House of Representatives
12 May 1921

8^th Parliament · 1^st Session

QUESTION
- MR. JUSTICE HIGGINS
PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE
MISTAKES IN TELEGRAMS
SYDNEY-MELBOURNE TELEPHONE LINE
OVERSEAS MAIL CONTRACT: PAPER
QUESTION
- WAR GRATUITY BONDS
QUESTION
- SHIPBUILDING
QUESTION
- COCKATOO ISLAND ROYAL COMMISSION
QUESTION
- WAR SERVICE HOMES
QUESTION
- ALLOWANCE POST OFFICES
CONSTITUTION CONVENTION
QUESTION
- IMPORTATION OF LITERATURE
QUESTION
- CONDUCT OF BRITISH TROOPS
QUESTION
- WAR SERVICE HOMES
QUESTION
- IMPERIAL CONFERENCE
TARIFF DEBATE
- Rights of Honorable Members
QUESTION
- COCKATOO ISLANDDOCK YARD
QUESTION
- RABBIT GRADERS
QUESTION
- BOOK POSTAGE
QUESTION
- SILVER COINAGE
QUESTION
- AUSTRALIAN IMPERIAL FORCE
QUESTION
- IMPORTS FROM AMERICA
QUESTION
- ARBITRATION COURT
QUESTION
- COMPULSORY TRAINEES’ UNIFORMS
QUESTION
- WOOD FOR PAPER PULP
QUESTION
- INVALID AND OLD-AGE PENSIONS
QUESTION
- REPAIRS TO COMMONWEALTH BUILDINGS
QUESTION
- WAR-TIME PROFITS TAX
QUESTION
- WHEAT AND FLOUR
QUESTION
- OVER WEIGHT WHEAT BAGS
WESTRALIAN FARMERS AGREEMENT BILL (No. 2)
QUESTION
- PERTH NEW GENERAL POST OFFICE
QUESTION
- TARIFF
PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE
- Resignation of Mr. Atkinson
ADJOURNMENT
- Silver Coinage

The Clerk announced the unavoidable absence of Mr. Speaker. Mr. Deputy Speaker took the chair at 2.31 p.m., and read prayers.

page 8393

QUESTION

MR. JUSTICE HIGGINS

Mr BLAKELEY:
DARLING, NEW SOUTH WALES

– Will the Acting Prime Minister consult with Mr. Justice Higgins with a view to the retention of his services in the Arbitration Court? I understand that he is reluctant to abandon that work, and it will be a great loss to Australia if he leaves the Bench.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I do not know of the reluctance of Mr. Justice Higgins to abandon his work, but I know that he has more than once definitely stated his intention to resign, and reminded me of the fact the other day. I shall consider the matter, but at present I do not see that I should confer with him on the subject. I take it that he is now clearing up his work preparatory to putting into effect his declared intention to resign the presidency of the Arbitration Court.

page 8393

PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE

Mr.GRE GORY. - The Parliamentary Standing Committee on Public Worksis a Committee created by an Act. of Parliament, and is the servant, not of the Government, but of Parliament. This House refers matters to it for investigation, and it is the Committee’s duty to report direct to the Parliament. Last year, among the references to the Committee were two for the investigation of proposals to continue the railway north from Oodnadatta and southwards from the Northern Territory. The references were to the whole Committee, but,so that the investigations might be made as economically as possible, the Committee decided that the work should be done by a sectional Committee. The Act prescribes that a sectional Committee shall consist of not less than three members. There are, however, difficulties in the way of getting three members to go on this journey. Personally, Ishould much like to make an investigation of the country that the railway would traverse,andIthink,notwithstanding the criticism about the cost of the proposed inquiry, that it would be of great advantage to this Parliament to know much more of the interior and northern parts of the continent. However, owing to engagements in connexion with the Tariff, itis impossible for me to go. What I wish to ask now, though I am in doubt as to whom I should address the question, is whether Parliament will withdraw these references, should it be thought undesirable to carry out the investigations, or ask the members of the existing Committee to tender their resignations, so that other members may be appointed who would give effect to the instructions of Parliament? I do not know if the Acting Prime Minister can tell us what the Government desirein this matter, but I think that one of those courses should be taken. Any investigation that is made must be made during the winter months. Motor oars have been purchased for the work, and, fuel and food supplies have been sent along the track. If the Committee is to make the investigations this year it must start within the next few months.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– The Government - and, I take it, the Parliament - desires that these investigations shall be proceeded with. Apparently the Committee, after asking for a vote to provide for the proposed expedition, is now on strike. It is rather a pity that members of the Committee did not, before they incurred all this expense, say that they would not make the investigation. I do not know any details about the matter beyond those that the honorable member has given me. The position is that the House has instructed the Committee to make these investigations.

page 8394

MISTAKES IN TELEGRAMS

Mr.NICHOLLS. -Recently a person sent a telegram containing the statement that she was prepared to sell a house at a certain price-I think£40-but the official who forwarded her communication to the neighbouring.Post Office made a mistake of£20 in transmitting the amount mentioned in it, in consequence of which the seller of the house lost that sum. The Postmaster-General’s Department was informed of the error, and the Deputy PostmasterGeneral for New South Wales admitted it to be the fault of a depart mental official, but he said that the Department could not, under any circumstances, compensate the person who had been damaged. I ask the PostmasterGeneral if he will give the assurance that in cases of thiskind the Postal Department, and- not the senders of telegrams, shall bear anylossthat may be caused by the mistakes of departmental officials.

Mr WISE:
Postmaster-General · GIPPSLAND, VICTORIA · NAT

– Whatever is the liability of the Department under the Post and Telegraph Act we shall accept it.

page 8394

SYDNEY-MELBOURNE TELEPHONE LINE

Mr. GREGORY presented the report and minutes of evidence of the Committee of Public Works upon the proposed erection of an additional trunk telephone line between Sydney and Melbourne.

Ordered to be printed.

page 8394

OVERSEAS MAIL CONTRACT: PAPER

Mr WISE:
NAT

– I lay upon the table the following paper: -

Mail Service to Europe-Agreement, dated 27th April, 1921, between the Honorable G. H. Wise, . Postmaster-General for the Commonwealth, and the Orient Steam Navigation Company Limited, for the Conveyance of Mails between Great Britain’ and Australia;

Ordered to be printed.

Mr WISE:
PostmasterGeneral · Gippsland · NAT

.- (By leave.)- The present contract with the Orient Steam-ship Company Limited was entered into on the 15th November, 1907, and provided for a fortnightly mail service between Australia and Great Britain, which alternating with a fortnightly service entered into between the British Government and the Peninsular and Oriental Steam Navigation Company, gave us a regular weekly mail service. The Orient Steam-ship Company Limited gave us twenty-four calendar mon ths notice of their intention to terminate the contract, which will expire oh the 18th September, 1921.In view of the approaching termination of the present agreement, negotiations were entered into by the Government with representatives of the Orient Steam-ship Company Limited. The latter stated that, in their opinion, it was desirable to treat the immediate future as a transitional period, and that it would be unwise for the Commonwealth Government to enter into commitments of an onerous and far-reaching character at the present level of prices, whilst the same reason, combined with the uncertainty as to future revenue, would make such commitments wholly unacceptable to the company. They therefore proposed an arrangement of a temporary nature, whichwould cover the transitional period referred to, and which could be terminated by either party giving twelve calendar months’ notice at any time. Their proposal provided for thirteen despatches per annum each way at four-weekly intervals (which was the most frequent service they could give with the vessels at their disposal), and was based generally on the terms and conditions of the present contract. The. result of the negotiations was that an arrangement has been entered into under which the Orient Steam-ship Company Limited have agreed to continue to carry mails under the terms of the present contract subject to the following alterations: -

That the contract be terminable on twelve months’ notice by either party, which may be given at any period of the year.
That the company will provide for a four-weekly service instead of a fortnightly service as in the original contract.
That the mail ports be Marseilles, or Toulon, or other approved European port, and Fremantle, instead ofBrindisi (or other approved port) and Adelaide. It may be stated here that all first-class mail matter now comes from Fremantle by train, and it is proposed, apart from this agreement, to bring secondclass mail matter also.
That the period of transit shall be 632 hours out and 644 hours on return. This is only six hours less each way than the present contract period between Brindisi and Adelaide, although the distance from Toulon to Fremantle is about 500 miles shorter, but the company state that it is impossible to do the voyage more quickly with the coal now supplied to them, which they say is the best they can get.
That the subsidy be £130,000 per annum for a four- weekly service, as against £170,000 for a fortnightly service.
The company will call at Adelaide, Melbourne, Sydney, and Brisbane, as under the present contract, and Hobart three times a year (it was six times under the fortnightly service), giving the PostmasterGeneral power to allow them to omit Hobart as in the present contract.
Refrigerated space will be provided in the four regular steamers, but, if necessity arises, they have power, as in the present contract, to use one other steamer which may not be refrigerated. They state that the extra steamer which they intend to use is the Ormuz, which is now being refrigerated.
Instead of their charges for butter and fruit being fixed, as in the present contract, the new agreement stipulates that the contractors shall not, without the written approval of the Postmaster-General, charge, demand, or receive for the carriage of butter or fruit upon a mailship any higher rates of freight than the current ruling rates of freight charged or received (after deduction of all rebates allowed or allowable) for the carriage of butter or fruit on other lines of steamships regularly engaged in the trade between the ports of call in the Commonwealth and the port or ports of discharge of the mailship. 9: The contract is subject to the British Government arranging with the Peninsular and Oriental Steam Navigation Company for an alternate four-weekly service, thus establishing a regular fortnightly service between Australia and Great Britain.

Articles of agreement on the lines of the present contract amended to carry out the aforesaid alterations - omitting or modifying such conditions as the altered circumstances render inoperative or inappropriate, as, for instance, the clauses relating to the building ofnew ships, the option of the Postmaster-General to purchase the steamers, &c. - have been entered into, and I now lay them upon the table of the House, and move -

That the document be printed.

The agreement is the best we can secure at the present time, and will provide for a regular fortnightly service (for there is little doubt but that the alternate fourweekly P. andO Service will be arranged), and being terminable on short notice, will enable the Commonwealth Government, as soon as the opportunity arises, to make provision for a service of greater frequency and travelling speed. It is subject to the approval of Parliament, and to-morrow I shall move accordingly.

Mr HIGGS:
CAPRICORNIA, QUEENSLAND

-When the PostmasterGeneral submits his motion to-morrow, for the ratification of the mail contract agreement, will he state the departmental view as to whether Australia would be at a disadvantage if there were no contract of the kind ?

Mr WISE:

– Yes.

Mr MAKIN:
HINDMARSH, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

– Has it been decided that the Outer Harbor, in South Australia, shall be one of the ports of call under the renewed Imperial mail contract?

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:
WAKEFIELD, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · ANTI-SOC; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917; LP from 1922; NAT from 1925

– The PostmasterGeneral has just indicated that.

Mr MAKIN:

– I was not clear whether it had been definitely announced that the Outer Harbor was to continue to be a port of call.

Mr WISE:

– There is the same provision in that respect as in the present contract.

page 8396

QUESTION

WAR GRATUITY BONDS

Mr McGRATH:
BALLAARAT, VICTORIA

– Is the Treasurer in a position to make a statement regarding the promised cash payment by the Commonwealth of one-third cash in respect of the war gratuity bonds?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I hope to be able to make a definite statement to the House by Wednesday next.

page 8396

QUESTION

SHIPBUILDING

Mr WATKINS:
NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES

– Is it the final de cision of the Government to do no shipbuilding outside the Commonwealth Yards, or is there any hope of the yard belonging to the State Government of New South Wales being given a contract later to build one of the larger vessels?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

-So far as I know the decision of the Government is that the remaining ships to be built in pursuance of the programme laid down several years ago shall be built in our own yards, and I regret to have to say that we cannot undertake to keep the State ship-building yards going also.

page 8396

QUESTION

COCKATOO ISLAND ROYAL COMMISSION

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– Has the attention of the Minister for the Navy been called to the action of a highly paid official in calling his subordinate officer “ a blanky liar” at the Cockatoo Island inquiry, when that subordinate officer was giving evidence on oath ? Has the Minister suspended that highly paid official? If not does the Minister desire this incident to be taken as a precedent for highly paid officers to insult their subordinates?

Mr LAIRD SMITH:
Minister for the Navy · DENISON, TASMANIA · NAT

– Speaking on the spur of the moment I question whether I have authority to deal with any witnessappearing before a Royal Commission, but in order that I may give a considered reply, I ask the honorable member to give notice of the question.

page 8396

QUESTION

WAR SERVICE HOMES

Arr angementWith South Australian Government.

Mr BLUNDELL:
ADELAIDE, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

– I ask the Assistant Minister for Repatriation whether, under the arrangement made by the Commonwealth with the South Australian Government for the building of War Service Homes, the men who are not covered by the State Act will have to wait until that Act is amended before houses are built or purchased for them.

Mr RODGERS:
WANNON, VICTORIA · LP; NAT from 1917

– The agreement made between the Commonwealth Government and the South Australian Government under which the State, in order to prevent the duplication of expense, has undertaken the construction of War Service Homes in that State, includes an arrangement that all the applicants who are not to-day covered by the State Act, but are beneficiaries under the War Service

Homes Act, may submit their applications, which will be examined and, if in order, approved and ready to be acted upon as soon as the State Act is amended to bring it into line with the Commonwealth Act.

page 8397

QUESTION

ALLOWANCE POST OFFICES

Mr NICHOLLS:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES

– Will the PostmasterGeneral make an investigation into the housing accommodation of the allowance postmasters and postmistresses? Does he know that a great number of the persons so employed are living in houses which are most unsuitable for human habitation?

Mr WISE:
NAT

– The Department does not provide housing accommodation for the employees indicated by the honorable member.

Mr Nicholls:

– It does provide the premises, and the Postmaster-General knows it.

page 8397

CONSTITUTION CONVENTION

Mr FENTON:
MARIBYRNONG, VICTORIA

– With a view to economy .

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I will listen to this.

Mr FENTON:

– With a, view to effecting considerable economy, and also with the object of having the work done expeditiously and well, will the Leader of the Government assure this House that the Government do not intend to proceed in the matter of the election of delegates to the Convention for the amendment of the Constitution, but that they will allow that duty to devolve upon the proper authority - this Parliament - thereby insuring the thorough and expeditious completion of the task?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I can promise to take into consideration any matter intended to effect economy. But I cannot promise that the; undemocratic proposal which the honorable member now makes will be agreed to, even in the interests of economy.

Mr Considine:

– This is the first time the Treasurer has admitted that this Parliament is not democratic.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– No one has contended that the Constitution is democratic. A compromise between the various States resulted in the Constitution of the Federal Legislature. No one will pretend, for instance, that the Senate is based upon a democratic franchise. Its basis is upon - a State franchise. I am afraid I cannot promise that what the honorable member asks will be done.

page 8397

QUESTION

IMPORTATION OF LITERATURE

Mr ANSTEY:
BOURKE, VICTORIA

– In view of the invasion of this country by a mass of disloyal and pernicious literature, and in view of the fact that the Minister for Trade and Customs, in order to protect the country, has appointed certain persons to the duty of guarding the morals of the community, is the Acting Prime Minister of opinion that the persons so appointed are sufficiently qualified to be employed for the purpose of protecting Australia from such literature ? And will he, in order to see that our -people are properly safeguarded, read such imported literature himself?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I will not do so.

Mr ANSTEY:

– In view of the fact that the country’ has not been sufficiently protected by any prohibitions that may have been made, upon the importation of disloyal and pernicious literature, and having regard to the further fact that there are large numbers of disloyal persons in the community, will the Minister take the necessary precaution to furnish an assurance that every person in Australia, before expressing _ or writing an opinion, shall first obtain the indorsement of the Acting Prime Minister, or of such persons as he may appoint for such duty, in order that the views so expressed by those disloyalists shall be made to sound or read properly loyal . and, therefore, innocuous?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I shall answer that question when it has been placed upon the notice-paper. Incidentally, I defy the honorable member to transpose all those words of his upon paper.

page 8397

QUESTION

CONDUCT OF BRITISH TROOPS

Statements of Senator Elliott. ,

Mr McGRATH:

– Has the Assistant Minister for Defence read a report of the utterances of Senator Elliott in another place yesterday when he made a serious allegation to the effect that the British troops ran away in the battle of Amiens? If so, what action is it proposed to take regarding these statements of this unpatriotic gentleman?

Sir GRANVILLE RYRIE:
Assistant Minister for Defence · NORTH SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · NAT

– I have not read the speeches of Senator Elliott, and I have nothing whatever to do with what another individual does or says in another place. I do not intend, therefore, to take any such action as the honorable member indicates.

page 8398

QUESTION

WAR SERVICE HOMES

Fees Paid to Messrs. Kirkpatrick

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– Will the Assistant Minister for Repatriation make inquiries and inform this- House of the total amount claimed by Messrs. Kirkpatrick for fees in connexion with plans for the construction of War Service Homes ? And will he state specifically the total sum paid to that firm of architects for such plans ?

Mr RODGERS:
WANNON, VICTORIA · LP; NAT from 1917

– No contract exists, nor has any ever been made between the Commonwealth and Messrs. Kirkpatrick for the supply of architectural plans in connexion with War Service Homes. But an arrangement was entered into with the firm in question when the Commonwealth banking authorities were given the task of erecting homes. If the honorable member will put his question on the notice-paper I shall endeavour to obtain the information required.

– We may ask, but such a request is one which might well be left to be determined in the same manner as hitherto. I have yet to learn that the proceedings of a confidential Imperial Cabinet can all be published. Such reports as are published we shall be entitled to receive no doubt.

page 8398

TARIFF DEBATE

Rights of Honorable Members

Mr WATKINS:
NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP; FLP from 1931

– This House is about to enter, in Committee, upon the consideration of the individual items in the Tariff schedule. I understand that previous rulings which have been given from the Chair regarding the rights of honorable members in the matter of moving amendments have been reviewed. In view of that position, I wish to know whether, before the Committee comes to the stage of item-by-item consideration, it would not be wise if honorable members were informed exactly of their rights and privileges in this respect.

Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER (Hon J M Chanter:
RIVERINA, NEW SOUTH WALES

– It would not be competent for me, at the present stage, to refer to what may be done in Committee. When the question indicated by the honorable member arises during the discussion in Committee upon the Tariff schedule, item by item, the Chairman of Committees will then, no doubt, make known his ruling in the matter. It will be for the Committee thereupon to accept or dissent from his ruling and, by its vote, to determine whether such decision shall stand.

page 8398

QUESTION

COCKATOO ISLANDDOCK YARD

Appointment of Board

Mr J H CATTS:

– I understand that a Board or Commission has been appointed, or arranged for, with respect to the management of Cockatoo Island Dock Yard. Is the Acting Prime Minister in a position to announce the names of the members of that body ?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I suggest that the honorable member put his question upon the notice-paper. I do not quite know what has been done, but I understand that steps have been taken to shape up a Board for the future management of the concern.

Mr Riley:

– The members have been appointed, I believe.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I will procure the information if the question is placed upon the business-paper.

page 8399

QUESTION

RABBIT GRADERS

Mr CONSIDINE:

asked the Minister for Trade and Customs, upon notice -

Whether the rabbit graders in Sydney (engaged in grading rabbits for export) are employees of the exporting companies or employed by the Commonwealth Government?
Are the graders employed in doing the same class of work in Victoria employees of the Commonwealth or of private employers?
What is the reason for the difference in control, if any, in the two States mentioned?

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow: -

Rabbit graders in New South Wales engaged in grading rabbits for export areemployed by the Commonwealth Government.
Employees of the Commonwealth Government.
See replies to questions 1 and 2.

page 8399

QUESTION

BOOK POSTAGE

Mr FLEMING:
ROBERTSON, NEW SOUTH WALES

asked the Postmaster-

General, upon notice -

Are books by more than one author not allowed to be sent by parcel post?
Do officials refuse to take more than five parcels of books from any one firm on any one day?

Mr WISE:
NAT

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow: -

No.
At certain offices postings of parcels by any one person in any one day arc restricted to five in number. These offices, however, are contiguous to an office at which postings may be made without limit as to number.

page 8399

QUESTION

SILVER COINAGE

Mr WEST:
EAST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

asked the Treasurer,upon notice -

What was the amount of silver coinage minted by the Imperial Government for the Commonwealth of Australia during 1920?
Does the said coinage contain only thirty per cent. of silver?
Does the silver coinage minted in Australia contain ninetyper cent. of silver?
What steps will the Government take with the view of dealing with any coinage containing only thirty per cent. of silver?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow: -

£115,350. This coin was manufactured by the Royal Mint,Melbourne. 2, 3, and 4. The whole of the Australian silver coinage, including that referred to in Question 1, contains 92.5 per cent. of fine silver.

page 8399

QUESTION

AUSTRALIAN IMPERIAL FORCE

Appeals Against Injustices

Mr FLEMING:

asked the Acting Prime Minister, . upon notice-

In view of the serious allegationsbeing made concerning injustices to officers andmen while serving in the. A.I.F., does the Government intend taking action to meet the situation?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– The procedure for review of decisions by higher authority in any case in which a member of the A.I.F. might feel wronged was provided in the Act and Regulations under which the A.I.F. served, and could have been exercised at the time. The Government are of opinion that, in view of the lapse of time and the dispersal of the A.I.F., it is not practicable to review these decisions now.

page 8399

QUESTION

IMPORTS FROM AMERICA

Ratesof Exchange

Mr CHARLTON:
HUNTER, NEW SOUTH WALES

asked the Minister for Trade and Customs, upon notice -

Does the Government propose to introduce legislation to deal with the question of bank exchange in arriving at the value for duty of imports from theUnited States?

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

– This matter is receiving consideration.

page 8399

QUESTION

ARBITRATION COURT

Deputy Presidents

Mr HIGGS:

asked the Acting Prime Minister, upon notice -

Has he any announcement to make with regard to the appointment of Deputy Presidents of the Commonwealth Arbitration Court?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Not at present.

page 8399

QUESTION

COMPULSORY TRAINEES’ UNIFORMS

Mr NICHOLLS:

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Defence, upon notice -

Have a number of youths who are subject to compulsory training had to attend drill in their civilian clothes; if so, will theMinister consider the question of compensating each youth for damage done to his private clothes whilst at drill?
Is there at the present time a shortage of youths’ military uniforms; if so, will the

Minister consider the advisability of suspending compulsory drill until each trainee is fully equipped with a uniform?

Sir GRANVILLE RYRIE:
NAT

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow: -

A number of Senior Cadets of the two junior quotas have attended drill in their civilian clothes. During the training year 1920-21 there has been no shortage of uniforms for either the Citizen Forces or the two elder quotas of Senior Cadets. The Government decided, late in 1920, to supply an athletic outfit instead of a military uniform, and supplies of these had then to be arranged for. It is not considered there would ordinarily be any justification for compensating youths who wear plain clothes at drill, but exceptional cases of destruction or severe damage due to accident whilst in the performance of military exercises receive full consideration.
It is anticipated that full supplies will be available by 30th June next for all youths required to train, and it is not considered that any change should be made in - the present policy of the Department in respect to training.

page 8400

QUESTION

WOOD FOR PAPER PULP

Dr EARLE PAGE:
COWPER, NEW SOUTH WALES · FSU; CP from 1920

asked the Minister for Trade and Customs, upon notice -

Whether, in view of the favorable report by Messrs. Smith and Baker, of the New South Wales Technological Department, upon the suitability, from laboratory tests, of the North-Coast softwoods for mechanical paper pulp making, the Bureau of Science and Industry will arrange for the collection and transport of the more common of these woods and their manufacture into paper pulp at the Forests Products Laboratory in Western Australia?1

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

– So far, the investigations have been confined to those classes of timbers of which there are vast quantities spread over a wide area. I will, however, bring the honorable member’s suggestion under the notice of -the Director of the Institute; and, if the limited funds available for this purpose enable it to be done, I will be glad to make arrangements to have the timbers referred to by the honorable member tested as to their suitability for paper making.

page 8400

QUESTION

INVALID AND OLD-AGE PENSIONS

Mr NICHOLLS:

asked the Treasurer, upon notice -

Whether he will consider the advisability of amending the Old-age and Invalid Pensions

Act so as to enable a man and his wife, who have mutually agreed to separate without having any judgment of a Court or a deed of separation, to draw the old-age or invalid pension?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– The Commissioner already has power under the Act to ignore the income and property of a claimant’s husband or wife in these cases if he considers it equitable, and to decide the application in the light of the claimant’s circumstances only. This amendment was made by section 9 of the Invalid and Old-age Pensions Act 1912.

page 8400

QUESTION

REPAIRS TO COMMONWEALTH BUILDINGS

Mr J H CATTS:

asked the Minister for Works and Railways, upon notice -

Did repair work, which has been going on in New South Wales for the past year or two, practically cease by the end of March, as the winter was approaching?
Would it be possible to so regulate expenditure passed on the Estimates as to equalize the consequent employment throughout the year ?

Mr GROOM:
Minister for Works and Railways · DARLING DOWNS, QUEENSLAND · NAT

– The answers to the honorable member’s questions are as follow : -

No.
This is being done as far as practicable.

page 8400

QUESTION

WAR-TIME PROFITS TAX

Mr NICHOLLS:

asked the Treasurer, upon notice -

Whether he will consider the question of having a certain amount of money placed upon the Estimates for the purpose of refunding to all co-operative societies trading under the Rochdale system all amounts paid by such societies under the War-time Profits Act?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– The war-time profits tax was paid by the societies referred to in respect of the year 1915-16 only. When the amending Act was passed exempting these societies from the tax, the question of making the exemption retrospective was carefully considered, and it was decided that it should apply only to the year then current and future years. I see no reason for now reversing this decision.

Mr Nicholls:

– There does not seem to be much hope of these people getting a refund.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I am afraid not.

page 8401

QUESTION

WHEAT AND FLOUR

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– On the 20th April the honorable member for Hindmarsh (Mr. Makin) asked the following question : -

Will the Prime Minister provide the following information: -

The amount of wheat gristed into flour for the years 1917, 1918, 1919, and 1920, for the respective States of the Commonwealth?

The prices charged per bushel for such wheat during the above years?

The Prime Minister intimated that the information would be furnished as soon as available, and I now desire to inform the honorable member that ‘the quantity of wheat gristed into flour by the four States associated with the wheat scheme is as follows: - New South Wales - 1917, 18,529,000 bushels; 1918, 19,896,000 bushels; 1919, 20,667,000 bushels; 1920, 9,932,000 bushels. Victoria - 1917, 16,274,000 bushels; 1918, 17,442,000 bushels; 1919, 16,733,000 bushels; 1920, 14,158,000 bushels. Western Australia- 1917, 4,739,000 bushels; 1918, 6,091,000 bushels; 1919, 6,814,000 bushels; 1920, 5,516,000 bushels. South Australia- 1916- 17, 5,101,000 bushels; 1917-18, 6,621,000 bushels; 1918-19, 6,760,000 bushels; 1919-20, 6,702,000 bushels. The South Australian returns have been obtained by the South Australian Wheat Harvest Board from the State Statistician, whose records relate to financial years, and not to calendar years. The prices charged for wheat per bushel for the years 1917, 1918, 1919, and 1920 were:- Local consumption price - 1917, 4s. 9d.; 1918, 4s. 9d.; 1919, 4s. 9d. to 5s. 6d.; 1920, 6s. 6d. to, 7s.8d. Price for flour for export - 1917, 5s. 4½d. to 7s.; 1918, 6s. to 6s. 4½d.; 1919, 6s. 4½d. to 8s. 7½d.; 1920, 8s. 7½d. to 16s.

page 8401

QUESTION

OVER WEIGHT WHEAT BAGS

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– On the 29th April the honorable member for Hindmarsh (Mr. Makin) asked -

Whether the Prime Minister will institute inquiries concerning the over weight of bags of wheat, according to the standards adopted, at Port Pirie, consigned per s.s. Roserie, 28th March last, wherein a whole truck load was found to be over weight, some bags to the excess of 13 lbs.; also per ship Manicia, on 20th inst. ?

I have now received information from the South Australian Wheat Harvest Board to the effect that the average weight per bag of the Roserie shipment was 176.2 lbs., and the highest average of any one truck load was 185.4 lbs. per bag. The average weight of the Manicia shipment was 176.1 lbs. per bag. Three bags only weighed 200 lbs. .

WAYS AND MEANS (Formal).

Anzac Day : Paymentof Wages - Oldage, Invalid, and Military Pensions - Munition Workers - Ex- Warrant Officer Little - War Service Homes - Employment of Returned Soldiers - War Gratuity Act - Basic Wage: “The Next Step” - Australian Coat-of Arms- Immigration Officer : Captain T. Rees - Postal and Telephonic Services - Trade with Germany - Duplication of Federal and State Taxation and Electoral Machinery - Arbitration Court: Mr. Justice Higgins - Income Tax Anomalies - Industrial Position : Reduction of Wages.

Question - That Mr. Deputy Speaker do now leave the chair, and that the House resolve itself into Committee of Ways and Means - proposed.

Mr MATHEWS:
Melbourne Ports

– The merit of holding a holiday on Anzac Day is beyond debate, but the whole community should be treated alike. Although the Government, on the recent celebration of the day, gave its servants a holiday on full pay, the onlyproper method by which a holiday could be given, many large employers of labour gave their workmen a forced holiday without pay. The Government could not justify the holding of a pageant except by paying the men who took the day off in order to assist in it, and when they announced their intention to do this, I asked the Prime Minister if he could manage to get the Employers Federation and the Chambers of Manufactures to show their loyalty by paying the employees to whom they would be giving the day off. There are many large manufacturing establishments in the Melbourne Ports electorate who displayed their loyalty by closing their establishments, but; unfortunately, their workmen drew no pay for the day, although I am certain that, at the end of the year, the profits of these firms would not be affected if they had chosen to pay their employee£ for their lost time. According to a letter 1 have received, the Dunlop Rubber Company gave their employees a forced holiday without pay. I think the Government, either by moral suasion, or by legislation, should take steps to prevent flag-waggers from putting their men off on Anzac Day without paying them. The occasion is one that can only be fitly commemorated by men who are “not losing their wages through not working on the day. In most cases, the soldiers who took part in the public proceedings were paid; but I am led to believe that many private employers did not pay their men. I should like the Government to take into consideration the desirableness of making it compulsory that employees who are granted a holiday on Anzac Day shall receive payment for it. The War Precautions Act, during the war, was used against me, and many other- supporters of the principles of the Labour party, and if any part of it is in operation next year advantage might be taken of it to compel employers - who in war time waved the flag to some purpose in the shape of larger dividends and increased bank accounts - to pay their men for Anzac Day. It would be better, however, to introduce special legislation on the subject.

I wish now to draw the attention of the Government to .an important matter relating to invalid and old-age pensions. There is in existence at the present time a most remarkable regulation dealing with invalid pensions. The man who rears a largo family does a service to the community, and the cost should be a community charge. If he has, amongst his family, an invalid son or daughter, that iii valid, after reaching the age of sixteen years, may in certain circumstances claim an invalid pension; but I know of many instances where men bear the whole cost of the maintenance of such children. In pre-w.ar days the Department had a method of calculating the cost of keeping a family of four or five, and if the earnings pf the father of an invalid child were in excess of that amount the invalid could not obtain the pension.’

.- I. desire to supplement the remarks of the honorable member for Melbourne Ports (Mr. Mathews) and the honorable member for Oxley (Mr. - Bayley). If there are any in the community deserving of our most favorable consideration they are those to whom reference has been made. I am hopeful that the Treasurer (Sir Joseph Cook:) will see- his way to make provision, particularly for those who are so unfortunate as to- suffer from complaints of a tubercular character. Surely some relief might be given to the oldage and invalid pensioners who are- inmates of our public institutions. I drew attention to this subject last “grievance day,” and at every opportunity I shall raise my voice on behalf of these persons, for they are suffering great hardship because of the unsympathetic attitude of those in authority. In many ways the administration of the Old-age and Invalid Pensions Act might be improved, but, unfortunately, the Treasurer (Sir Joseph Cook), apparently, does not appreciate the advantage that would accrue to the pensioners if the present disabilities were removed.

– It is unfortunate that he should be under this disability because of a conspiracy worked up against him by native contractors, who could not substantiate their charges, and whose evidence was, in the opinion of the officer who held the inquiry, contradictory and unreliable. When he was given his discharge he pointed out to the Defence Department that it might work to his detriment in obtaining employment in future, but he was not given a reasonable opportunity to secure justice. His fears have been confirmed by the fact of his having been deprived of portion of his gratuity, and being under a disability in regard to appointment in the Government Service. I am pleased that there are in this House, and in another place, members who are prepared to support the claim for an inquiry into the treatment of soldiers who allege that they have been wrongfully accused. I am pleasedthat there is in Parliament such a person as Senator Elliott, who has already been very outspoken concerning the grievances amongst returned soldiers, and I hope that as a result of representations by him and other parliamentarians who are in sympathy with those who have been harshly treated by the Defence Department, we shall be able, ultimately, to secure justice for them.

Mr WEST:
East Sydney

.- I rise to support the remarks made by the honorable member for Melbourne Ports (Mr. Mathews) regarding the amounts paid to old-age pensioners in institutions. I am fully aware of the facts of these cases, and I know that the officers administering the old-age and invalid pensions are not responsible for the present state of things. The policy they adopt is the outcome of the decision of the State Premiers in Conference. At the time a Liberal Government was in power in New South Wales, and the Liberals have not the same sympathy for the workers as has a Labour Government. They contended that the payment of old-age pensions was, a liability of the Commonwealth, and that if a State maintained a pensioner the pension should be paid to the institution instead of to the individual. It was arranged that out of the total pension 2s. per week only should be paid to the pensioner, and that the balance should go to the State institution. I, like many others, thought that a very mean action. But the Commonwealth Government acquiesced in the proposal of the State Premiers. Hardship is experienced also by unfortunate persons who are suffering from tuberculosis or miners’ diseases. I know of men of between fifty and sixty years of age who, because of having worked in sewerage tunnels, were so helpless that they were compelled to enter institutions. The disease which they contracted required a lot of attention, and it was not safe for them to live with their families in the small houses which they are compelled to occupy on account of the high rents. Once a person has entered an institution he is debarred from getting an old-age pension. Many of these inmates of the institutions have no homes, and I have advised them to leave the institution during the warm weather and sleep in the Domain. They could then go to the Pensions Office and fill in an application, stating their residence as “ The palace called the Domain.” In this way they may qualify for their pension. When cases of this kind come under my notice, I go to the Pension Office, fill in the forms, and do not leave until the registrar has assured me that everything is in order. Unfortunately, when the pensioner returns to the institution, the State, in its avarice, takes all the pension except 2s. per week. That allowance of 2s. was fixed when the pension was 12s 6d., and it is still the same although the pension has been increased to 15s. The State Governments have not shown a liberal spirit. Many of the old pensioners have said to me, . “ They might have given us half-a-crown, Jack.” I agree with them, and sometimes I give them a little help from my own pocket. However, I exonerate the officers in the Pensions Department from all responsibility for this parsimonious policy. I have given some attention to the case of a pensioner who Las now reached the age of seventy-six years. Being a Scotsman, he in his younger days saved sufficient money to buy for himself an annuity of £30. When he applied for his old-age pension the Department deducted the amount of the annuity, leaving the old fellow a pension of only £4 per annum. The wealthy people in our midst are for ever preaching thrift to the workers, and the reward of this old man for his foresight and thrift was a reduction of his pension to £4. That was not the worst; the Department further capitalized the annuity and claimed the right to deduct a further £9, so that he now does not receive a threepenny bit from the pension scheme. That instance ought to make Ministers think when they draw their own salaries. When I get my cheque at the end of each month, I wonder how the old fellows who get nothing are faring. I feel a good deal of sympathy for all these cases, because I have always made it a practice through life to imagine myself in the position of others less fortunate than I. I know of a German, eighty-five years of age, who until a few years ago worked honestly for his living. He was brought to Australia by the Queensland Government about fifty years ago as an instructor in the making of bread in the northern part of the State, where the heat has a detrimental effect upon the yeast. For many years he worked for the Government,but, unfortunately, he contracted rheumatism, and in ten years spent every penny he had put by for a rainy day in trying to relieve his pain and agony. The fine spirit of the man is shown by the fact that he was a trade unionist all his life; and if it were not for the brotherly love that exists between unionists he would not have been able to live when illness overtook him.

To-day I asked a question of the Treasurer (Sir Joseph Cook) regarding silver coinage, and received a very unsatisfactory answer. As the Treasurer is not in the chamber now I shall take another opportunity of speaking upon this subject.

Mr McGRATH:
Ballarat

.- I regret that only the Minister for the Navy is present in the Chamber. The present opportunity is practically the sole chance of private members to make known to Ministers grievances arising in their constituencies, and it is a shame that they should not be present on grievance day. They have three clear days in each week, as well as two additional mornings, in which to deal with departmental affairs; and I maintain that their place is in this House to-day.

I desire first to make some remarks regarding old-age and invalid pensions, concerning which I concur with the views of the honorable member for Melbourne Ports (Mr. Mathews). It is all very well for the honorable member for Kalgoorlie (Mr. Foley) to say that the State authorities should deal with invalids who cannot secure their pensions because their parents are earning incomes which, under the Act, preclude the granting of the pension.

Mr Foley:

– Your State ought to look after these people.

Mr McGRATH:
BALLAARAT, VICTORIA · ALP; UAP from 1931

– That does not ease the situation of ‘the unsatisfied pensioner. We have in the Victorian Government an individual - I refer to the Treasurer, Mr. McPherson - who has done, his best to wipe out the compassionate allowance. There are cases in my constituency wherein parents have had to practically order an invalid son from their home in order to put him in a position, to receive the invalid pension. I have specifically complained to the Department, and have been told that a calculation has been made that it costs only £26 a year to maintain the father of a family. That is absurd. No parent could hope to live nowadays upon such a sum. However, upon that basis the Department holds that a father, if he’ is earning a certain wage, is in a position to support his invalid child. I know of a man who is between thirty and forty years Old. and who, because his widowed mother has a small income, is not entitled to the invalid pension. As a consequence, he has had to go away from her home and live in a hut in a condition of semistarvation. Only by such means has he been able to qualify to receive the invalid pension. With respect to inmates of benevolent institutions, if those who applied f 09 a pension prior to their admittance can receive 2s. a week from the Treasurer, the least we should do is to give 2s. also to those who made application after their admittance.

– That is so.I know an invalid who is living at a farmhouse practically as company for the people there. He does a little work, but next to nothing, and for this he receives a few shillings a week and his food. He made an application for an invalid pension,but owing to the fact that he was receiving these few shillings a week and his food the Department estimated that he was in receipt of a contribution of something like £1 a week, which under the regulations would prevent him from drawing a pension. If the Act, or the regulations, prevent the payment of a pension in a case like this, I think the Act should be amended or the regulations altered. A pension would be a god -send to some invalids who receive a few shillings a week for the services they can render. Under the Act, or the regulations, as at present drawn up, they are debarred from participating in a benevolence which they are perfectly justified in receiving if they wish to draw the invalid pension.

I think that, on the whole, the returned soldiers in my constituency have been fairly treated. Of course, there are odd cases to the contrary, in which the fault can be attributed to the Local Repatriation Committee; but in many instances the trouble can be traced to some other cause apart from the Local Committees or the Minister for Repatriation. However, I have a complaint to lodge in regard to the Post Office, which should receive the support of honorable members. Quite a number of returned, soldiers are temporarily engaged in various post-offices,, but it, is only a matter of time when their services will be dispensed with to make room for permanent officers. In one town in my electorate, a young man who gave his best during the war, in which his only brother was killed, has been employed in the local post-office. He has married in the town and he has no desire to leave it. He has recommendations, so far as qualifications and character are concerned, second to none, and the residents of the town have petitioned the Postmaster-General not to remove him from the district. Yet, although he has given the very best of satisfaction in the work upon which he has been engaged, he has received notice that his employment must terminate. At least, he has been offered a temporary appointment in Melbourne for a few months, but at the end of that period he will have to go. In cases where a soldier has given good service to his country, and entire satisfaction to the postal authorities, employment should be found for him in some other Department if it cannot be provided in the Post Office.

Mr Burchell:

– The Public Service Act prevents that being done. That is the trouble.

Mr ROBERT COOK:
INDI, VICTORIA · VFU; CP from 1920

– If an amendment of the Public Service Act is necessary to meet such a case, I think the House would pass the Bill in about ten minutes. There was a time when we did not know which way the war was going, when we said that we would give anything for men to enlist ; and while I have the honour of occupying a seat in this House, my whole-hearted sympathy will be for the soldier. That should be the attitude of every honorable member. We know what these boys have done for us. Nothing is too good ^ for them now they have returned. We should give them the best we have.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– And do not forget the mean pension given to the children of the men who gave their lives at the Front -

Mr ROBERT COOK:
INDI, VICTORIA · VFU; CP from 1920

– Yes. Probably the whole scheme . of pensions should be revised. Possibly some men are receiving pensions who are not entitled to them, and where if that is clearly shown to be the case they should be discontinued. I have just been interviewed by a young friend, whose paltry pension was cut off a little time ago. With the object of having the departmental decision reviewed I used what little influence I possessed with the Minister, knowing that the young man was thoroughly honorable, trustworthy, and deserving of a pension, and after a lapse -of two or three months the Department has just announced that it has decided to review his case. No pension should be discontinued until the fullest inquiry has shown the wisdom of such a course. The administration is only exposed to criticismand suspicion when pensions are cut off and later on renewed. “With regard to the question of War Service Homes, I have heard complaint made by some honorable members that no soldiers’ homes have been erected in their constituency. The honorable member for Melbourne (Dr. Maloney), for instance, has said that no War Service Homes have been built in his electorate. There may be a good reason for that. The honorable member’s electorate is somewhat congested, and I do not think it would be wise to build soldiers’ homes there. There are many rural- . towns, however, in which they might well be built. The valuations made on behalf of the Department in many country towns are of an imperfect character. I claim to know as well as any man the value of land and town buildings in the north:east of this State, and I know of a house in my electorate which was offered to the Department as a home for a soldier at a very reasonable rate, but the application in respect of it was turned down.” The officer who was sent up to make the valuation did not even look over the building. There was no one at home when he called, and without making any inspection of the interior he left and turned down the application. Reliable and trustworthy men in the town support my view that the price at which the building was offered was very reasonable. I endeavoured to have the matter reopened, but after a lapse of two months the applicant was informed that the original decision of the Department would be adhered to. While there are occasionally cases of this kind, I do not wish it to be understood that I am condemning the work of the Repatriation Commission as a whole. I should be sorry to do anything of the kind, because I believe that the Department has done wonderful work. There are, however, a few matters which need to be “ screwed up.” As the honorable member for Ballarat (Mr. McGrath) has said, there may be in the Department some official who slightly oversteps the mark. If such an official were dismissed and a capable returned soldier employed in his stead, as might appropriately be done, many causes of complaint would be removed and much greater satisfaction obtained. These are matters to which the Minister should attend since he is too often, blamed for the mistakes of officials.

Mr NICHOLLS:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP

.- I wish to offer a few observations in regard to the position of the great army of defenceless men and women usually referred to as invalid and old-age pensioners. Some considerable time ago the pension rate was increased to 15s. per week in the belief that that would be sufficient to supply pensioners- with the ordinary comforts of life. Since then, however, conditions have so materially changed and the .cost of living has so increased that much hardship is suffered by this deserving section of the community. I asked the. Treasurer (Sir Joseph Cook) some time ago whether he would consider the desirableness of increasing the invalid and old-age pensions to £1 per week. His reply was that it was impossible to grant an increase, inasmuch as the Government were face to , face with grave financial difficulties. Every one recognises that the Government are confronted with” huge financial obligations, but it is not justified for that reason in shirking its responsibilities so far as invalid and oldage pensions are concerned. One of its first duties is to see that the old men and women who practically pioneered our country are cared for in their days of adversity. I have repeatedly come into contact with quite a number of old-age pensioners, and recently ascertained from two or three of them what they were able to purchase with their pension of 15s. per week. One old man gave me a statement showing that for rent he pays 5s. per week, and that his other items of weekly expenditure are - as follows : - Four loaves of bread, 2s. ; 3 lbs of meat 2s. ; 2 lbs. of sugar, at 6d. per lb., and a quarter lb. of tea at 2s., ls. (3d. ; vegetables, ls.; clothing, 2s.; and tobacco, ls. 6d. In that way he spends his weekly pension of 15s. No one will say that in respect of any one of these items he is guilty of extravagance. If an honorable member were asked to live on such rations he would strongly object. Those who know the prices ruling for vegetables will not say that ls. per week is too much for an old man or an old woman to spend on such . a necessary article of diet. Then, again, 2s. per week is a very scanty allowance for clothing, and 2s. a week for meat is still scantier. These people, however, have to exist on such rations, while the Government express the view that the pension is ample to enable them to secure ordinary conditions of comfort. Much has been said of what is likely to be done for our invalid and old-age pensioners, and during the last twelve months their claims have, been strongly agitated. The Government should at once consider the advisability of freeing our old-age pensioners from rent payments. If they can build homes for soldiers - and I am very pleased that the Government have entered upon a gigantic scheme for housing our returned men - they should be able to concentrate a little attention on the welfare of these old people who have blazed the track for us, and provide them with free homes. They should also enable them to secure a greater degree of comfort. A pensioner is allowed nothing for medicine or medical attendance. In the event of illness he has to depend for relief upon the charity of others.

During the last two or three years large sums of money have been spent, and recklessly’ spent, I venture to say, by the Government, but no consideration has been given these old people. Military officials have been granted increases,, and quite recently we ourselves accepted a very fair increase in our allowance, although.’ we knew at the time that there were tens of thousands of old men and women in this country badly in need of an increase in their pensions. A fair amount of money has also been spent in sending abroad parliamentary representatives attended by quite an army of officials. Millions of pounds have likewise been spent on naval and military defence; but no further consideration has been given to these old people, who so richly deserve better treatment. The time is not far distant when we shall have a vote on this question, and the Government may rest assured that the old men and women of Australia will then, for once in their lives, score a victory. If we are permitted to take a vote, then, however much opposed the Ministry may be to an increase in the invalid and oldage pension rates, a majority of honorable members will be found voting for an increase.

Mr Burchell:

– Is the honorable member quite fair iri suggesting that the Treasurer is opposed to an increase ?

Mr NICHOLLS:

– T lie Treasurer informed me quite recently that the Government could not increase invalid and old-age pension rates, because they were face to face with financial difficulties. The suggested increase, it was said, would involve an additional expenditure of some hundreds of thousands of pounds. Consideration of cost did not influence the Government when they were improving our military and naval conditions, and appointing military officials to high positions, nor were they prevented by such a consideration from sending round the country an army of officials, and particularly of military officers. Such a consideration has weighed with them only when the claims of invalid and old-age pensioners have been brought forward. War pensions have been increased during the last year or two, and the people to whom I refer are equally entitled to an increase. I do not object to the increase in soldiers’ pensions. I have, indeed, repeatedly voted for such an increase, knowing the work that our soldiers did for us. But we must not lose sight of the fact that thousands of old men now drawing the old-age pension were just as anxious as any young man to enlist, and would willingly have gone to the Front had their age permitted them to do so. Merely because they were unable to go they were not placed on the same footing as are soldiers in the matter of pensions. There is really no difference between the old-‘ age pensioner and the soldier, so far as this matter is concerned, and there should be no difference in the pensions paid to them. Then, again, where a man who applies for a pension is living apart from his wife, or where a woman is living apart from her husband because, for some reason or another, they are unable to agree, the application is refused. An old man is told that because he is living apart from his wife he is not entitled to a pension. The Treasurer said, to-day that the Commissioner was allowed to use his own discretion, but I have ample proof of what I say. I may mention a case in which a man, because his wife left him,. was denied a pension.

Sir Granville Ryrie:

– Why did she leave him?

Mr NICHOLLS:

– -I never inquire into these delicate questions; it is an old saying that .the older a man and his wife grow the more they love one another ; but, at the same time, there are cases in which love turns to hatred, and they have to separate. The case to which I refer is stated in the following: - relative to the case of Mr. Wm. R. Dunstan, of Dunmore-street, Penrith, I have to say that the Invalid and Old-age Pensions Act provides that in the case of husband and wife, except where they are living apart pursuant to any decree, judgment, order, or deed of separation, the income and property of each shall be deemed to be possessed by both in equal shares.

In the case under notice, the claimant is living apart from his wife. In the absence of any legal separation, ‘however, the latter’s circumstances must be taken into account in determining his pension claim.

If, however, a deed of separation is executed between claimant and wife and forwarded to this office, the circumstances of the case will be immediately reviewed. A declaration in the matter would not be sufficient to comply with the law.

Unless there is a legal document there is no hope of a pension. In this case the wife has been living apart from her husband for twenty years, and she may be dead; at any rate, he does not know where she is, and it is impossible for him to get an order from a Court.

I have repeatedly asked the Treasurer to favorably consider the granting of temporary pensions to partially incapacitated men and women, but the idea has been rejected. I know scores of cases in which people have been temporarily incapacitated for, perhaps, three years, and yet they are entitled to no relief under the Act. If the Medical Referee agreed to give a certificate of total incapacity, a pension could be granted, but not otherwise. My suggestion is that in such cases a temporary pension should be granted for the currency of the incapacity, the pension to cease on the person’s recovery. If such a person should be unfortunate enough to become again incapacitated temporarily, the pension, I submit, should be renewed until he recovers. At present a person may be quite incapacitated for years, and yet be quite shut cut from the benefits of the Act. Such cases are not isolated, for they come under my notice practically every day. Another case I have in my mind is one in which a man applied for an invalid pension for his daughter. In a communication he says -

I am writing you to see if you can help me in regard to an application made by my daughter, – for an invalid pension, which has been rejected by the Deputy Commissioner of Pensions, Sydney (date of rejection of claim, 27th April, 1921). The reason given for said rejection is on the ground that she is not permanently incapacitated for work. My daughter is suffering from dislocated hip and also curvature of the spine, for which she has to wear body supports. Her right leg is 3 inches shorter than her left. Further, she was an inmate of the Royal Alexandra Hospital for Children, Sydney, for two years, and for many months of that time was placed in plaster casts, and was finally discharged as incurable by doctors such as the following: - Dr. Clubbe, Dr. Wade, and the late Dr. Kelty. Since that time (1911) she has been under many other doctors, the latest who saw her being Dr. P. L. O’Halloran, during this year, who says she cannot work while wearing the supports for curvature of spine without great discomfort to her and also danger to her health.

The Deputy Commissioner of Pensions holds that this girl is not totally incapacitated, in spite of the fact that, after two years in the Sydney Hospital, she was discharged as incurable, and that three eminent doctors have indorsed that view. I have known several cases in which a number of doctors have issued certificates of total incapacity, but the Government Medical Referee has point-blank refused to give a certificate to that effect. He holds that the patients may be cured in any period up to ten or fifteen years, and his conscience would not allow him to declare them totally incapacitated. I make my suggestion, so that people who become ill and unable to work for any period, it may be up to fifteen years, may be able to live. Ever since I entered this Chamber I have fought consistently for the claims of invalid and old-age pensioners; and I hope, in the near future, that instead of 15s. a week, they will receive at least £1 per week. All other sections of the community, from the lowest to the highest paid, have had their incomes increased; and there seems no valid reason why these poor people should not also have their position improved. Their living conditions are practically intolerable. The landlord has no more consideration for an old-age or invalid pensioner than he has for anybody else, nor has the grocer, the butcher, or the baker; and if a pensioner cannot pay he must go out in the cold, and do without food. We all know that no man or woman can have reasonable comfort on 15s. per week, and I trust that the Treasurer will reconsider his attitude, and grant a pension sufficient to meet the circumstances of the times.

Mr BURCHELL:
Fremantle

– The last speaker (Mr. Nicholls) has asked for favorable consideration for invalid and old-age pensioners, and I am sure that in this House his appeal has fallen on sympathetic ears. Few of us would like to be charged with not endeavouring to do our utmost to aid those who, through adverse circumstances, are compelled to accept these pensions.

I should like to say a word or two in regard to the necessary proof of incapacity. When I was first elected to this Parliament, some of my work had direct association with applications for invalid pensions -a thorny subject, in regard to which it is extremely difficult to lay down hard-and-fast rules. However, I join withthe honorable member for Macquarie (Mr. Nicholls) in requesting the Treasurer, if it be practicable, to arrange so that the medical referee may be empowered to recognise temporary incapacity over a term of years during which an invalid maybe unable to earn any money.

Mr Charlton:

– Why not suggest that such certificate should apply to incapacity for six months and over ?

Mr BURCHELL:

– The question of the period is arguable from many points of view. If the applicant is a wageearner, and unable to earn, it should be practicable for us, as a Parliament, to devise ways and means of dealing with such a case.

Mr Nicholls:

– Would it not be wise to suggest that, in the event of incapacity lasting for a longer period than twelve months, and of a pension then being granted, the pension should be retrospective from the commencement of the incapacity ?

Mr BURCHELL:

– I am now merely supporting the principle suggested by the honorable member himself. He was, I think, . the first to advocate the recognition of incapacity over a period, and I give the honorable member credit for bringing the matter before the House.

– That is so, and I think that the request now made is reasonable. It may not bepossible during this session to pass an amending Bill, but I suggest that, in the meantime, the Government raise the issue with the StateGovernments in order that we may bein a position to definitely deal with the matter later on. We cannot do anything without the co-operation of the States, and I, therefore, suggest that preliminary arrangements be made with a view to finalizing at the earliest possible moment what is, after all, only a small matter.

– I wish that in deserving cases that were so. I have had other cases in addition to that which. I have just mentioned.

I wish now to say a word or two about the munition workers. Quite a number of us who know the work done by the munition workers have spoken strongly here on their behalf ; and about twelve months ago it was promised that a Conference should be called which would represent all the political sections here, and that by it a tribunal would be created before which the munition workers could place their grievances. Because of sickness, the absence of Ministers, and other reasons, there has been unavoidable delay in assembling the Conference, but the munition workers have been more than patient, and should receive a definite and tangible reward. I ask only for an impartial tribunal to settle their grievances, and their associations have agreed to this. They have declared that they will accept the verdict of an independent tribunal, whether in their favour or against them. In fairness to them, we should take immediate action to have the primary Conference called in order that such a tribunal may bo established. There is no statutory authority for the payment of pensions to munition workers, and it is to the credit of the Government that they have granted to thorn compassionate allowances. Many munition workers, however, are unaware of what is being done, and if the tribunal to which I refer were set up, they would have an opportunity of stating and getting a settlement of their claims for consideration. I urge the Government to deal with this matter as soon as possible.

Mr FENTON:
Maribyrnong

– It seems to me that every member of the House is in favour’ of increasing the old-age and invalid pensions; and I believe that if there were an informal meeting of members of all parties, we could decide on a plan of action here which would quickly improve the position of our pensioners. I do not know if what I suggest would be contrary to the Standing Orders. Surely when members are all of one mind effect should be given to their wishes. I suggest that something should be done to meet the rightful claims of some of the finest men and women in Australia, who laid the foundation of this country’s success. Other members of the community are receiving increases to make up for the high cost of living, yet these most deserving persona are being neglected by us. The time for talk has passed, and action is long overdue. Speaking for myself - and I am sure that in this matter I could speak for my party too - I am willing to co-operate heartily in any endeavour to increase the pensions of the aged and infirm.

There are some very hard cases - mention has been made of several this afternoon -in which persons who should be helped cannot obtain invalid pensions. That prevention is better than cure is an old and true saying, and I am glad that the honorable member for Macquarie (Mr. Nicholls) and the honorable member for Fremantle (Mr. Burchell) have said that something should be done for invalids who. are only temporarily incapacitated and whom proper treatment and rest would wholly or partly restore to health. Some pitiable cases have come before me recently in which, the bread-winners having been taken away, their widows have had to struggle to earn a pittance for their families. In a typical case which I put before the authorities as strongly as I could, a lady is steadily declining in health, but cannot get help from the Government which would allow her to take the necessary rest. Unfortunately, the medical man certifies that she is not permanently incapacitated. Persons such as she, who with timely assistance might be restored to their normal health, will eventually, if not helped-, become a permanent burden upon us, and whatever the state of the finances, it is poor economy to deprive them of assistance. As for the aged, and infirm, is this National Parliament going to be so contemptibly mean as to refuse the needed help ?

I have on previous occasions spoken of the way in which medical men are, by their reports, helping to cut down war pensions. I quote the case of a man in my constituency with a wife and six chilrren. He was medically examined upon his return from the war, and for a consider- . able time received a pension. From time to time he has been in the militaryhospital, and attended to by the doctors. Some time ago the military doctor declared that this man was not permanently incapacitated, and his pension ceased. Although he is weak in body the man has tried to earn his living, and has fallen down at his work through weakness. In some occupations he has been a danger to his fellow employees on that account. After such a collapse he returns homo, and has a consultation with his wife. They have the six bairns to support, and because they require attention the wife cannot go to work, whilst the -man is unable to continue at his employment. Yet the Defence authorities say that that man is not permanently incapacitated. If the Government run away in that fashion from their responsibilities they are quickly forgetting their promises to the men who fought at the Front. I am sure that every honorable member could quote instances of dire distress in the community because of re: turned ‘soldiers, who are physically incapable of carrying on their ordinary avocations, and have families dependent upon them, being unable to receive any assistance from the Government. Even although the medical testimony be that a man is not permanently incapacitated, surely if he is unable to work at his usual calling he should be helped, having regard to the assistance he rendered to the country in its time of storm and stress.

I desire to call, attention to the improper discrimination amongst Government servants in the administration of the basic wage. I have been requested to ‘ question the Leader of - the Government as to why the child endowment is given to certain Commonwealth employees and denied to others. The reply I have received is that permanent employees who have children under a certain age dependent upon them receive an extra 5s. per week for each child, but a workman employed in the Cordite Factory, the “Woollen Mills, the Clothing Factory, or the Saddlery Factory- all Commonwealth industrial undertakings - is not entitled to receive the endowment. That policy of discrimination is distinctly unfair. The mere fact that a man -is a temporary employee is not sufficient reason for .denying him the endowment part of the basic wage. On the contrary it is all the more reason why he should receive, that consideration. The discrimination is not relished by those who suffer by it, or even by those in the same establishments who are receiving endowments. Some of the clerks in these factories, because they belong to the permanent section of the Service, are entitled to the child endowment, but other men working in the’ same .building are denied it. .That is unjust. No doubt it is a money saving’ device, hut it is so mean that the Government might well be charged with trying to dodge their responsibilities. The Prime Minister (Mr. Hughes), when announcing to the House_the intentions of the Government in “regard to the basic wage, said that whilst they were not prepared to grant the wage of £5 16s. per week recommended by the Commission, they intended, to fix a basic wage, for Commonwealth employees, and so set an example for private employers. Yet many thousands of Commonwealth Government employees are not enjoying the endowment. What has become of the Government boast that they would set an example to private employers.? Even Mr. Piddington, although he stated in a supplementary report that the Commonwealth could not afford to pay a basic wage of £5 16s. per week all. round, was a_ party to the unanimous recommendation of the Commission, after taking exhaustive evidence, that on account of the high cost of rent., clothing, groceries, and other necessaries £5 16s. per week was the minimum wage upon which a man with a wife and three children could eke out an ordinary .existence. I do not suppose there -was ever a Commission that -was so unanimous on any point, or that ever made such an exhaustive inquiry into the general conditions of the working classes of Australia.’ The Government decided not to abide by the dercision pf the Commission, but .to run away from their pre-election promise by creating a lower basic ‘ wage for Com,- . monwealth ‘ employees, namely, .£4 per week, and 5s. per week for each dependant child. Even that promise has not been honoured, for thousands of employees in the Commonwealth Service are. denied the endowment. This is just one more instance of promises made by the Government before an election, and adroitly evaded afterwards.

The honorable .member for Melbourne Ports (Mr. Mathews) called attention to the mean way in which some employers treated their employees in connexion with Anzac holiday. I know that when a holiday -has’ been declared and the doors of an establishment are closed for the day, many employees, if they are not paid for the compulsory holiday, are unable to meet their weekly obligations. , Yet that lias occurred in the Government Printing Office, where a large number of men are employed in the printing of the documents and reports of this Parliament. The Commonwealth cannot evade its responsibility ato those men, because, although the establishment is controlled by the Victorian Government, the men are to. a large extent . employees of the Commonwealth. The permanent employees received full .pay . for Anzac holiday, men who served in the war. and were’ employed as temporary hands also received the holiday and . full pay, and, after agitation, the’ same concession was extended to the men who had fought in the South African war. But the fathers of some of the lads who fell at the Front did not receive payment for the holiday. These nasty distinctions are creating bad feelings in the hearts of many people. My idea of the Australian workman is that he will respond to fair treatment. I worked in the Government Printing Office for seven years, and I know many of the employees and..the work they do. It is not unusual for a man who has worked .all day to be required to continue through the night in supplying the requirements of this Parliament. When a holiday is declared, especially on Anzac Day, the Commonwealth Government should advise the State Government that they are prepared to take their share cif the cost of giving the employees a holiday on full pay. If the Government give fair treatment to those men it will be reciprocated, but treat them in a niggardly way and they will not give the same service as they otherwise would.

Reverting to the basic wage, I notice that Mr. Piddington in his pamphlet, The Next Step, lays down certain principles which, if acted upon, would allow of « the basic wage being paid. I admit that he points out the difficulties, but he has based his argument on figures compiled by Mr. Knibbs, which I make bold to say are not reliable in this application. For instance, Mr. Knibbs has founded his statistics of the income of the Commonwealth upon the value of goods as produced at the factory. ‘ The value of goods as they leave the factory, or primary products as they leave the soil, is, at the most, the wholesale value. How many people purchase their goods at manufacturers’ or wholesale prices? The bulk of tho people have to pay profit, not only to. the manufacturer and wholesaler, but also to the retailer, and they have to pay the cost of distribution also. When all those additional costs are added there is involved an increase of at least 60 per cent. That is why I maintain that the figures employed as a basis by Messrs. Knibbs and Piddington are altogether misleading. While the Prime Minister was’ conducting his election campaign he intimated that if the basic wage was to be conferred on the community by .the Federal Parliament it would be essential for the people to agree to the proposed amendments of the Constitution whichwere being submitted by way of referendum. I am given to understand that Mr. Piddington, when ho learned of. that statement, wrote to Mr. Hughes and wanted to know if it was correct. He took the stand that unless he and his fellow-members of the Commission were to have the power to recommend a basic wage, and that such recommendation’ would be put into effect, he would not undertake to carry on. Evidently Mr. Piddington received some sort of ‘ assurance from the ‘Prime Minister^ whereupon he entered upon his investigations. In his pamphlet, Mr. Piddington states that since the Arbitration Court has the constitutional right to fix what isknown as a living wage there can be no constitutional authority to prevent the fixing of a basic wage, and that it can, therefore, be fixed by the Arbitration Court. The Prime Minister stated that the Government could not go outside and say to every private employer, “ This is to be the legal basic wage to be paid throughout the Commonwealth,” but that the Government could give a lead in that direction in respect of their own employees. I complain, however, that in the payment of the basic wage to public servants there has been a discrimination which is not only unfair but iniquitous. Mr. Piddington says -

It is the minimal duty of employers to provide out of the products of industry such an amount as will enable all employees and their families to live according to current human standards of reasonable comfort.

From this it follows: -

That the children of the worker have just the same individual right in origin and in measure as the worker, and, therefore:
That payment made to any person because of such rights of children is made to that person as trustee for them.

Unfortunately, Mr. Piddington subsequently makes reference to what has been done for the Public Service-; and from that reference one would think that the whole of the Public Service, whether temporarily or permanently employed, was receiving the basic wage.

Mr Story:

– Does Mr. Piddington say what is to be done when an industry is unable to pay the basic wage?

Mr FENTON:

– We can never legislate for the individual, nor for individual industries. We should take industry as a whole. I believe that industry cannot pay quite the full amount of £5 16s. per week, but I am pretty certain that, generally speaking, it can come very near to doing so. The public at large have to pay all the profits of every party. Some favoured folk are able to go to a wholesale house and secure the benefit of wholesale prices. Some wealthy families are able to buy at wholesale rates by purchasing in large quantities. The ordinary wage-earner, however, has to pay the full profits of the manufacturer, the wholesaler, the agent, the distributor, and the retailer. And it is upon the total sum of those profits that the decision should be madewhether industry generally can pay the basic wage. If Messrs. Knibbs and Piddington were to have regard for all those costs, I guarantee that the industries of this country would be found to be able to pay the basic wage of £5 16s.

Mr Story:

– Would the payment of the basic wage generally increase the cost of living?

Mr FENTON:

– It should not do so if we could control those who put up the price of everything every time their own interests are threatened or involved. Wages costs in relation to an industry are but a small part of the general cost. Some years ago the Sydney Morning Herald- an organ of conservative folk - stated that when a manufacturer is compelled under a wage award to pay so much to his employees, involving, perhaps, an increase of 5 per cent., the added price which he puts upon his goods to the public is generally between 10 and 20 per cent.

The Prime Minister said at Bendigo that there was no greater incentive to the building up of Bolshevism in our community than the eternal increases in the cost of living. Mr. Hughes proceeded -

Now, once it is admitted that it is in the interests of the community that such a wage shouldbe paid as will enable a man to marry andbring up children in decent, wholesome conditions - and that point has been settled long ago - it seems obvious that we must devise better machinery for insuring the payment of such a wage than at present exists. Means mustbe found which will insure that the minimum wageshall be adjusted automatically, or almost automatically, with the cost of living, so that within the limits of the minimum wage at least the sovereign shall always purchase the same amount of the necessaries of life. The Government is, therefore, appointing a Royal Commission to inquire into the cost of living in relation to the minimum or basic wage. The Commission will be fully clothed with power to ascertain what is a fair basic wage, and how much the purchasing power of the sovereign has been depreciated during the war; also how the basic wage may be adjusted to the present purchasing power of the sovereign, and the best means, when once so adjusted, of automatically adjusting itself to the rise and fall of the sovereign.

Mr FENTON:

– If the honorable member says that the coat-of-arms on this paper is all right, and yet regards the statue as an abortion, I am afraid his artistic sense has depreciated very much.

There is a consensus of opinion that our invalid and old-age pensioners are treated disgracefully. It would be quite an easy matter for all parties to get together during the tea adjournment and pass a resolution to submit to this House, demanding- that these deserving people should be treated properly. If we are not prepared to do this, then let us stop all this humbugging talk.

Mr FLEMING:
Robertson

.- I wish to bring before the House a case of individual hardship affecting a matter of great moment to Australia. A little more than twelve months ago Captain T. Rees, a returned soldier of Mudgee, a man with very unusual qualifications, forwarded to me an application for a position in connexion with the immigration policy of the Commonwealth. On the 9th July, 1920, I wrote informing him that I had brought his case before the right authorities. On the 12th October, 1920, Mr. R. J. Cohen, a representative of the Mudgee Guardian, wrote to me as follows : -

Some time ago Captain T. Rees, of Mudgee, wrote to you offering his services as an immigration officer, but he has not beard anything from you since you wrote - him on the 9th July. Captain Rees, who has been residing in this district for three or four years, is a gentleman well fitted to act as an immigration agent in England. He is a member of one of the best-known Welsh families, his family being well known right throughout South Wales. He has been a military man, and has a great reputation as an organizer. He has been successfully conducting a farm in this district, and he knows the conditions of Australia thoroughly. He recognises that the people that we want here are men of the farming class, and he is confidentthat if he is appointed agent it will be the means of persuading a large number of good immigrants to come to Australia. He is a very able and intelligent man, of good appearance and personality, and if the Federal Immigration Department want a man in every way suitable as an agent, they should not hesitate to secure his services.

Our paper, the Mudgee Guardian, has much pleasure in recommending him as an ideal man for the position.

Trusting you will do your very best in the matter.

On the 14th October, 1920, I acknowledged the receipt of that letter, and informed him that I would put the matter again before the Prime Minister’s Department. On the 18th October, I received the following letter, signed by Senator Russell: -

I desire to acknowledge the receipt of the letter addressed to you by Mr. P.J. Cohen, of the Mudgee Guardian, Perry-street, Mudgee, dated 12th October, with regard to the application of Captain T.Rees, of Mudgee, for an appointment in connexion with the proposed immigration organization, and to inform you that Captain Bees’ qualifications will receive consideration when steps are being taken to constitute the organization.

I ask the Minister at the table to make a special note of the date of that letter. On the 23rd November, Mr. Cohen again wrote to me as follows: -

I have written you previously with regard to CaptainRees, pointing out to you his great qualifications as an immigration officer in England. Just now, when immigration is a burning question, of course, there is no need for me to point out to you the great advantage of obtaining the services of men holding the high qualifications of CaptainRees. To show you his ability, I will just let you know some of the positions he has held. Probably through reading the list of positions which he has held, you may arrive at the conclusion that he is purely a military man; but such is not the case. He is a born organizer. He has been farming very successfully, on a small scale, in Mudgee, and he feels that he could do great work as an immigration officer, as he knows Wales so well, and knows the stamp of immigrant that we want here; so I trust that the Department that deals with immigration will be sure to secure his services.

Captain Rees has held the following positions : -

I have picked out three of the most prominent positions he has filled from a long list that accompanies this letter -

Served in the South African war as ordnance officer of Grand Base Depot, the Docks, Cape Town - specially mentioned in dispatches by Lord Kitchener for organization and system introduced into the working of the docks.

Officer specially detailed by War Office to compile the defence scheme (as far as ordnance services were concerned) for Cardiff, Swansea, and Mil ford Haven defences. Passed a course in police force routine, and qualified for the position of Chief Constable of a county.

On the 3rd December, Mr. Cohen again wrote as follows : -

Thanks very much for what you have done for CaptainRees. Captain Rees appreciates your kindness very much, and so do I. CaptainRees will be very pleased to submit a scheme in connexion with immigration. This proposal refers to Wales, which place hehas a thorough knowledge of, and if the Immigration Department is desirous of securing his scheme, if you would let us know, he would submit same straight away. Sometimes, of course, good schemes emanate from sources quite outside the Department.

On the 10th December, 1920, I wrote to Mr. Cohen, informing him that if Captain Rees sent along his scheme I would indorse it and submit it to the Prime Minister. This, Captain Rees did, and I indorsed his scheme and sent it to the Prime Minister. On the 3rd January of this year I wrote again, stating that at the very first opportunity I would bring the matter under the personal notice of the Prime Minister, which I did. On the 20th January of this year I received the following letter from Mr. Cohen: -

In regard to the matter of having Captain Rees appointed immigration officer, I would be pleased if you would let me know if anything further has been done with reference to this matter.

I replied that both matters had been placed in proper form before the Prime Minister, but on the 22nd February I received the following letter from Mr. Cohen: -

Re Captain Rees. Please do not think I am bothering you, but Government officials are likely to overlook these things, and as Captain Rees is such a good man, it would be a pity if he was not appointed immigration officer.

On the 25th February, I acknowledged that letter as follows: -

Yours of 22nd inst. re case of CaptainRees. I have put the matter before Mr. Hughes a couple of times, but so far can get no satisfaction. Have mentioned it to one of the other Ministers, but without effect. Have not yet lost all hope, and expect sooner or later to arrive somewhere in the matter.

On the 1st March, I received the following letter from Senator Russell, on behalf of the Prime Minister: -

I desire to acknowledge the receipt of your letter of the 28th February, forwarding a communication from Mr. P. J. Cohen of the Mudgee

Guardian, Perry-street, Mudgee, urging the appointment of Captain Rees as an immigration officer, and ‘to inform you that Captain Rees’ qualifications have been noted for consideration in connexion with vacancies in the Immigration Branch.

Then, on the 10th March, I received the following : -

Prime Minister’s Department,

Melbourne, 10th March, 1921.

Dear Sir, - With reference to your letter of the 28th February, enclosing a communication from Mr. R. J. Cohen, regarding the qualification of Captain Rees for appointment to the position of Immigration Officer, I desire to inform you that there is no record of an application having been received from Captain Bees for any such position.

I may mention that applications were invited for the positions of Immigration Officers in all States except Victoria, and for one officer for the Central Administration, on the 16th December. The closing dates for these positions were 23rd and 30th December respectively.

Yours faithfully,

J. Russell, for Prime Minister.

After nearly twelve months of _ solid agitation on behalf of this nian, after his original application, as the documents which I hold in my hands prove, had been’ sent in, brought specially under, the notice of Ministers on three or four occasions, and mentioned to the present Acting Prime Minister (Sir Joseph Cook) in this chamber one evening, I received this letter, months after the date on which applications closed, saying that there was no record in the Department of any application having been received. It seems to me that we could not have stronger proof of lax administration. I do not blame the Acting Prime Minister for overlooking the matter. I’ mentioned it to him in the chamber one evening, and put before him a letter, which I presume lie passed on in the usual way to his departmental officers. Here was a capable man, well qualified for the office which he was seeking, a returned soldier, who I believe could have, done excellent work for Australia, and yet, after putting, in nearly twelve months’ solid work on his behalf, I am told that no record of his application can be found in. the Department.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Does the honorable member say that the application came to me f

Mr FLEMING:

– No. I say that I mentioned the matter to the Acting Prime

Minister, and gave the right honorable gentleman, while he was in the House, a letter relating to it. The application was sent in the ordinary way to the Prime Minister’s Department. ‘ I read most of -the correspondence relating to this matter before the right honorable gentleman entered the Chamber, and it shows that from May of last year to the present time there has been a consecutive effort to secure recognition for this man. He deserves recognition at the hands of the State. He is a man of proved capacity in dealing with a subject of vast importance to Australia, and yet, after all this effort on his behalf, the Department states no record of an application from him can be found. I ask the Minister to take special notice of this case, and to endeavour to see that justice is done to this man. I hope that not only will something be done for him, but that, in future, the Administration will be more careful to see that business methods are adopted in the various Departments. How can we expect the country to carry on under a system of administration such as that disclosed by this correspondence? There must be some one in the Prime Minister’s Department who should get into trouble over this case, and there are a few such men in all the Departments. Until some of them are brought to book, we shall not be able to put the’ affairs of Australia on a proper footing. As an example of lax administration, I -do not think this case could be surpassed. I. again ask the Minister to look into it, and to see that there is no recurrence of such, incidents in- any Department of the Com-, monwealth.

Mr AUSTIN CHAPMAN:
Monaro · Eden

Mr McGrath:

– Because we have “ Billy “ Hughes at the head of affairs.

Mr AUSTIN CHAPMAN:

– I do not think that is the reason. I urge the Government to quit the foolish policy they have been following. There is an old saying that you should not “ cut off your nose to spite your face”; and again I ask why we should continue our present attitude when we have such a fine lead from Britain and America? The honorable member for Wakefield (Mr. Richard Foster) and the honorable member for Kooyong (Sir Robert Best) point to what has taken place this week ; but I wish to see trade relations opened up at once.

Then I have to ask the Government what has become of the promises made to prevent the duplication of State and Commonwealth activities? We were told that we were to have one Department of Taxation and one electoral roll.

Mr Richard Foster:

– We have one electoral roll in South Australia, and it was used at the last election.

Mr AUSTIN CHAPMAN:

– I have put concrete cases before the Government. In one case the widow of a soldier, killed at the war, has had her pension of, probably, £2 a week cut down to £1.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

I have asked numbers of questions recently regarding the appointment of three Deputy Presidents to the Arbitration Court, and others concerning the resignation of Mr. Justice Higgins, and still more having to do with the basic wage. The Government should remove the impasse in which the unionists of this country find themselves through no fault of their own, but entirely owing to the inactivity of the Government. Ostensibly to help trade unionists, the Government amended the Arbitration Act; but,’ in its amended form, that Act now amounts to a hindrance. Unionists cannot secure redress of their, grievances. Previously they could go to the Arbitration Court and receive satisfaction, but that avenue for the maintenance of peace in industry has been closed foi* several months, and no govern- mental action has been taken to reopen it. An unfortunate incident occurred some months ago, in which His Honour Mr.Justice Higgins and the Prime Minister were involved. It arose from the passing of the Industrial Peace Act, which, by the way, has been availed of only once, namely, in regard to the coal and shale industry. Mr. Justice Higgins rightly adopted the attitude that that Statute overrode the provisions of the Arbitration Act, and he gave notice of his resignation from the Arbitration Bench. It will be a misfortune to Australia if Mr. Justice Higgins is permitted to resign. I believe there are no great difficulties in the way of retaining his services. If the

Government were to make known that the provisions of the Industrial Peace Act are to be applied only in times of crisis, and if Mr. Justice Higgins were officially notified to that effect, I understand that he would remain President of the Arbitration Court. Australia can illafford to lose the services of such a man, and I say that notwithstanding that I differ greatly from the President of the Court in relation to many of his pronouncements, and particularly over his Harvester judgment. I urge the Government to take all necessary steps to retain his services.

– There is no need to close the mine. Under present conditions it can make handsome profits. No other mine can produce copper as cheaply. The company has made millions of profit, but does not talk of sharing some of those millions with the unfortunate slaves who have made them for it. When it finds itself in difficulties, it says, in effect, to the workers, “ For Heaven’s sake, accept a reduction in wages or an alteration in the hours of labour in order that the industry may be retained, and so that you may be able to buy bread.” It is rank hypocrisy.

I shall conclude my remarks with a reference to old-age and invalid pensions. Ninety per cent. of the members of this House, despite the wailings of the Treasurer (Sir Joseph Cook), are in favour of a substantial increase in the invalid and old-age pension rate. To-day we are making a maximum payment of 15s. per week. That allowance can be obtained only by those who are able to make out a substantial case to the Deputy Commissioner. Applicants who have a few acres of land or a few sheep have great difficulty in obtaining anything. If they do get anything, the amount is very small.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Invalid and old- . age pensions represent an aggregate payment of £5,500,000 per annum.

Mr BLAKELEY:

– The question we have to consider is not what amount of money we spend in this way, but rather what is the position of the recipients. To-day invalid and old-age pensioners, unless helped by their friends, cannot live as human beings ought to do. Their present allowance is not sufficient to enable them to obtain proper food or the warm clothing so necessary to the aged. It is not sufficient to enable them to purchase bed-clothing or any of the simple luxuries which the old and infirm require. No matter what the total expenditure in this regard may be, we have a responsibility to the aged and infirm which must be met. We must give them at least £1 per week. Heaven knows that is little enough. I suggest to the Acting Prime Minister (Sir Joseph Cook) that he set apart a day for the discussion of the question. If he does, I am sure that there will be such a unanimous expression of opinion in favour of an increase to £1 per week that he will agree to make the increase.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I hope that the House will now allow the question to be put, as there is another urgent matter which I desire to bring forward.

Question resolved in the negative.

page 8432

WESTRALIAN FARMERS AGREEMENT BILL (No. 2)

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

. - (By leave) - I move -

That leave be given to bring in a Bill for an Act to approve the agreement made between :the West Australian Grain-growers’ Cooperative Elevators Limited and the Commonwealth of Australia varying and supplementing the agreement contained in the Schedule to the Westralian Farmers Agreement Act 1920.

In submitting this motion, I ought to explain that the matter has become just a little hurried owing to the possibility of the Senate rising to-morrow for some weeks. I want to have this Bill passed before another place adjourns. It is a measure to vary an agreement made some time ago with the Westralian farmers. Honorable members will recollect that last year we passed a Bill containing an agreement under which we proposed to assist a co-operative enterprise on the part of the farmers of Western Australia to build “silos for the storage of their wheat. As the agreement left the House, it provided that the whole scheme should involve an expenditure of £800,000. One of the stipulations was that the farmers themselves should subscribe 300,000 shares of £1 each, of which amount 10s. per share should be paid on application, and that we, on our part, should provide £550,006 for the complete scheme. It was provided that when the farmers had subscribed 300,000 shares, and had expended £100,000, we should begin to pay at the rate of £2 for £1 until the full amount had been exhausted or the scheme had been completed.

Mr Fenton:

– The advance by the Commonwealth was to be by way of loan ?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Yes. The Westralian farmers now ask for a variation of this agreement. They want to confine themselves for the time being to the construction of the terminal silos, leaving the question of the construction of the country silos to be ~ considered later. The proposition, therefore, is very much reduced. Later on it may transpire that we shall expend the whole of this money in the construction of silos, but on a plan different from that which hitherto has been’ adopted. It is not at all clear that the country silos erected in New South Wales are a proved success, and I think the Westralian farmers are wise in contenting themselves for the time being with the construction of terminal silos. The variation they suggest may be shortly stated. They have already subscribed 240,000 shares. That means that they have already in hand £120,000. They suggest that they do not subscribe the remaining 60,000 shares for the time being, but that they proceed only with the erection of the terminal silos. I propose to agree to the modification, stipulating on our side for a pro rata reduction in our obligation. This means that they will proceed with their present share capital of £240,000, and that we reduce our obligation to them to £440,000. That is a strictly pro rata arrangement. We reduce our obligation from £550,000 to £440,000, and they reduce theirs from £300,000 to £240,000.

Mr Considine:

– Is this one method of economizing ?

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– Incidentally it is, and I commend this co-operative concern for what I cannot help regarding as a wise and cautious view of the situation. ‘When they have erected their terminal silos the question of whether country silos are a success will have been tested, and they can proceed in a year or two’s time with more experience behind them, a greater amount of resources, and more information on the whole subject. I commend this proposal to the House. It relieves us of an obligation to the extent of £110,000, and it enables the farmers of Western Australia to proceed with a somewhat less .ambitious scheme.

Mr CHARLTON:
Hunter

.- Honorable members will recollect that in August last we passed a Bill containing an agreement controlling the erection of silos in Western Australia. I understand from the Acting Prime Minister (Sir Joseph Cook) that the amending Bill which he seeks leave to introduce will not involve any further obligation upon the Commonwealth.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– It means a reduced obligation.

Mr CHARLTON:

– It provides simply for a modification of the provisions of the existing arrangement.. That being so, I do not intend to debate the matter at this stage, but would ask the right honorable gentleman whether he proposes to pass the Bill through all its stages this evening, or to adjourn its consideration until to-morrow.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– I regret to say that I cannot proceed further to-night for the reason that one party to this agreement has neglected to affix to it the seal of .the corporation. I am endeavouring to get into touch with him, but it does not seem that I shall be able to do so to-night. Having obtained the leave of the House to introduce the Bill I shall go no further with it until to-morrow. I regret that this incidental step has been omitted, but it is as vital as it is incidental.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

page 8433

QUESTION

PERTH NEW GENERAL POST OFFICE

Mr GROOM:
Minister for Works and Railways · Darling Downs · NAT

– I move -

That, in accordance with the provisions of the Commonwealth Public Works Committee Act 1913-1914, it is expedient to carry out the following proposed work: - Perth New General Post Office building under construction - Extension by two floors for the accommodation of the Taxation and other Government Departments; which said work was referred to the Public Works Committee, and the Committee has duly reported to this House the result of its inquiries thereon.

Mr Burchell:

– And it was a Labour Government under Scaddan that was in power in Western Australia.

Mr WEST:

–At any rate, that Government had’ not a vision extending beyond its own features, whereas this Government saw further ahead. The Perth General Post Office would have been finished now had the State Government shown more foresight. Since that time, the Western Australian Government has agreed with the Commonwealth Government upon the amalgamation of Taxation Departments, and a floor of the new General Post Office is to be devoted to the accommodation of the Taxation officers. We are amply justified in voting for the completion of this structure. The honorable member for South Sydney (Mr. Riley) spoke of’ the contractor for the building. I understand that the contractor is satisfied that a schedule can be drawn up to which the Department can agree as showing the amount required to finish the building. Strangely enough, the calamity howlers in this Chamber all hail from Western Australia.’ They are perpetually crying economy; they talk it by the yard, and spin it out by the mile. Their utterances cast gloom on a community that has already sufficient to bear. The Prime Minister (Mr. Hughes) should have thought twice before saying what he did the other day about our financial position, because,, above all things, a public man should be optimistic. That is the foundation of his .success. Now, however, the Western Australian members are pressing for Government expenditure in Perth, trying to obtain something of the kind that New South Wales members want to get done at Canberra. We wish to have the Commonwealth Parliament and the administrative offices of the Commonwealth put in the Federal Territory; and the Western Australian members wish to have the Commonwealth Departments of Perth housed in the one building. I agree with them that that should be done. It is not often that we get an opportunity to discuss matters of finance here. I am satisfied that this proposal is a sound one, because the money is to be usefully expended. There is no extravagance in spending money for a work which is necessary for the proper conduct of the business of the Commonwealth. Nevertheless, in to-morrow’s newspapers we shall probably read adverse criticism of this proposal, and the Taxpayers’ Association, the members of which are merely’ tax-dodgers, will object to it. About £200,000 has already been spent on the Perth General Post Office, and from this expenditure we get no direct return; but the proposed additions, which will cost £50,000, will give us a return. If the men at the head of this Administration had proper financial knowledge, a redemption fund would be provided to gradually extinguish the debt on the building. Unfortunately, that is not provided for, and nothing of the kind is to be expected until, with a change of Government, the party to which I belong w:ns the opportunity to show the people how its affairs should be financed.

Mr. FENTON (Maribyrnong) [9.231 .- I would have liked the Minister to tell us a little more about the resumed property on which the Perth General Post Office is being built. I understand that some years ago a Commonwealth Government acquired in Perth a very valuable property, which can be made an exceptionally , fine investment. There is, or was, a first-class hotel on the site, and I understand that a street was to be formed. Some of the citizens’ of Perth wish for expenditure on ornamentation there, but those who regard this as a business proposition consider that it would be better to create shop frontages.

Mr Groom:

– I could not go into the matter to which the honorable member is alluding, because ;t is irrelevant to the proposal, which is the sanctioning of the addition of two stories to the Perth General Post Office.

Mr FENTON:

– I have no objection to the spending pf £50,000 on the proposed addition, but the Minister could have improved h:s case by foreshadowing the works that are to be carried out in the future to make the whole scheme revenueprod uc:ng.

Mr Bamford:

– That would have been outside the scope of the reference to the Public Works Committee.

Mr FENTON:

– I do not wish to introduce irrelevant matter. What I have seen of the Perth General Post Office makes me think that the structure is a very fine’ one, and although money is dear at the present time, it will be in the long run profitable to expend it in housing our officais in the manner proposed. Those who have travelled about the Commonwealth know how much time and -money is wasted by the present arrangement of having the Commonwealth Offices distributed all about the various capital cities. ‘ The sooner we have in each of the capitals buildings which will house all the Commonwealth servants there, the better it w:ll be for the public and for the Commonwealth Service, because.it will facilitate inter-departmental communication, and will convenience all who have business with Government Departments. I hope that this fine structure, which will adorn the wonderful city of Perth, may be completed soon. *

Mr HECTOR LAMOND:
Illawarra

– I support the proposal, but ‘1 am sorry that it does not go further. It is not economical to build on an expensive site a build ng lower than the municipal regulations will allow the s’te to carry. That it is now proposed to add two stories to a five storied building proves my contention. It is a waste of public money to put a three or four storied building on an expensive site whch would carry a seven or eight storied building, and provide floor-space economically. Nowadays, when a big steam-ship company or any other enterprising business concern is erecting city offices, it generally builds as high as the municipal regulations will permit. If they do not wish to use the whole of the building they let portion until it is required for their own purposes. Here is an example of what occurs in connexion with the so-called economies of government. When the building was first planned, a five-storied structure was contemplated, but it had not been roofed when it became evident that upon . such a valuable site a building of such a character would not be economical. The proposal was made, therefore, to add two additional/stories. It is not economical to place a roof upon a low building, in such circumstances, and then, only a few years afterwards, to take it off and build the structure higher. There was a similar experience in connexion with the great railway station in Sydney. I believe that the additions to that structure have ‘cost twice as much as would have been the case had they been made when the station was originally built. If one were to investigate the erection of Commonwealth buildings throughout the States, and to ascertain the additional costs involved by tinkering W.th those build. nas because the first plans had not been on a sufficiently elaborate scale, an enormous waste of public money would be revealed. Perth is -a big and a growing city. I agree with the honorable member for East Sydney (Mr. West) that the public buildings of the Commonwealth should be erected by optimists who have faith in the future of Australia, and whose optimism would rapidly prove the best form of economy.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

.- I indorse the remarks of the honorable member for Illawarra (Mr. Hector Lamond). The reason why the Perth postoffice was not originally erected as is now proposed rests with that gang which is attached to the Commonwealth Public Works Branch, and which is now ‘trying to ruin Canberra. Perth can claim something possessed bv no other city which I have ever visited. Owing to the genius of Mr. King O ‘Malley, the General Post Office in Perth has been built on the best possible site. The two great points of meeting in any metropolis are its central railway station and General Post Office. 1 know of no city in Australia or Great Britain where there is a junction of those two centres such as in Perth. The land upon which the General Post Office has been reared has been secured practically for nothing. The money spent thereon is returning’ at present more than 5 per cent. ; when I was in Perth the return amounted to between 6 per cent, and 7 per cent. Ultimately, the General Post Office site will prove to have cost the Commonwealth nothing, and when the proper structure shall have been reared there will be a huge revenue returning 7£ per cent, upon the original cost of the land. The sum of £50,000 involved in the buildin? of two additional stories is an expenditure which 1 consider wise, but it jars upon my mind that the work should not be open to public tender. I understand that the difficulty in this respect is due to the fact that the contractor is already in possession of the situation.

– The circumstances are analogous. The Commonwealth is fortunate in having such a gentleman in its employ as Mr. Murdoch.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

page 8438

QUESTION

TARIFF

In Committee of Ways and Means;

Consideration resumed f rem 11th May (vide page S308), on -motion by Mr.

Greene -

That duties of Customs and duties of Excise (vide page 726), first item, be imposed.

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

.- When I secured permission last evening to resume my remarks to-day, I was referring to the fact that Japan was the only country which had beaten the American Tobacco Combine. I propose to show as briefly as possible how this was done. It was during the RussoJapanese war, when the latter nation desired to borrow money, and found that a tobacco ‘ monopoly was a great asset! The Japanese approached the American Combine, which, however, would have nothing to do with the proposal. Thereupon the Government of Japan imposed a 50 per cent. duty. Still, the Combine did not care. Therefore, the Japanese authorities, within a year, imposed a duty of 100 per cent.; and still the Combine was perfectly happy. Next year came 150 per cent., and ultimately with a Tariff at 250 per cent., which obliged the Combine to pay a duty of £25 on cigars valued at £10 f.o.b. Hamburg, the Americans recognised that they would have to come to terms with the Japanese Government. Accordingly they approached that Government, but were informed that the Government- wished them to remain in business in Japan. The Government pointed out that several fair offers had been made to the Combine which they were not prepared to accept, and they could do no more in the matter. The Combine realized that, in the circumstances, they could not continue to carry on business in Japan, and determined to cut out all operations there. As the result the Japanese Government were in a position to buy, for a mere song, the buildings of the Combine and what machinery it did not pay to remove. To-day the Japanese are facing, with success, the competition of American Tobacco Combines from Vladivostock in the North to Bombay in the South, and are providing a cigarette equal to what is produced in any other part of the world.

Yesterday I claimed that the most uptodate Tariffs in the world were these of the United States of America and Japan.

I would like to see either adopted en bloc, with perhaps a few additional items relating to matters in which the East would naturally differ from the West. The figures showing the protection afforded to the Japanese cigar maker are startling. The duty on a box of cigars weighing 1£ lbs. and worth 20s. on board shio before landing is 15s. under our Tariff. But that is not the actual amount of protection afforded to the local cigar maker. We must also deduct from this 15s. the duty charged on the imported leaf and the amount of excise duty, which two items equal 6s. 9d. on the lj lb. box. The net protection afforded to the local cigarmaker is therefore only 8s. 5d. on that box of cigars. On a box of cigars of the same value the Japanese cigar maker is protected by a duty of £3 lis., and on a box of cigars of the same weight worth ls. each on board ship before landing the protection afforded to him is £17 15s., the duty in Japan being 355 per cent, ad valorem.

Mr Foley:

– The Japanese must be Prohibitionists. 1

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

– As the Japanese Government have a monopoly of tobacco it comes in free so far as they are concerned. Otherwise the duty is to all intents and purposes prohibitive.

In discussing Protection we cannot have a better illustration than a box of matches. In Great Britain the women and children who are employed at match making, mostly in their homes, receive 2£d. for making a gross of match boxes, and they are obliged to find their own paste. In 1902 I visited Japan, and I wrote a small book describing my visit, in which I said -

In . the year 1902 Japan manufactured 328,806.090 grogs of matches at a cost of 8,608,571 yen. Beckoning one yen at 2s. - the actual value is 2s. 0½d.-this works out at a trifle over f of a penny (.635d.) per gross. In face of these figures, it seems that even Scandinavia must shortly surrender the business of match making absolutely to Japan.

What is the use of a duty of 100 per cent., or even 1,000 per cent., on matches when Japanese workers are prepared to make and fill a gross of matchboxes for a little over one halfpenny?

I am proud of the speech delivered yesterday by the Minister -for Trade and Customs (Mr. Greene). I am sure it will be quoted a great deal in the future. The aftermath of the terrible war makes it absolutely necessary to have a real Tariff for Australia. . For twenty years the two walls of this chamber have rung with thespeeches of Protectionists, but in this twenty years we have not had a real uptodate Tariff. Even that which theMinister has brought in is not as perfect as either the United States’ or’ the Japanese Tariff. Australia must manufacture all its needs’. It is time we became proud of our country. We held our own in the most terrible ordeal a nation can undergo, but we are not manufacturing commodities as we should be doing. We are told that some wool and skins are to be burnt to get rid .of them.

Mr Jowett:

– We are getting that wool made into twine. Did not I show the honorable member a sample?

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

I hope that we shall protect the local manufacturer of thread, who is putting out a splendid article. With a duty of 10 per cent, on fancy cotton goods he will be able to compete with such firms as J. and P. Coats Limited. In a circular issued by the secretary of the Industrial Protectionist League, it is said that the Age, in its issue of 11th November, 1919, reported that -

The company of J. and P. Coats Limited, the firm which makes the thread that is used by weary and worn fingers in many . a humble dwelling, made last year a profit of £3,8!)9,38S. After the payment of the “ excess profits tax” - surely the impost is a tragic joke! - the holders of ordinary shares received a dividend of 40 per’ cent., while £2,200,288 was carried forward, making the reserve funds £11,000,000. It is understood that the ordinary shareholders are also receiving a share bonus of 100 per cent.

According to this circular it was further stated by the Age, in its issue of 13th November, 1919, that-

The directors of J. and P. Coats Limited are seeking the authority of the shareholders to capitalize £10.250,000 of the company’s reserves, thereby raising the total capital to £20.250.000. They point out that this scheme if adopted would not increase the earnings of thu country, but it “ would reduce the apparently high dividends which the public is adversely criticising.”

If the directors of this company ever go to the place where the wings are served out I hope they will have to carry that money in gold. If they do they will not fly far. The profits made by the company of recent years are as follows: -

These huge profits , were wrung during the war from nearly every human being on God’s earth. Why the British Government did not. follow the example set them by the elder Pitt, who, during the Napoleonic wars, impounded” a large amount of the capital of such companies, I cannot understand.

As I understand that the Minister (Mr. . Greene) desires that the general debate shall close this evening, I shall not delay the Committee any longer. I trust that the honorable gentleman will stand firmly by the duties for which .be has provided. If he does what, having regard to the splendid speech he made last night, one is constrained to believe he will do, he will have my sincere admiration.

Mr ROBERT COOK:
INDI, VICTORIA · VFU; CP from 1920

.- While I can hardly go to the extent to which the honorable member for Melbourne (Dr. Maloney) is prepared to go in his support of this Tariff, I stand pledged to give reasonable protection to secondary industries, believing, as I do, that it is highly necessary for primary production to be followed by secondary production. Last night we heard a lecture on the Northern Territory, and were told that the chief industry in that great area, embracing as it does some 520,000 square miles, is pastoral. It was also stated that the pastoral industry may be followed up successfully by mining, and that to make both reasonably successful’ it is necessary to have a railway. I cannot see that Protection can give any great assistance to these three great interests for a considerable time to come. In Queensland, I understand, there are some 41^,000,000 acres of land, not more than 20,000,000 of which are alienated, while the population is smaller than that of Melbourne. There, again, we see the necessity for primary production, and the opening up of our great resources. In Australia we require at least another 5.000.000 people. To place those people, if they come here, in our cities would mean ruin, but picked, desirable settlers., with a knowledge of their business from an agricultural stand-point, placed on the land, would prove one of Australia’s greatest assets. There are some 500.000 acres of stations in New South Wales and part of Queensland that are now being subdivided for closer settlement. In view of that large scheme of settlement, and of the great acreage of the Northern Territory and Queensland, it is ‘ highly necessary that our settlers should be given all the assistance within our power. Included amongst those are 22.000 in soldier, settlements, who mainly produce butter, wheat, wool, and meat; and it is highly necessary that the producers of these commodities should be able to procure their tools of production at the most reasonable price, and provided with railways and roads. Here,, again, I fail to see how an excessive Tariff can be of much assistance for years to come.

The dairying industry has been a great benefit to Australia in the past, and we trust it may be even more beneficial in the future. For eight months during the sale of our butter to’ the Imperial Government, if I mistake not, the “amount received in return was some £10,000,000. That was without any assistance from the Tariff, as the world’s market very largely regulates the price of the product. The dairying industry is simply in its infancy, and as various byproducts are now under scientific investigation, it is one to which assistance might be given with great benefit to the country at large.. Another great industry is the woollen industry, which for many years prior to the war returned to Australia some £32,000,000 per annum. I fail to see why we are not converting more than 8$ per cent, of .this, our own wool, into manufactured goods. It is not Protection that this industry requires, but something quite apart from Protection. Our wool is taken Home and brought back manufactured; and hitherto we have been supplying Germany with wool for manufacture into clothing, while our own people have been practically idle. The woollen industry is probably one of the greatest in Australia, and if £32,000,000 worth or thereabouts, of our wool were converted into textiles here, that figure, would be increased ‘to over £70,000,000, while employment would be given to 140,000 workers, representing the sustenance of about 500,000 people. The food alone required for the Upkeep of that army of men and women would run to over £12,000,000 a year; and it is here that the farmer would benefit. But still I do not see that to this particular industry Protection can give any great assistance. There are- other industries, however, to which, no doubt, Protection is highly necessary. As a young country we -must develop our secondary industries along with the primary; and to that end there must certainly be fair and reasonable Protection, which I, as a member of the House, am prepared to extend. There are industries that the war has proved necessary to us, not only as a means -of employment, but as a source of defence. The war has brought to light many inventions that would not have been thought of for many years to come ; let us not lose sight of the valuable information thus given, but take, time by the forelock. I feel sure that honorable members in this corner will give all reasonable assistance to those industries that afford tangible proof of requiring it.

The primary producer, as I have already stated, depends largely on the world’s market for the sale of his produce. It is very different with the manufacturer, who has the advantage of Wages Board awards and Arbitration Court findings, and who. also has the happy knack of not only adding to his price the cost of any such findings, but a considerable amount in addition, while the unprotected consumer pays ‘ all the time. I am sure the Minister will keep his eye on this “aspect of the question. I am pleased-to hear that the Minister has in his mind the appointment of a scientific Board in order that moves of the kind indicated may be watched. If that is not done, there will be continual clamour for Protection, Protection, Protection, as in the past, and the helpless consumer will in all cases pay -the piper. The high wages awarded by Wages Boards and Arbitration Courts in certain industries are draining the country of farmers’ sons. We cannot possibly expect a farmer’s son to remain on the land, for 30s. to £2 per week and his keep, when he can get over double that pay in a manufacturing establishment, with shorter hours, better opportunities for recreation, and sports in every direction. If we get the flood of immigration which we hope and look for, and there is no wise supervision in order that the immigrants may be kept out of the cities and placed in their proper vocation in life, it will prove’ a greater menace than a benefit. We shall simply become a manufacturing community regulated by Wages Boards and Arbitration Courts, which must break down from their very artificiality, if from nothing else.

The Minister did not say straight out that this is really not a protective but a revenue Tariff, which he asks our assistance to push through because the Government requires’ the money, and then promise that at the earliest possible moment, when the finances allow, he will revise it; he believed that it would have a speedy passage. But that it is a revenue Tariff is proved by the fact that the Customs receipts for the year ending 31st March were £32,072,408, equal to a tax of 6s. 3d. per head of our population. Yet certain members of the House are continually crying down the profiteer as the cause of the high cost of living, though the demands of the Customs House are largely responsible for the cost.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– That is only another way of saying that the war is responsible.

Mr ROBERT COOK:
INDI, VICTORIA · VFU; CP from 1920

– The war is not responsible for the squandering of money on Yass-Canberra ; it is not responsible for the building of the Commonwealth Bank at a cost of over £200,000, which might have been delayed for three or four years, when probably it would have cost £30,000 or £40,000 less.

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

– It has not cost us that amount.

Mr ROBERT COOK:
INDI, VICTORIA · VFU; CP from 1920

– The war is not responsible for our increasing our own salaries by 66 per cent.; it is not responsible for the duplication of the Taxation Departments; it is not responsible for thousands of pounds squandered in a hundred and one directions to which I have not now time to refer.

We have 3,000,000 square miles of territory peopled by just over 5,000,000 people. The United States of America have a population of 111,000,000 on an area not as large as Australia. Our continent is fourteen times larger than Germany, which has a population of 68,000,000. We have twenty-seven times the area of Italy, which has a population of 36,000,000. Australia has an area equal to two-fifths of the whole area of South America, where there are 88,000,000 people. I have been a Protectionist all my life, and I dp not see. my way to alter my opinion now; but these facts prove to me, wrong as I may be, that the brains and intelligence of this House should be concentrated on the opening up and development of the great resources of this young continent, for otherwise we cannot possibly expect to hold it.

In regard to machinery I have quite a sheaf of information; but the honorable member for Dumpier (Mr. Gregory) has, in my honest opinion, pretty well covered that branch of the subject - though, perhaps a little on the low Tariff side - in one of the ablest speeches yet made on the Tariff. That honorable member gave the House the fullest information he could collect, after months of work, and presented a most comprehensive view of the position as it is to-day. Under the circumstances, I do not propose to traverse the same ground, but merely to refer to one or two items, particularly with reference to the machinery industry in Canada. Canadian workmen are higher paid than Australian. On the other hand, the Australian manufacturer secures his raw materials at prices equal to or even less than those of the Canadian manufacturer. With all these advantages in his favour, it would be reasonable to expect the Australian manufacturer, if he is efficient in his methods of production, and satisfied with a reasonable profit, to produce and sell the machines he manufactures at about the same price at which the Canadian manufacturer sells similar machines in Canada. The following table, showing the prices of representative farm machines in Canada and Australia, will not only indicate the disadvantage under which the Australian farmer labours, but also the advantage the Australian manufacturer has taken of the opportunity both distance and the Tariff have given him to feather his own nest:-

As a farmer who knows something about agricultural machinery, I hold the view that the difference between the price of reapers and binders in Canada and their price in Australia is excessive, and so with many other articles on this list. I hope, therefore, that members will not agree to every item without inquiry. We ought not to build up Combines in Australia to the advantage of a few individuals; our object should be to secure fair treatment for the whole of the community. The fact that the Tariff schedule, as a whole, is calculated to produce a magnificent revenue is not an argument for its acceptance, because if money is not obtained in this way it must be got from some other source, and it is for honorable members to determine whether there would be any gain in that.

Mr.G regory. - Let us tax luxuries more.

Mr ROBERT COOK:
INDI, VICTORIA · VFU; CP from 1920

– I am prepared to put a prohibitive tax on luxuries, or, rather, I would make the tax on them similar to that on farming machinery, which is practically prohibitive. I am sure that honorable members will do their best to makethe Tariff as nearly scientific as is possible under the circumstances. I trust that the proposed Board will be in no sense political, and will be composed of independent, brainy men, who will do their duty honestly.

Item (ale and other beer, porter, cider, and perry, spirituous) agreed to.

Progress reported.

page 8444

PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE

Resignation of Mr. Atkinson

Mr. DEPUTY SPEAKER (Hon.J. M. Chanter) reported, the receipt of a letter from the honorable member for Wilmot (Mr. Atkinson) tendering his resignation as a member of the Public Works Committee.

page 8444

ADJOURNMENT

Silver Coinage

Motion (by Sir Joseph Cook) proposed - The House do now adjourn.

Mr WEST:
East Sydney

– There is a sub ject to which I should have referred when speaking on the grievance motionhad the Treasurer been present, but he was absent in theperformanceof duties elsewhere, and, of course, is not to be blamed for that. This afternoon I addressed to him a series of questions relating to silver coinage, but they did not appear on the notice paper exactly as I wrote them. Perhaps it would be better to give notice of them again in the form in which they were originally drafted. The coins to which I referred were, in my opinion, counterfeit, and they were obtained, not in one business place, but in two. They were part of some coinage got from the Imperial Government b ecause of the great demand for silver created by the return of our soldiers. There was not sufficient in Australia at the time to conduct ordinary business. I know that these coins came from the Imperial mint, and, if possible, I shall endeavour to get some like them. They were tested with acid, and proved to contain a certain quantity of zinc. Any person having to do with money would conclude, as I did, that they did not contain 90 per cent. of fine silver. The Treasurer was correct in his statement that the coinage of 1920 contained the right proportion of silver, because that money was coined in Australia, but the money to which I referred was not. coined here. I referred to it as “dated 1920,” but other words were used in printing my question which placed a different meaning on it. I make this explanation in justice to myself, to show that the questions were not frivolous and thatI knew what I was talking about.

Questions resolved in the affirmative.

House adjourned at 10.40 p.m.

Cite as: Australia, House of Representatives, Debates, 12 May 1921, viewed 22 October 2017, <http://historichansard.net/hofreps/1921/19210512_reps_8_95/>.

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House of Representatives12 May 1921

QUESTION

MR. JUSTICE HIGGINS

Mr BLAKELEY:DARLING, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

MISTAKES IN TELEGRAMS

Mr WISE:Postmaster-General · GIPPSLAND, VICTORIA · NAT

SYDNEY-MELBOURNE TELEPHONE LINE

OVERSEAS MAIL CONTRACT: PAPER

Mr WISE:NAT

Mr WISE:PostmasterGeneral · Gippsland · NAT

Mr HIGGS:CAPRICORNIA, QUEENSLAND

Mr WISE:

Mr MAKIN:HINDMARSH, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:WAKEFIELD, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · ANTI-SOC; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917; LP from 1922; NAT from 1925

Mr MAKIN:

Mr WISE:

QUESTION

WAR GRATUITY BONDS

Mr McGRATH:BALLAARAT, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

SHIPBUILDING

Mr WATKINS:NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

COCKATOO ISLAND ROYAL COMMISSION

Dr MALONEY:MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

Mr LAIRD SMITH:Minister for the Navy · DENISON, TASMANIA · NAT

QUESTION

WAR SERVICE HOMES

Mr BLUNDELL:ADELAIDE, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

Mr RODGERS:WANNON, VICTORIA · LP; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

ALLOWANCE POST OFFICES

Mr NICHOLLS:MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr WISE:NAT

Mr Nicholls:

CONSTITUTION CONVENTION

Mr FENTON:MARIBYRNONG, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr FENTON:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr Considine:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

IMPORTATION OF LITERATURE

Mr ANSTEY:BOURKE, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr ANSTEY:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

CONDUCT OF BRITISH TROOPS

Mr McGRATH:

Sir GRANVILLE RYRIE:Assistant Minister for Defence · NORTH SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · NAT

QUESTION

WAR SERVICE HOMES

Dr MALONEY:MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

Mr RODGERS:WANNON, VICTORIA · LP; NAT from 1917

QUESTION

IMPERIAL CONFERENCE

Mr J H CATTS:COOK, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr J H Catts:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr J H Catts:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr J H Catts:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

TARIFF DEBATE

Rights of Honorable Members

Mr WATKINS:NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP; FLP from 1931

Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER (Hon J M Chanter:RIVERINA, NEW SOUTH WALES

QUESTION

COCKATOO ISLANDDOCK YARD

Mr J H CATTS:

Sir JOSEPH COOK:Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr Riley:

House of Representatives
12 May 1921

Mr BLAKELEY:
DARLING, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr WISE:
Postmaster-General · GIPPSLAND, VICTORIA · NAT

Mr WISE:
NAT

Mr WISE:
PostmasterGeneral · Gippsland · NAT

Mr HIGGS:
CAPRICORNIA, QUEENSLAND

Mr MAKIN:
HINDMARSH, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

Mr RICHARD FOSTER:
WAKEFIELD, SOUTH AUSTRALIA · ANTI-SOC; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917; LP from 1922; NAT from 1925

Mr McGRATH:
BALLAARAT, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr WATKINS:
NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

Mr LAIRD SMITH:
Minister for the Navy · DENISON, TASMANIA · NAT

Mr BLUNDELL:
ADELAIDE, SOUTH AUSTRALIA

Mr RODGERS:
WANNON, VICTORIA · LP; NAT from 1917

Mr NICHOLLS:
MACQUARIE, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr WISE:
NAT

Mr FENTON:
MARIBYRNONG, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr ANSTEY:
BOURKE, VICTORIA

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir GRANVILLE RYRIE:
Assistant Minister for Defence · NORTH SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES · NAT

Dr MALONEY:
MELBOURNE, VICTORIA · ALP; FLP from 1931; ALP from 1936

Mr RODGERS:
WANNON, VICTORIA · LP; NAT from 1917

Mr J H CATTS:
COOK, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr WATKINS:
NEWCASTLE, NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP; FLP from 1931

Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER (Hon J M Chanter:
RIVERINA, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

Mr FLEMING:
ROBERTSON, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr WISE:
NAT

Mr WEST:
EAST SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr CHARLTON:
HUNTER, NEW SOUTH WALES

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir GRANVILLE RYRIE:
NAT

Dr EARLE PAGE:
COWPER, NEW SOUTH WALES · FSU; CP from 1920

Mr GREENE:
RICHMOND, NEW SOUTH WALES · LP; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr GROOM:
Minister for Works and Railways · DARLING DOWNS, QUEENSLAND · NAT

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Sir JOSEPH COOK:
Treasurer · PARRAMATTA, NEW SOUTH WALES · FT; ANTI-SOC from 1906; LP from 1910; NAT from 1917

Mr MATHEWS:
Melbourne Ports

Mr McGRATH:
BALLAARAT, VICTORIA · ALP; UAP from 1931

Mr BAYLEY:
Oxley

Mr MAKIN:
Hindmarsh