In Queensland, where the Labour party operates the plebiscite system, it was found unsatisfactory to be compelled by law to place the names in the order determined by the electoral law. We should have the right to place them in the order we desired. This is not a party matter and the alteration I suggest would increase the success of the preferential system of voting. A good deal of expenditure is incurred in conducting the electoral office and those in authority should be asked to submit proposals to improve the present preferential system.

Senator Brennan:

– Who would decide the order ?

Senator MacDONALD:

– That would be decided by the party organisation, regardless of whether it worked on the executive or the plebiscite principle of selecting its own candidates.

Senator Sir Harry Lawson:

– What would be the position of a candidate who did not receive the endorsement of any particular party ?

Senator MacDONALD:

– I propose to deal with that aspect of the question. On one occasion Senator Reid supported my proposal, probably because his surname commences with the letter “ R “ and, under the present system, appears towards the bottom of the ballot- paper regardless of the wish of his party.

Senator Sir George Pearce:

– I may inform the honorable senator that in all probability the Electoral Act will be amended before long, probably during this session.

Senator MacDONALD:

– I am glad to hear that, and I hope it will include reform in the direction I have indicated. Regarding Senator Lawson’s question, the placing of groups on the ballot-paper in alphabetical order is an absurd system.

It has been said frequently that political parties endeavour to secure suitable candidates whose surnames commence with the letter “ A “ because of the supposed advantage such a candidate would enjoy in having his name placed at the top of the ballotpaper. In a recent political ballot, I noticed that out of 25 candidates the names of no fewer than eight began with the letter “ B “ It is imagined that because of the position of “ B in the alphabet, the plebiscite selectors will prefer men whose names begin with that letter, because, having their names at the cop of the ballot-papers, they think they will be placed at the top of the ballot paper and thus have the best chance of election. The electoral officers should give serious consideration to this matter. I suggest that a better system would Joe to choose by lot the party whose representatives should be named at the top of the ballot paper. This selection could be undertaken by the electoral officers in the various States. I was glad to hear the Leader of the Government (Senator Pearce) mention that action is likely to be taken to amend the present electoral law.

Senator DUNN:
New South Wales

– I propose to reply to the criticism offered by Senator Payne, who, referring to my claim for the protection of the white Australians engaged in the coastal shipping trade, said that I was advocating “ the greasing of the fat pig”. The members of the marine trades industrial group in Sydney are much concerned about the sabotaging of the coastal steamship companies by the overser.3. companies. So far as Lord Inchcape’s control of the shares in the latter companies is concerned, I have no entree to those select clubs and circles which are open to Senator Payne. I am not aware of the whole of the ramifications of “ Comrade “ Inchcape, or any other industrial go-getters. Senator Payne, of course, is in close contact with the commercial houses of London and Japan, which are interested in cheap labour. The Australian steamship companies employ white officers and white crews, and I am pleased to have the assurance of the Minister that he will investigate their disabilities. Senator Payne comes from Tasmania, where, I am proud to say, a Labour Government was recently returned to office. I am not ashamed to place on record in Hansard the fact that one of the planks of Labour policy is the socialization or nationalization of the Australian shipping trade. Part of the policy of the ex-Prime Minister (Mr. Scullin), when he swept the polls in Tasmania, was the provision of a national steamship service between Tasmania and the mainland.

The crews, of the Aorangi and the Niagara, of the Union Steamship Company are Australians. . They total 600 and the wages and overtime paid yearly amount to approximately £60,000. Each time either ship comes into port, about 750 men are employed in getting the vessel ready for sea for the following voyage, and the two ships visit Sydney thirteen times a year. The expenditure in Sydney during the twelve months in wharf labour, repairs, stores, docking, &c, amounts to about £81,000. A similar circulation of money occurs in Australia as a result of the operations of other coastal steamship companies. For instance, Burns Philp and Company, which trades to Papua, the Mandated Territory of New Guinea, and the Solomons, employs white crews who are employed under awards of the Commonwealth Arbitration Court. Incidentally, I am of opinion that the standard of living provided for by that court should be improved. Senator Payne is in favour of Japanese and other coloured labour manning the ships that trade to this country, so it is idle for him to say that the members of my party stand for the greasing of the fat pig. Itis true that private enterprise controls the coastal steamship companies, but they give employment to thousands of Australians, and their work results in the expenditure in Australia of hundreds of thousands of pounds a year. I refer to the operations of the Union Steamship Company, Burns Philp and Company, the Adelaide Steamship Company, Huddart Parker Company, Howard Smith Company, and the Australian Steamship Company. These companies are being forced into competition with overseas shipping lines, and many of their vessels are tied up from time to time, with the result that Australian seamen have to walk “the streets and live on the dole. I hope that the Government will lose no time in taking steps to remedy this evil.

Senator MacDONALD:
Queensland

– I protest against the Postal Department being satisfied to continue with the building in Queen-street, Brisbane, known as the general post office. It is inadequate for the needs of that city, and is not in keeping with the finer structures that have been erected in its immediate neighbourhood during the last few years by private enterprise and the State Government.

Senator Sir Harry Lawson:

– No provision is made in this schedule for new works.

Senator MacDONALD:

– The present post office was erected in i860, and the people of Brisbane are not satisfied with the alignment of the city buildings, for while their post office is a two-story structure, other edifices on both sides rise to ten stories. The post office therefore is eighty years behind the times.

The CHAIRMAN:

– The honorable senator may not make more than a passing reference to that matter.

Senator MacDONALD:

– The officers of the department should consider at an early date the erection of a new post office in Brisbane in consonance with the size and importance of the city.

Senator DUNCAN-HUGHES:
South Australia

– I was interested in what Senator MacDonald said about the grouping of the candidates on the ballotpaper. His suggestion reminded me of the fact that in the last election for Adelaide a gentleman whose name began with Z was unfortunate enough to be at the bottom, of the poll. That would appear to lend support to the contention of Senator MacDonald that a man whose name begins with the letter A has a better chance at the ballot box than has a man whole name begins with, say, the letter J. In the case to which I have referred, Mr. Z secured only 655 votes out of a total of 431,634 votes; but he lost his deposit not so much ‘because of his name as because of his political views. He was a Communist. I think Senator MacDonald might be well advised to begin his reforms with his own party, before be asks Parliament to agree to abandon the present system of listing alphabetically the names on the ballot paper. Only a year ago, Mr. Yates failed in an election for the South Australian Legislative Council, being beaten by a candidate whose name commenced with 0. I understand that it is a rule of the Labour party that when two or more of its candidates contest the same election their names shall appear on the ballot paper in alphabetical order.

Senator MacDONALD:
Queensland

– The practice in connexion with plebiscites within the party to which I belong is to place the names in alphabetical order on the voting paper, but I am suggesting that when the panel of candidates has been chosen their names should be grouped on the electoral ballot paper in the order of preference indicated by the plebiscite.

Schedule agreed to.

Preamble and title agreed to.

Bill reported without, requests; report adopted.

Bill read a third time.

page 98

CUSTOMS TARIFF (NEW ZEALAND PREFERENCE) 1934

Bill received from the House of Representatives.

Standing and sessional orders suspended.

Bill (on motion by Senator McLachlan) read a first time.

Second Reading

Senator McLACHLAN:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · South Australia · UAP

– I move -

That the bill be now read a second time

The purpose of this bill is to furnish the Government with a means of carrying into effect certain provisions of the trade agreement concluded with New Zealand last year, and ratified in this Parliament towards the close of last session. Article 9 of that agreement contains a reciprocal provision which, in short, recognizes the right of New Zealand to ask Australia to admit goods from that dominion at the same rates of duty as New Zealand applies to the like Australian goods, and vice versa. If Australia fails to comply with a New Zealand request, of this kind within three months, New Zealand is at liberty to raise its tariff on the goods covered ‘by the request to the level of the Australian rates on the like New Zealand goods. The agreement with New Zealand contains two schedules. One specifies the actual rates of duty payable in New Zealand on a long list of Australian products. The other sets out the specific duties payable in Australia oh a list of New Zealand products. These lists cover the classes of goods of chief interest to the two dominions. In regard to the remaining classes of goods, that is, the residual items in the respective tariff schedules, the agreement provides that they shall be subject to the rates of duty imposed under the respective British preferential tariffs of the two dominions. Article 9 deals only with the goods not specifically mentioned in the schedules to the agreement, and it is to goods falling within this category that the bill now before honorable senators refers. This provision was practically insisted on by New Zealand for the reason that the level of the Australian British preferential tariff is higher than the level of the New Zealand preferential tariff, and, therefore, a mere exchange of British preferential tariff rates was inequitable. During the time Parliament has been in recess, New Zealand has requested that it be accorded rates equivalent to the New Zealand British preferential tariff on three lines of goods. In the absence of any enabling provisions in the Customs Tariff (New Zealand Preference) 1933, we hud to ask New Zealand to await the re-assembling of Parliament, when immediate action would be taken to comply with its requests. The exports to New Zealand in all three lines are considerable, and Australia would be distinctly the loser if the dominion exercised its right and raised the duty against Australia in the event of non-compliance within the three months allowed by the agreement.

The proposed amendment provides the machinery to enable requests of this nature from New Zealand to be met promptly. Delays in compliance lead to friction. New Zealand is a very valuable outlet for many classes of Australian goods. It is desirable to develop a spirit of reciprocity in the trade relations with our sister dominion. Without some general provision such as ib proposed in this bill, circumstances will arise in which it will not be possible to comply with the requests within the three months allowed, and we cannot reasonably ask New Zealand to meet our convenience on future occasions. The growing extent of Australia’s trade with New Zealand in the three lines to which I have referred will be seen from the fact that the value of the exports to the dominion of knitted or locks tiitched piece goods of silk or artificial silk amounted to £498 in 1930 ; £11,592 in 1931 ; £21,498 in 1932 ; and £35,717 in 1933. Australian exports to New Zealand of wireless broadcast receiving sets, not mounted in cabinets, were valued at £5,343 in 1930, £4,136 in 1931, and £37,114 in 1932. Dry batteries and dry cells to the value of £4,090, £11,838, and £34,807, respectively, were exported to New Zealand in the same years. I assure the Senate that this is merely a machinery measure, which is in accordance with the spirit of the agreement which has already been adopted. In drafting the measure certain items were overlooked.

Senator BARNES:
Victoria

.- I accept the Minister’s assurance that this is a machinery measure which will benefit Australia. When arrangements for reciprocal trade between the two dominions were being considered, I endeavoured to get something done in connexion with sporting ammunition, which was being manufactured in Melbourne. The Minister was good enough to say then that he thought the matter could be arranged in future negotiations with the Government of New Zealand. I should be glad to know if anything has been done in that direction.

Senator MCLACHLAN:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · South Australia · UAP

– The matter referred to by the Leader of the Opposition (Senator Barnes) was discussed with the New Zealand Government when Senator Massy-Greene visited that dominion, but I do not know with what result. I shall have inquiries made and inform the honorable senator later of the result.

Question resolved in the affirmative.’

Bill read a second time.

In committee:

Clauses 1 to 3 agreed to.

Clause 4 (Bates of duty on imports from the Dominion of New Zealand).

Senator GRANT:
Tasmania

.– This clause refers to the rate of duty on imports from New Zealand, whereas I thought that we were dealing only with exports to that dominion.

Senator McLachlan:

– The relevant article in the agreement operates both ways.

Senator GRANT:

– In that case the question of the importation of potatoes from New Zealand arises.

Senator Sir George Pearce:

– There are no potatoes imported from New Zealand.

Senator GRANT:

– Tasmania is endeavouring to build up an export trade in timber with New Zealand, but finds it almost impossible to got ships to carry the timber there. If a regular shipping service between Tasmania and New Zealand were established, a considerable trade could bc built up.

Clause agreed to.

Title t:greed to.

Bill reported without requests; report, ado;,ted

Bill rend a third time.

Senate adjourned at 3.56 p.m.

Cite as: Australia, Senate, Debates, 29 June 1934, viewed 22 October 2017, <http://historichansard.net/senate/1934/19340629_senate_13_144/>.

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